No retribution for murderers?

[Cal585]

Playing a kingdom of Saxony from HRE campaign and my wife was recently murdered by my kinsman (and vassal). Had no idea of the plot until after she died and the skull is telling me that he killed her. However, I have no justifiable means of retaliation, as imprisoning causes the -40 tyranny penalty. Not a big deal and I've already played on, just wondering why my character accepts it silently?

Though to be honest, I'm not even sure if he's aware, as there doesn't seem to be an opinion hit or anything. But I thought then the cause of death was just listed as suspicious circumstances?

 

[WomboCombo]

The only people who care about the murder would be the parents and the children (instant rivalry), and to a lesser extent close kin.There's no legal recourse for the murder of a spouse, though. You could just plot to have him killed, though. If he was implicated, he should have quite a few enemies.

 

[Seb_Jean]

Playing a kingdom of Saxony from HRE campaign and my wife was recently murdered by my kinsman (and vassal). Had no idea of the plot until after she died and the skull is telling me that he killed her. However, I have no justifiable means of retaliation, as imprisoning causes the -40 tyranny penalty. Not a big deal and I've already played on, just wondering why my character accepts it silently?

Though to be honest, I'm not even sure if he's aware, as there doesn't seem to be an opinion hit or anything. But I thought then the cause of death was just listed as suspicious circumstances?

If it's suspicious circumstances, you can't prove that he killed her. If his assassination attempt on your wife was revealed, I think that you get a reason to imprison it but I'm not sure.

One way or another, if someone murder a member of my family in CK2, I'll wait until I find a reason to convince enough people to end his life or push claims on his title. He refuse, is labeled as traitor, win the war and imprison him.

 

[ranbir]

It is still weird. You'd expect there to be some design around vengeance for the murder of his wife. And if not for the wife the fact that a murder was able to be committed in our own home/domain and so close to our own station/person.

 

[faiuwle]

I definitely got a big opinion malus from someone after I killed his wife and the plot was revealed. I've heard that the opinion modifier you get allows imprisonment, but only for a period of time.

 

[Cal585]

That's why I'm wondering if my character actually knows who was responsible for her death. I know and it's plainly listed on the interface but I couldn't see any opinion modifier towards his character or anything. But if he doesn't know, then I didn't think I would know either? So unless he couldn't care less about her?

 

[faiuwle]

Are you sure you don't have the opinion modifier? You wouldn't see it unless the person was your direct vassal or in your court - in other cases you have to right click and select the round button that says "explore character opinions" or something like that to see other people's opinions of that character (including yours).

 

[aono]

That's why I'm wondering if my character actually knows who was responsible for her death. I know and it's plainly listed on the interface but I couldn't see any opinion modifier towards his character or anything. But if he doesn't know, then I didn't think I would know either? So unless he couldn't care less about her?

Just in case - are you sure you're looking at your opinion on him, not the opposite way?

 

[Cal585]

Just in case - are you sure you're looking at your opinion on him, not the opposite way?

Yep. Checked both opinion boxes as I always get muddled which one is which and immediately tried to imprison. He was my direct vassal as well so that shouldn't be it. Game has moved on 7 years now and there's no modifier there (my character dislikes him for a host of other reasons and I'll probably kill him anyway with 299% plot power). Just curious as I didn't get informed of the plot or anything and she died in the high importance notification window and that was that.

 

[MateuszS]

Maybe he didn't kill her, just took her skull?

 

[michx0]

Let me guess. She was your spymaster. There is an event for plotters something about "spymaster is close to reveal my plot" with an option "try to kill spymaster". It is "buggy" because:
1. Plotter have 50% chance to kill spymaster. No matter of high/low intrigue skill, paranoid, landed - none of that. Lowborn slow plotter has a 50% chance to kill duke intrigue 30 paranoid schemer spymaster;
2. Murderer is always revealed. No chance of "suspicious circumstances";
3. But there is no event for consequences of murder.

Needless to say, I usually delete this event. I believe seeing it in bug reports, no luck for now. Maybe someone should post it again.

 

[Tryvenyal]

I think there are some kind of "bug". If plot to kill your wife is (Publicly?)revealed, you get opinion malus and everything. If your Spymaster finds out about the plot, it´s not "revealed" but you know and that gives no malus. Look at the plot interface when someone plots to kill you. No malus - should be -200! If you´re in a plot and blabbering in the tavern, it´s there.

 

[Cal585]

Let me guess. She was your spymaster. There is an event for plotters something about "spymaster is close to reveal my plot" with an option "try to kill spymaster". It is "buggy" because:
1. Plotter have 50% chance to kill spymaster. No matter of high/low intrigue skill, paranoid, landed - none of that. Lowborn slow plotter has a 50% chance to kill duke intrigue 30 paranoid schemer spymaster;
2. Murderer is always revealed. No chance of "suspicious circumstances";
3. But there is no event for consequences of murder.

Needless to say, I usually delete this event. I believe seeing it in bug reports, no luck for now. Maybe someone should post it again.

Thanks! I'd forgotten that she was indeed my spymaster (18 intrigue). That makes a lot more sense now and is definitely something I shall bear in mind for future when choosing spymaster!

 

[Tryvenyal]

Let me guess. She was your spymaster. There is an event for plotters something about "spymaster is close to reveal my plot" with an option "try to kill spymaster". It is "buggy" because:
1. Plotter have 50% chance to kill spymaster. No matter of high/low intrigue skill, paranoid, landed - none of that. Lowborn slow plotter has a 50% chance to kill duke intrigue 30 paranoid schemer spymaster;
2. Murderer is always revealed. No chance of "suspicious circumstances";
3. But there is no event for consequences of murder.

Needless to say, I usually delete this event. I believe seeing it in bug reports, no luck for now. Maybe someone should post it again.

Hmm... Does a high intrigue really make it that much harder to kill the spymaster? I think the spymaster´s intrigue value is more important when calulating chances of getting the event. If you outwit him and reveal the spymaster, you should have a good chanse on a counter attack, shouldn't you?

EDIT: The event is very bad designed though. As a spymaster is rarely on the field himself but rather the spider in the center of the web. The success event here should kill or disconnect the agents on the field. The spymaster is probably safely behind the royal walls

 

[Rydelfox]

You generally shouldn't make your wife spymaster anyway - you normally get half of your wife's stats and all of your councilor's appropriate stat, but those don't stack if you're married to that councilor.