Numbers sold.

[Grubnessul]

Ehm... this is not about anti-Trust (that's how they call it in the USA btw, in Europe it's Competition law) old art. 81 EC (now 101 TFEU), but abuse of a dominant position old art. 82 EC (now 102 TFEU)

Article 102
(ex Article 82 TEC)
Any abuse by one or more undertakings of a dominant position within the internal market or in a
substantial part of it shall be prohibited as incompatible with the internal market in so far as it may
affect trade between Member States.
Such abuse may, in particular, consist in:
(a) directly or indirectly imposing unfair purchase or selling prices or other unfair trading conditions;
(b) limiting production, markets or technical development to the prejudice of consumers;
(c) applying dissimilar conditions to equivalent transactions with other trading parties, thereby
placing them at a competitive disadvantage;
(d) making the conclusion of contracts subject to acceptance by the other parties of supplementary
obligations which, by their nature or according to commercial usage, have no connection with the
subject of such contracts.

Edit: as I said, it's a question of defining the market, is there a separate market for paradox games or are they part of a bigger market for (strategy) games? And there is also always an aspect of market share that you'll have to take into account when answering these kinds of questions.

 

[Snall]

Just think of this Sult- it's vertical not horizontal business. Also I love this forum.

 

[unmerged(63310)]

Just think of this Sult- it's vertical not horizontal business. Also I love this forum.

Yeah, some interesting tangents but gets me to learn something new. Had to look up this for myself.

I believe Paradox does get more money from electronic distribution just because of cost savings from less middlemen and the cost of packaging, shipment etc. It wouldn't make sense to prefer that otherwise. How much more... I doubt Paradox or most companies would make that public knowledge.

 

[unmerged(150564)]

Are you giving a copy to me?

NIEN! >.<!

1 Copy for me, 1 copy for GF, 1 copy to my father and the other one is for my spare steam account in case one of my mates comes over for a lan and wants to pitch in.(I have 2 steam accounts with the same amount of stuff on it for that reason.)

And can we not debate retarded EU or US or any laws for that matter please that is not what this thread was about. Thank you.

 

[Sult]

Just think of this Sult- it's vertical not horizontal business. Also I love this forum.

The law applies to both horizontal and vertical businesses.

 

[sbr]

NIEN! >.<!

1 Copy for me, 1 copy for GF, 1 copy to my father and the other one is for my spare steam account in case one of my mates comes over for a lan and wants to pitch in.(I have 2 steam accounts with the same amount of stuff on it for that reason.)

And can we not debate retarded EU or US or any laws for that matter please that is not what this thread was about. Thank you.

Can we discuss whether or not Steam is a good platform to buy Paradox games on?

IMO it is not, they seem to have serious problems getting patches and expansion packs working properly on third party titles, particularly PI titles. YMMV.

 

[Snall]

The law applies to both horizontal and vertical businesses.

Were you not using the world cartel alot? Maybe that was someone else.

 

[Grubnessul]

Cartels can be both horizontal and vertical. Paradox - Gamersgate is a horizontal relation.

 

[unmerged(174694)]

NIEN! >.<!

I have 2 steam accounts with the same amount of stuff on it for that reason.

Wow that is affluence...!

 

[Snaggleooo]

I'm not sure how a thread about how many Vicky2's need to be sold for Frederik's hair to go degenerated into a debate about EU economic laws. Only on the PI forums.

 

[unmerged(150564)]

Wow that is affluence...!

Nah i usually wait untill they are on special or buy the 4 pack with my mates which in turn means its cheaper anyway. (GF pays for hers.)

I'm not sure how a thread about how many Vicky2's need to be sold for Frederik's hair to go degenerated into a debate about EU economic laws. Only on the PI forums.

Yes, i too am confused about how my curiosity to see a bald swedish man turned into a raging debate about economic laws and policys....

 

[Starforge]

Can we discuss whether or not Steam is a good platform to buy Paradox games on?

IMO it is not, they seem to have serious problems getting patches and expansion packs working properly on third party titles, particularly PI titles. YMMV.

Can't speak to every game you can buy on Steam, but in EU3's case, install game - come here to download patch (or in this case beta patch for EU3) and done. I run Magna Mundi so I remove the default link to the executeable on the desktop and link to the usual startup window instead so I can select the mod, but it works fine.

Steam works for me both online and offline for every game I have bought from them (and that's counting up to quite a few now.) I understand that others have had some issues and also that some people just react poorly to having something installed on their computer that takes resources. I have a very good computer with plenty of memory so it has never been an issue. I'm well beyond reaching that point where it's just easier to use Steam, Gamersgate or Impulse to pick up games rather than clutter up the house with boxes and CD's.

 

[telesien]

Having a bar, where you sell beer, is also an undertaking.

A company can charge different prices to different customers, nothing to do with cartels.

IIRC you wrote somewhere you are lawyer. I don't know how this works in Netherlands, but in Czech republic we apparently have different rules. Some people were fined even for student discounts or discounts for local people (citizens of that specific town). And I'm not even talking about cases where racism can be brought out...

 

[Grubnessul]

Veldmaarschalk is a lawyer too?

 

[morganja]

I was looking forward to Victoria 2, and despite the myriad of problems with Vic 1, I was prepared to buy it at launch. But then HOI3 happened.
I've bought, and been burnt by every game they have put out since EU1. But HOI3 was such an insulting disaster that they have no more loyalty from me anymore. I really hope they prove me wrong with Vic2. I would love to buy the game. But it has to work.

 

[unmerged(66950)]

Numbers sold

Hmm... Well i am buying 4 copys.... EVERYONE PITCH IN AND DO YA PART!

Well, they are going to sell one less, since they took out the historical leaders. And I was a sure sale, until I learned about the deletion of the leaders.

 

[Poleaxe]

IIRC you wrote somewhere you are lawyer. I don't know how this works in Netherlands, but in Czech republic we apparently have different rules. Some people were fined even for student discounts or discounts for local people (citizens of that specific town). And I'm not even talking about cases where racism can be brought out...

Seems rather silly. Do yo not have things like senior citizen discounts or military discounts?

 

[Snall]

Cartels can be both horizontal and vertical. Paradox - Gamersgate is a horizontal relation.

...eh, I'm gonna stick with vertical. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/Vertical+Integration

See? Where as Horizontal would be perhaps Paradox making applications or an operating system. Something software.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/horizontal+Integration?o=100074

And my point on cartels was that it isn't a cartel..since there would be no price fixing to the consumer's end...

 

[telesien]

Seems rather silly. Do yo not have things like senior citizen discounts or military discounts?

Well yes, but if the anti-monopol bureau decides that you use it incorrectly (and noone can understand how they exactly decide that) you are in trouble. Even towns got fines like that. It is just huge mess and the reason why I brought it here is to show how different countries can have very different laws.

 

[Grubnessul]

Well, they are going to sell one less, since they took out the historical leaders. And I was a sure sale, until I learned about the deletion of the leaders.

Wait, you're going not to buy a game over a few people with the same name as in our history?

...eh, I'm gonna stick with vertical. http://dictionary.reference.com/brow...al+Integration

See? Where as Horizontal would be perhaps Paradox making applications or an operating system. Something software.

http://dictionary.reference.com/brow...ation?o=100074

And my point on cartels was that it isn't a cartel..since there would be no price fixing to the consumer's end...

Yes, you're right, I meant vertical indeed, my mistake.