No Fear Mechanic

[Djieh]

I am merely using it as an example. The Nazis used fear effectively also. It really doesn't matter timewise because its simply human nature. As for violent resistances to the queue policy, well you can see which side is the clear winner. If you feel that 0 resistance is the only measure of success of a policy then I concede the argument.

The structures you deal with in-game are very different with what you field as examples. The general population will obviously be influenced by fear, but counts and dukes, who are able to field their own armies, will be less likely to tremble with fear because some poor soul has been decapitated. And even normal peasants will at one point change their approach to intimidation, as soon as they feel they don't have anything left to lose, I suspect.

 

[Secret Master]

Wait, doesn't the fear mechanic come into play with how factions work now? I've never had any faction attempt to blackmail me until they had the military strength to do so.

They only threaten me when they feel they have a chance; even tyranny works this way, now. Factions get incredibly strong when vassals take a loyalty hit from a huge tyranny penalty. I've had factions gain 5 or more members with a single banishment.

 

[Malibu Stacey]

Wait, doesn't the fear mechanic come into play with how factions work now? I've never had any faction attempt to blackmail me until they had the military strength to do so.

If by fear you mean "they wait until the faction has a certain percentage or higher of the troops you have before they will consider pressing their demands" then sure.


Respect, honour, loyalty & friendship don't exist in this game either. It's pretty much the Disney version of medieval times.

 

[ThePinkPanzer]

Wait, doesn't the fear mechanic come into play with how factions work now? I've never had any faction attempt to blackmail me until they had the military strength to do so.

They only threaten me when they feel they have a chance; even tyranny works this way, now. Factions get incredibly strong when vassals take a loyalty hit from a huge tyranny penalty. I've had factions gain 5 or more members with a single banishment.

It's one thing to be afraid your lords army is too strong, and another entirely to be afraid he is going to hang you upside down and missing a scalp from a burning church steeple.

Respect, honour, loyalty & friendship don't exist in this game either. It's pretty much the Disney version of medieval times.

Going to go and assume you mean Disney's disturbing and horrifying era here.

 

[Secret Master]

If by fear you mean "they wait until the faction has a certain percentage or higher of the troops you have before they will consider pressing their demands" then sure.


Respect, honour, loyalty & friendship don't exist in this game either. It's pretty much the Disney version of medieval times.

How many Disney movies have blinding, castrating, burning heathens at the stake, executions, adultery, more adultery, adultery with every woman at court (that lustful trait really amps up the number of bastards if your ruler is young), legitimizing bastards, murdering relatives to gain their titles, murdering vassals to gain their titles, murdering sons because they have the wrong culture, murdering the Khan of the Golden Horde because his idiot son might cause a succession crisis, imprisoning and executing your brothers once you assume the sultanate, betrothing your 2 year old daughter to a 40 year old to prevent a war while you have no intention of honoring the betrothal when she comes of age...

As for friendship and loyalty not being the game, you must be missing out on how much impact traits and modifiers to relations can impact things. Give me a kingdom full of content vassals, and I'll show you a kingdom that can rule the continent.

 

[Kimberly]

How many Disney movies have...burning heathens at the stake, executions...murdering relatives to gain their titles...

Example A.
Example B.
Example C.

 

[General Pauper]

Example A.
Example B.
Example C.

lol, lion king...

I see what you did there.

 

[General Pauper]

lol, lion king...

I see what you did there.

Also if this was in real life you would need to have either a large faction of the kingdom fiercely loyal to you in order to start a reign of terror. In real life all of the counts and dukes etc. would gather together, talk about your atrocities for like an hour, and then band together and kick you off the throne. You would need overwhelming military power to prevent them from doing so, and the people who know they are on your hit list would probably still rebel anyway. If they had as much as a 30% chance to beat you, they would try.

 

[Secret Master]

Example A.
Example B.
Example C.

Fair enough. Although, in fairness to me, two of those are movies I hate, one of them I've never seen.

 

[Kimberly]

Note to self: code event in which your plotting target is killed by a stampede.

 

[Die Nacht]

You may be right, but I think such things as mutilation, public execution, putting your enemy's head on a spike etc are all part of the arsenal of a feudal ruler to instill fear in his subjects. My main concern is that people do not just dismiss fear as a tool for control in real life. Fear is used to control people even at the lowest level. Fear is why women stay with their abusive husbands/boyfriends.

Well that was mostly to scare commoners (from revolting or committing crimes). When people got publicly executed it was mostly a show for the peasants, so they know not to; I don't think lords traveled from their holdings all the way to the capital (or some other holding) so they can see someone get executed or a head on a spike.

That being said, public executions in the game do happen (mostly during the summer fair), and they do scare the population (they get -10% revolt chance or something like that).

 

[Fishy101]

Yeah but you can't expect (and that is obviously what you are asking for) a positive relation modifier for them being afraid of you for your tyrannic deeds.
Fear works fine, just imprison Matilda as Heinrich Salian and see who else wants independence. Probably the Duke of Bohemia, so let him, the idiot will swear fealty again as he's a de jure vassal and you'll have claims on all his titles.
Also aim for wroth, cruel and Impaler traits for 30% morale damage bonus in battles and watch the outcome

Actually, I am not talking about game mechanic at all. I agreed that making fear a game mechanic that benefit rulers who execute vassals will likely make the game too easy. I said so in my first post.

In response to posters who say fear doesn't work in real life. You're not serious right?

 

[Smeel]

I'm fine if military might would the only thing preventing vassals from revolting because of tyranny. Someone mentioned the nazis earlier as an example of using fear tactics effectively. I would argue that they are a prime example of the opposite, as they faced armed resistance in practically every country they invaded, throughout the war even with their reputation of harsh punishment and retaliation.
And if I'm not mistaken, you will get a big opinion boost for quelling big revolts. I guess I could see how a short term opinion boost with your vassals for tyranny, but with a accumulating harsher opinion penalty afterwards would work, so to maintain a reign of terror you would have to.... maintain it.

 

[Alexnor]

Not having read the entire thread I'd just like to say - I want fear modelled in the game. It should play a role.

 

[ash001]

Yeah. I'm trying to model and develop the fear mechanics into my mod.
For now, what I have is this:
A heir who inherits from a tyrannical ruler should have an easier time with his vassals if his traits confirm him as a strong and merciless leader (making his vassals fear and respect him) while a weak, cowardly ruler with the "dynasty stain" should be disliked by many of his vassals.
In the end, fear mechanics works as a way to raise the stakes. The player (lucky enough to get the right traits) can try to push it "to the limit" but, if he oversteps, the result can be quite ugly, with everyone claiming for his blood.

 

[Slavick3000]

I would like to point out that after defeating a revolt, whatever you end up doing with the plotters, you do get a "defeated a major rebellion +25" modifier to all the vassals. I think that simulates fear quite nicely, especially since the AI (and I am guessing most players) immediately goes on a revoke-rampage against the plotters afterwards.