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martin_jakobsen123

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I am wondring if you start a faction like Nothern Lights (Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Finland, Latvia, Estonia and Lithuenia), will you be able to resist the USSR or the Axis if you go to war with them? Will the faction have a enough manpower and IC to deal with either of the countries.
 
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Skyhascheese

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I am wondring if you start a faction like Nothern Lights (Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Finland, Latvia, Estonia and Lithuenia), will you be able to resist the USSR or the Axis if you go to war with them? Will your faction have a enough manpower and IC to deal with either of the countries.
That doesn't have anything to do with a faction.
Russia will obliterate them btw, terrain would be the only thing stopping the soviets.
 
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Terrain would be the determining factor, I believe. There is some cold arctic terrain and lots of mountains in Norway, and Finland had some very good bottlenecks in HOI3. The waters separating Scandinavia and Finland from the rest of Europe would help, too, as you should be able to inflict some nasty casualties against enemy amphibious assaults. Even considering all that it would be really, really tough, though.

Would be really interesting to see someone attempt this in the finished version of the game, of course. Just unite the Nordic countries in a single faction, gear up for war from day one, and try to weather the storm, so to speak. If nothing else, you'll be giving the Germans and/or Soviets a much bloodier campaign than they historically had in Weserubung and the Winter War/Continuation War.
 
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Daddl

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Forget Latvia, Estonia and Lithuania: You won't be able to defend those. Scandinavia proper however is another thing. Combined, Sweden, Norway, Denmark and Finland should have a decent industry, on par with the biggest european minors like Poland, Spain, Czecheslovakia and Yugoslavia or even better. Russians are weak early on and lack a decent navy, Germany lacks a decent navy as well.
So at least for some years, you should be able to defend the Danish straits or hold out somewhere in the vast Finish forests, the terrain and infrastructure is always on your side. With a bit of an investment in the navy you might even be able to secure the seas. If Germany and SU are distracted with each other or completely other enemies, than you should well be able to hold out or even make some territorial gains if you strike at the right time.

Thats something I'll definetely try very soon after the game is released. I have to see if the AI screws things up too badly though, so maybe you first need to conquer the others (only to defend them of course) to have your own nice one-man-faction.
 
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Bane5

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Land routes can be easily fortified/bottlenecked. Such a faction can only hold out if they can keep russian naval invasions at bay. Baltics are toast regardless.

Would be an interesting naval buildup scenario.
 
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Yeah, I wouldn't harbour too much hope for the Baltics or even Denmark, except maybe the islands. To invade those you would need to do strait crossings or naval landings, both of which could be pretty easily repulsed even in HOI3, and it seems it will be even easier in HOI4. Norway, Sweden, and Finland would be the true "fortress".

I would love for the devs or YouTubers to attempt this when the game comes out.
 
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In a short War, maybe (except the Baltics). In a long war, no way. Not without allies, either from Germany or the UK/France.
Depends on who else they're fighting. If World War II is in full swing and the Soviets and Germans are fighting each others, the Nordic countries might not be important enough to them to justify the effort. Remember, Weserubung was costly to Germany and I fully believe it could have failed completely had Norway been better prepared and/or France fared better so the Allies didn't pull out, and Finland held out against the Soviets.
The key to survival wouldn't be to be unbeatable, it'd be to be so hard to beat that the Germans and Soviets would be forced to either divert a significant force to beat them, or attack with smaller forces and maybe not defeat them.
 

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Depends on who else they're fighting. If World War II is in full swing and the Soviets and Germans are fighting each others, the Nordic countries might not be important enough to them to justify the effort. Remember, Weserubung was costly to Germany and I fully believe it could have failed completely had Norway been better prepared and/or France fared better so the Allies didn't pull out, and Finland held out against the Soviets.
The key to survival wouldn't be to be unbeatable, it'd be to be so hard to beat that the Germans and Soviets would be forced to either divert a significant force to beat them, or attack with smaller forces and maybe not defeat them.

Well when WW2 was in full swing the Nords were not really strategically important enough to justify significant numbers of troops towards them. Neither the allies nor the Russians tried. Russia was mainly interested in protecting Murmansk and Leningrad, and Germany to protect Swedish Iron Ore imports (which became less important after the fall of France) and latter U boat ports.

So it should be perfectly possible to create a neutral "fortress North" while WW2 raged around it. However once WW2 was over...
 
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Thinking about this hypothetically and not historically I see a way, but it is not super appealing given that the Baltic States + Finland are in essence cannon fodder. If Sweden has enough Civilian Factories to build Level 10 forts along the Finish border, a sort of Swedish Maginot or Mannerheim line, the Russians are going to stall given the low supply and terrible weather. The Germans wouldn't be able to cross into Malmo as a strong Swedish and Norwegian Navy should be as strong or stronger than the combined Red Navy and Kriegsmarine. So yeah it's possible, but it would probably be pretty boring from a gameplay perspective, and Sweden and Norway might get bombed to hell by the Germans since their air force is going to be no match.
 

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Realistically, I think they can mostly hold out (not counting Jutland and the Baltic nations due to their obvious vulnerable locations), but rarely if ever go aggressive. In game however, I have honestly no clue what is possible. Here are my few thoughts anyway:

Against Germany, Jutland will likely have to be sacrificed due to flat terrain and land access through Schleswig-Holstein. The longer you can keep the Germans busy before losing Jutland, the less troops will be available against France. The rest of the islands can be fortified with coastal forts and anti air, thus making naval assaults extremely costly. Finland has a lot more narrow passages than people expect thanks to being the country of a thousand lakes. If these passages can be fortified, then that would severely hinder Soviet movement. As for Sweden and Norway, they will have a constant fear of naval assaults regardless of whom they are at war with due to being on a peninsula with a fortified northern border. The only practical way to enter those two countries are by sea, so coastal forts (and anti air if you have time for it before the war) will be needed, especially if Sweden wants any chance of keeping Gotland.

I don't know if the battle planner allows you to make defensive battle plans with retreat paths and defensive retreat lines, but if it does, then the grand battle plan doctrine might be a good option to consider (especially so for Finland) in order to stack defensive bonuses. For the one playing as Norway specifically, you will want a heavy focus on mountain infantry and equipment for them, since your country is basically just one long mountain range. Neither country will be able to field a lot of troops compared to neither Soviet Union nor Germany, so you will want to stack as many bonuses on your troops as possible rather than trying to get a few percent more troops. Generally, you will want a good base of reserves anyway, so make sure to coordinate with the other nations so that they are capable of reinforcing their front lines.

Another funny thing you may want to try if you're playing as Norway, is to launch a naval invasion of your own in order to surround the defending troops at Murmansk. If you're able to take Murmansk, then I think the supply for the Soviet Karelian troops will diminish even further. If you somehow manage to get aerial supremacy in the area, then it could be coordinated with paratroopers (from any of the countries, but I suspect Finland will be a bit too tied up down at Viipuri to assist with that) a bit further in on land, in order to further surround the Soviet forces. I see this as one of the only options for aggressive movement against the Soviet Union, and depending on whether or not the Soviet army will suffer a supply penalty, it may or may not be worth it. If you simply lose a bunch of men, and they are able to retake Murmansk, then the suffering will all have been in vain since they have millions more in reserves.
 
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