Number of empires per map size?

[Uncle_Joe]

I’m sure this has been asked before but I was unable to find any real answers in a quick search so…


How many AIs/players are recommended for each map size? I started my first game on the smallest map and it had 2 AIs as ‘default’ (preselected on the slider) so I went with that. But the map is awfully empty and it seems like I have a ton of room to expand. I’m 80 years into the game and I’m way out ahead of the other two in territory (and presumably economy).


I will likely restart a new game when the Clarke patch hits (hopefully this week!). I would like to have some sort of more populated feel to the map but I don’t want it to be exclusively ‘conquer or die’.


So are there any ‘official’ (or even unofficial) recommendations for number of empires per map size?


If this info is readily available somewhere, I apologize for the redundant question and ask that you kindly point me in the right direction.


Thanks in advance!

 

[IIWW]

In general I feel ok with the default option, although I have never played on "Tiny" map. Maybe this issue is specific to this size only?

 

[is_a_cdr]

Defaults are a bit sparse for my taste. My last game was on small (600 edit: 400) map with max number of AIs (15, I think) - and that I enjoyed.

 

[naisel]

I started my first (and only) game with 20 AIs in the largest galaxy, I wanted a game with a longer exploratory phase and that's what I got, but now that I am 170 years in it does feel a bit empty; there are still large pockets of unclaimed territory, and I'm better than the AI in expanding strategically.

 

[CocoCincinnati]

I have settled on 800 stars/15 AI empires. Although I notice that I always have at least one AI empire close by and I kept hoping that I would eventually get a start where I have plenty of room to explore....so I did some testing and had to go all the way down to 6 AI empires before I ended up with a start with nobody close to me. I wonder if there is a certain chance of having AI's appearing near the player or if it's all just random. Anyway, 15 spread out evenly should give everybody plenty of growing space. Of course it all depends on what woks best for you. I like the exploration part of the game so 15 empires works for me. If you prefer conflict or diplomacy, you'll want more.

 

[grommile]

Defaults are a bit sparse for my taste. My last game was on small (600) map with max number of AIs (15, I think) - and that I enjoyed.

The standard number of AIs for a 600-star galaxy is 17.

 

[Ri0Rdian]

I have settled on 800 stars/15 AI empires. Although I notice that I always have at least one AI empire close by and I kept hoping that I would eventually get a start where I have plenty of room to explore....so I did some testing and had to go all the way down to 6 AI empires before I ended up with a start with nobody close to me. I wonder if there is a certain chance of having AI's appearing near the player or if it's all just random. Anyway, 15 spread out evenly should give everybody plenty of growing space. Of course it all depends on what woks best for you. I like the exploration part of the game so 15 empires works for me. If you prefer conflict or diplomacy, you'll want more.

Stellaris starts you in clusters, worst thing I have seen was 15 empires + me on a 600 star map in about 1/4 of map, rest wast empty + 3 Fallen empires. I had to tinker with the settings a lot in order to get the other empires to spawn evenly across the map. I did so because I like a breathing room, space to peacefully grow (both me and AIs) and I find it more fun.There are mods that do that too.

If you wish how it looks like, start a non-ironman game with your settings and type observe into console.

 

[Rognvaldr19]

Why don't you test game them by starting a particular map (say a medium map) then opening the console and playing as the observer, it shows every player on the map and then you can get some idea on what the space is between empires.

 

[CocoCincinnati]

Stellaris starts you in clusters, worst thing I have seen was 15 empires + me on a 600 star map in about 1/4 of map, rest wast empty + 3 Fallen empires. I had to tinker with the settings a lot in order to get the other empires to spawn evenly across the map. I did so because I like a breathing room, space to peacefully grow (both me and AIs) and I find it more fun.There are mods that do that too.

If you wish how it looks like, start a non-ironman game with your settings and type observe into console.

If you don't mind me asking, what did you have to change to get AI's to spawn evenly across the map? Unless it's very complex, then never mind...I'll look for a mod.

 

[lifehole]

The AI is quite bad at diplomacy when isolated, and expanding at a reasonable rate, so I crank it up to above-average and use smaller mapsizes. I then use a mod to not start in clusters, so the AI doesn't just conquer out the extra empires.

 

[Ri0Rdian]

If you don't mind me asking, what did you have to change to get AI's to spawn evenly across the map? Unless it's very complex, then never mind...I'll look for a mod.

I am no modder (althoug technically probably yes xD), so I just tinkered with different values that seemed important and observed the results till I was happy.

I currently play on 600 star maps (medium) with 15 AI empires (16 empires total +3 FE) and elliptical galaxy, so the files I changed are mostly tied to only those. Only listing what I actually altered.

In map/galaxy base.lua (used for elliptical).
core_radius_perc 0.25
ideal_sq_dist_between = 175*175
min_sq_dist_between = 100*100

In map/setup_scenarios medium.txt (my map).
radius = 440 (about 1/8 larger than default)
for cluster count: value 8 max = 16
cluster_radius = 550
cluster_distance_from_core = 200

Example galaxy:

Spoiler

This gets rid of empire clusters from what I have seen (the cluster size is so big it essentially doesn't exist).


Somehow it works exactly how I wanted. I also play with much less colonisable planets, but dunno whether that has an impact on anything here (probably not, this concerns systems and planets are INSIDE systems). For bigger galaxies one might have to alter those numbers (very likely) to get the same effect. As previously mentioned, I used observe very often to see how things look like till I was happy.... then multiple new games to see if it does generate that way all the time and after that... play!

 

[Serenity84]

There is a mod that distributes them evenly:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=687226658

 

[Finnway]

Defaults are a bit sparse for my taste. My last game was on small (600) map with max number of AIs (15, I think) - and that I enjoyed.

Agreed. I've found I enjoy the game more with more AIs per map. It's more like EU4. You have to ally yourself with other empires to accomplish anything anywhere, and any species you integrate into your empire is a huge advantage because it lets you colonize more worlds.

For some reason, one of the mods that increases the galaxy size also increases the number of AI spawns you can have per map, although I don't remember which mod it is exactly.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=682577835&searchtext=galaxy
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=681750175&searchtext=galaxy

 

[Ri0Rdian]

You can increase that number easily (just switch number) in In map/setup_scenarios <your desired galaxy size>.txt

 

[is_a_cdr]

The standard number of AIs for a 600-star galaxy is 17.

Yeah, I actually meant 400 stars.

 

[Reaperdamo]

why have they changed the defaults? Recommended or just because the lag is so bad? I always use the defaults, but I feel that they have changed them for performance rather than game reasons now.