Hi guys o/
This is rather long to explain, so I'll say it in a very short way before explaining it all: as France, I attacked England for a claim on a duchy while my vassal the duke of Normandy, William, was already at war with them. I sieged successfully a county but occupation warscore is still at 0%. When I hover over it, I see that there is an extremely long list of occupation score events based on the Normandy-England war plus the one holding I besieged myself, which makes +130,69% for me and -99,49% for England (image at the end of the post), but I neither have +31,2% as I should according to this, nore +8,87% from the one holding I besieged myself, but this arbitrary 0% from nowhere.
Why ?
How can I win war and what should I do ?
Long story instead :
So right now I’m playing a campaign with France (I’ve noticed in all my other campaigns starting in 1066 that the Capet were dethroned pretty quickly by factions and that France usually exploded in several states, so even if I’m not fan of playing powerful entities I wanted to see if I could overcome these difficulties). Game started pretty well with me defending successfully against the HRE in their de jure war for some random county in Flanders, and in the following years I’ve started expanding in Brittany and in northern Spain, maintaining good relations with my vassals, forging interesting alliances with weddings, and reinforcing my personal power.
As I usually do in the 1066 start, I kept an eye on the war raging on in England, and for the very first time something pretty unexpected happened: no one seemed to be winning and they seemed to be completely stuck with no being able to take a decisive lead. After over 10 years of endless war, the 3 sides were very weak, and I started thinking about taking advantage of this unusual situation. I couldn’t obviously support William’s claim on England, else he became independent, but I was able to invite a courtier with a strong claim an English duchy (Lancaster), so I gave him a barony I just conquered in Spain and pressed his claim. But here came the real, unexpected mess.
Norway was stuck with around 70% warscore, but was unable to push their advantage any further since they were ruined and has now less soldiers than England. England had a 60% warscore on Normandy and had sieged pretty much all of Normandy, but had lost a lot of counties in England to William. I actually wasn’t sure what would happen if I liberated the Normand holdings and if the warscore would go to me, to William or to both of us, so I preferred to take my troops into England and siege down a county in my target duchy (Chester). On the way in, I crushed a small English army, getting 7% warscore, which fell to 5% due to ticking warscore by the time I ended up my first siege. I won it, and bam, warscore was at 7% again, no more ticking warscore but still 7% due to battle, and 0% due to occupation. I hovered on the 0% to know what the fuck was going on and then I saw the most unexpected stack of numbers I’ve ever seen in the game. There was TONS of +4/5/6/7 and -4/5/6/7 due to the war of William (remember he controls 5 counties or so in England, and England controls the same amount of counties in Normandy). And there was also a +8,87% for the holding I just besieged. But the total was still 0% according to the game. Quite amazed, I made the calculation, and this makes +130,69% for me (including the holding I besieged myself), and -99,49% for what he holds in Normandy. And all of this is written but the total is still 0% while if I live in the same world this is +31,20%
So I don’t understand ANYTHING there. Looking for answers, I’ve read old posts on this forum saying that if you and one of your vassal is at war against the same enemy the holdings they occupy go in your occupation warscore, so I could understand why the game would count the occupation warscore of William’s war in my warscore (this would make sense, if Normandy controls 5 counties in England France kinda controls them, and if England controls 5 counties in Normandy, this means they control 5 counties in France) but that would make 31,20%. I could also understand that this doesn’t count because it happened before I declared war… but then I want my own warscore due to my sieging, which should be at 8,87% right now, not 0%… The only reason I’d see to explain why my occupation warscore is at 0% is that I have too much negative occupation score for the positive score to be taken into account (some kind of mechanic which would be that you cannot have positive warscore if you have under -50%, even if this is balanced by a +100% on the other side). But I’ve read nothing similar anywhere.
So, first question is: what the fuck is going on there? Can anyone explain it to me?
Other question is about what I can do and what would happen in several scenarios:
- first option is to siege all of the holdings in the duchy and do something else while I wait for the ticking warscore to grant me the win, and do something else during this time. But well… I don’t know how long this may take.
- second option is to get 75% from battles and to wait for ticking warscore for the remaining 25%. But I can’t do this, because if I destroy all the armies of England, William may win his war and become independent. Or more likely Norway would win and I guess that would create even more mess.
- third option is to assassinate William, even if he’s my best general, so his war ends inconclusively and I can lead a regular war against England… But I’m actually not even sure this would work or what would happen (would I keep what he sieged in England or not, and would England keep what they sieged in Normandy or not ?)…
- fourth option is to siege back everything in Normandy. That seems very logical to do so but I’m afraid this would be of no use because well… things aren’t very logical right there.
Is there anything else I could do ?
This made me wonder on other problems:
- What happens if William dies of natural death?
- If the King of Norway wins the war and becomes king of England, William’s war will end inconclusively but mine will follow its path against Harald, isn’t it ? Then, since the game considers all the sieging from the Normandy-England war to be part of my war as well as part of their war (even if they bring 0% warscore), will Harald still occupy Normandy because England did, and will William still occupy parts of England?
Sorry for the very long post. I actually spent more time trying to figure out what happened than playing this campaign so I’m a bit frustrated right now ^^.
And thanks to anyone who could answer to just one of my questions!
Edit: I added some pictures to make it easier to understand. That also makes some kind of a well needed TL;DR.
