This king's dad conquered Dubhlinn and Cill Dara about 4 years ago. Those counties are feudal, while I'm still tribal. I've got a "wrong type of holding in desmene" notice, but no reinforcement malus anymore. Still, I've had my marshal on Cill Dara for two years and there's been no growth. The garrison count will get up to about 20-something, then reset. What's going on? (I can't figure out how to upload the screenshot)
No Garrison/Levy reinforcement
- Thread starter MarshalGivens
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You do get a lot of maluses after conquering territory, and I think it might be possible for those to stack with other province modifiers to give -100% garrison size. To check the calculation, hover the mouse over the green garrison bar, and check the tooltip. You can also check holding modifiers (which appear as red icons on top of the picture of the tribe) and county modifiers (which appear as a row of icons below the picture of the tribe).
The "reset to zero" behaviour is weird, but might be explained by new modifiers being added or removed over time - eg. if you move your marshal around, or if you get some kind of negative effect (highway robbers? depopulation?).
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If you are rich, I would recommend holding the tribe personally while you construct a new castle in the province. Hand the new castle (and only the castle) to a new vassal, the hand that same vassal the whole county. This is the fastest way to convert tribal counties to feudal.
If you are semi-rich and the county follows the same religion as you, you could buy the necessary buildings to upgrade the tribe to a castle. Slow, but less expensive that building a new castle, and the upgraded castle will probably be better than a newly-constructed one, and it offers a roundabout way to construct castle buildings with prestige rather than gold.
If you are not rich, hand the tribal county to a vassal, because it's just not worthwhile to hold it for yourself. It's probably beat to choose a previously-unlanded character of your religion and culture (he will become tribal and will veeeeery slooowly upgrade to feudal), but other tactics might work in niche situations.
The "reset to zero" behaviour is weird, but might be explained by new modifiers being added or removed over time - eg. if you move your marshal around, or if you get some kind of negative effect (highway robbers? depopulation?).
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If you are rich, I would recommend holding the tribe personally while you construct a new castle in the province. Hand the new castle (and only the castle) to a new vassal, the hand that same vassal the whole county. This is the fastest way to convert tribal counties to feudal.
If you are semi-rich and the county follows the same religion as you, you could buy the necessary buildings to upgrade the tribe to a castle. Slow, but less expensive that building a new castle, and the upgraded castle will probably be better than a newly-constructed one, and it offers a roundabout way to construct castle buildings with prestige rather than gold.
If you are not rich, hand the tribal county to a vassal, because it's just not worthwhile to hold it for yourself. It's probably beat to choose a previously-unlanded character of your religion and culture (he will become tribal and will veeeeery slooowly upgrade to feudal), but other tactics might work in niche situations.
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"Each form of government has preferred and allowed settlements, and will get "Wrong government type" (-75% levies and income) penalty while holding other types of settlements directly. Hindu characters will suffer opinion penalties if they have holdings which do not match their caste. Also, they cannot be granted such holdings directly." https://ck2.paradoxwikis.com/Holdings
Just pillage the Holdings, it's a great Source of Income and Technology Points. If you have Legacy of Rome installed, you should only use Retinues as a Tribe anyway, since tribal Levies are bad and can't be fixed, while your Retinue Cap can be increased quite easily.
Just pillage the Holdings, it's a great Source of Income and Technology Points. If you have Legacy of Rome installed, you should only use Retinues as a Tribe anyway, since tribal Levies are bad and can't be fixed, while your Retinue Cap can be increased quite easily.
Thanks for trying, but this didn't help much. Like I said, there are no levy/ garrison maluses in the bar. They disappeared a while ago. I even have a massive recruitment drive bonus. I'm thinking there is a hidden malus because I'm getting big bucks from the city in each county. There's no red text when I hover over the garrison/levy bar; only green (see pic -- figured that out, at least.) Also, weirdly, when I click on the castle holding, I see more troops represented in the pop up window than is represented when hovering over the bar (2nd pic). I found the "wrong gov't type malus," there; but I should still have some growth.
I didn't understand what you meant about building/ upgrading to castle, since both counties already have a castle. I started as chief of Osraige, so getting up to Feudal is taking a long time. I still have 20 years to go, before I have Max Tribal Organization.
I do have a "Wrong Type of Holding in Desmene" button at top of screen, and maybe I should just give the titles away, but I'd hate to lose the 60+ gold per year (60 % of my income). I don't know what the trade off is. I'm well ahead of the Feudal king who is the nearest threat, with all the upgrades to my forts.
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The Wiki doesn't list any DLC-Requirement, so I would guess not.
You right-click on the Holding you want to pillage and select "pillage holding" or something like this.
I think he thinks your situation is the opposite of what it really is. His advice is what you should do if you're feudal and the counties are still tribal. What you should do, if there is an empty holding in a feudal county, is build a new tribal holding there. After the tribal holding has finished building, the county will become tribal. Then you can give away the castle, and you'll still own the county, while the castle's new owner will be a vassal baron under you. (If you give away the castle before the new tribe is completely built, the castle's owner will own the county and be a vassal count rather than a baron.). And no matter if everything says that you get a 75% malus to the levy, in practice it's a 100% malus, because the levy will never reinforce if the holding is of the wrong government type.
@DPS is correct, I thought you were a feudal holding tribal land. But, actually, you're a tribal holding feudal land. A screenshot is worth a thousand words ;-)
The game is pushing you towards one of two obvious options:
The game is pushing you towards one of two obvious options:
- Build a tribe in the feudal county, make that the county capital, give away the castle.
- Or, build a tribe in the feudal county, revoke all other holdings in the county, pillage all non-tribal holdings. (Maybe not the church, if you're role-playing as a pious Catholic.)
- You can also use a mild exploit to pillage everything in the county (which flips county culture and religion and removes the long-lasting revolt risk). (But these counties are already probably Irish Catholic, so what's the point?)
- Or you can use a different mild exploit ("inheritance conflict") to flip to feudal when your current character dies. (But I don't think that's a good idea in this specific case because the main downside of non-pagan tribalism in year 1000 is gavelkind, and you can sidestep that with tanistry because you're celtic. You might want to go feudal eventually, but it's not particularly urgent.)
- Or you could set up coastal republic counties, ready to become a vassal MR after you create the kingdom. (Vassal MRs are a good source of ships if you want to stay tribal and go sea-raiding. But Dublin is the capital of Ireland - do you really want to fill it with a MR?)