Edit 2 : As I'm not sure that everyone can see the pictures, here is a link : http://imgur.com/a/nlErt
This is rather long to explain, so I'll say it in a very short way before explaining it all: as France, I attacked England for a claim on a duchy while my vassal the duke of Normandy, William, was already at war with them. I sieged successfully a county but occupation warscore is still at 0%. When I hover over it, I see that there is an extremely long list of occupation score events based on the Normandy-England war plus the one holding I besieged myself, which makes +130,69% for me and -99,49% for England (image at the end of the post), but I neither have +31,2% as I should according to this, nore +8,87% from the one holding I besieged myself, but this arbitrary 0% from nowhere.
Why ?
How can I win war and what should I do ?
Long story instead :
So right now I’m playing a campaign with France (I’ve noticed in all my other campaigns starting in 1066 that the Capet were dethroned pretty quickly by factions and that France usually exploded in several states, so even if I’m not fan of playing powerful entities I wanted to see if I could overcome these difficulties). Game started pretty well with me defending successfully against the HRE in their de jure war for some random county in Flanders, and in the following years I’ve started expanding in Brittany and in northern Spain, maintaining good relations with my vassals, forging interesting alliances with weddings, and reinforcing my personal power.
As I usually do in the 1066 start, I kept an eye on the war raging on in England, and for the very first time something pretty unexpected happened: no one seemed to be winning and they seemed to be completely stuck with no being able to take a decisive lead. After over 10 years of endless war, the 3 sides were very weak, and I started thinking about taking advantage of this unusual situation. I couldn’t obviously support William’s claim on England, else he became independent, but I was able to invite a courtier with a strong claim an English duchy (Lancaster), so I gave him a barony I just conquered in Spain and pressed his claim. But here came the real, unexpected mess.
Norway was stuck with around 70% warscore, but was unable to push their advantage any further since they were ruined and has now less soldiers than England. England had a 60% warscore on Normandy and had sieged pretty much all of Normandy, but had lost a lot of counties in England to William. I actually wasn’t sure what would happen if I liberated the Normand holdings and if the warscore would go to me, to William or to both of us, so I preferred to take my troops into England and siege down a county in my target duchy (Chester). On the way in, I crushed a small English army, getting 7% warscore, which fell to 5% due to ticking warscore by the time I ended up my first siege. I won it, and bam, warscore was at 7% again, no more ticking warscore but still 7% due to battle, and 0% due to occupation. I hovered on the 0% to know what the fuck was going on and then I saw the most unexpected stack of numbers I’ve ever seen in the game. There was TONS of +4/5/6/7 and -4/5/6/7 due to the war of William (remember he controls 5 counties or so in England, and England controls the same amount of counties in Normandy). And there was also a +8,87% for the holding I just besieged. But the total was still 0% according to the game. Quite amazed, I made the calculation, and this makes +130,69% for me (including the holding I besieged myself), and -99,49% for what he holds in Normandy. And all of this is written but the total is still 0% while if I live in the same world this is +31,20%
So I don’t understand ANYTHING there. Looking for answers, I’ve read old posts on this forum saying that if you and one of your vassal is at war against the same enemy the holdings they occupy go in your occupation warscore, so I could understand why the game would count the occupation warscore of William’s war in my warscore (this would make sense, if Normandy controls 5 counties in England France kinda controls them, and if England controls 5 counties in Normandy, this means they control 5 counties in France) but that would make 31,20%. I could also understand that this doesn’t count because it happened before I declared war… but then I want my own warscore due to my sieging, which should be at 8,87% right now, not 0%… The only reason I’d see to explain why my occupation warscore is at 0% is that I have too much negative occupation score for the positive score to be taken into account (some kind of mechanic which would be that you cannot have positive warscore if you have under -50%, even if this is balanced by a +100% on the other side). But I’ve read nothing similar anywhere.
So, first question is: what the fuck is going on there? Can anyone explain it to me?
Other question is about what I can do and what would happen in several scenarios:
- first option is to siege all of the holdings in the duchy and do something else while I wait for the ticking warscore to grant me the win, and do something else during this time. But well… I don’t know how long this may take.
- second option is to get 75% from battles and to wait for ticking warscore for the remaining 25%. But I can’t do this, because if I destroy all the armies of England, William may win his war and become independent. Or more likely Norway would win and I guess that would create even more mess.
- third option is to assassinate William, even if he’s my best general, so his war ends inconclusively and I can lead a regular war against England… But I’m actually not even sure this would work or what would happen (would I keep what he sieged in England or not, and would England keep what they sieged in Normandy or not ?)…
- fourth option is to siege back everything in Normandy. That seems very logical to do so but I’m afraid this would be of no use because well… things aren’t very logical right there.
Is there anything else I could do ?
This made me wonder on other problems:
- What happens if William dies of natural death?
- If the King of Norway wins the war and becomes king of England, William’s war will end inconclusively but mine will follow its path against Harald, isn’t it ? Then, since the game considers all the sieging from the Normandy-England war to be part of my war as well as part of their war (even if they bring 0% warscore), will Harald still occupy Normandy because England did, and will William still occupy parts of England?
Sorry for the very long post. I actually spent more time trying to figure out what happened than playing this campaign so I’m a bit frustrated right now ^^.
And thanks to anyone who could answer to just one of my questions!
Edit: I added some pictures to make it easier to understand. That also makes some kind of a well needed TL;DR.
Edit 2 : As I'm not sure that everyone can see the pictures, here is a link : http://imgur.com/a/nlErt
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