Newby tips

[Doomstack]

I got CK2 recently and after only one night of playing it, I can say confidently that CK2 is my 2012 GOTY. However, I was only able to play the game for one night before my computer crashed on me. Luckily, I'm getting a new one next week so all will be right with the world.

I played only a few hours in two different campaigns to see what the game was about. I played as the kingdom of Croatia and the Duke of Holland. While the Kingdom of Croatia game was fun, I really want to try to create the Kingdom of Holland (my RL family is dutch) way earlier in history than what actually happened. I thought I was smart to wait until other HRE vassals revolted before I claimed de jure claims on neighboring provinces. But when I declared war, I was always crushed by the might of the HRE before I could get anything started.

Do you have any tips I could use to get off to a good start as the Duke of Holland? Getting independence seems to be the hardest part with a small army and almost no allies to start with. I could wait for random scenarios to play out where the HRE implodes to it's vassals, but who knows if that will happen.

 

[Isaios]

You don't want independence too early, it's much better to get into the HRE somehow. To achieve this, work towards getting your family landed (they'd need a Duchy to inherit the duchy into the HRE and a County if you let the Duchy go by using Elective Succession Law) in the HRE. Your son is married to the Countess of Brabant, with their son set to inherit her. Once in the HRE you should work to consolidate land NOT held by the Duke of Lorraine (he's scary big) or marrying into the same line so as to get a decent power-base. Nabbing the Pagan Baltic Coast is also advisable, since you have plenty of distant kin to whom you can deed those titles, increasing your prestige and investing in greater power down the road.

 

[Doomstack]

So, you're basically saying that I should stick around in the HRE for a bit before trying to independence? Try to increase my power and prestige by marriage and other stuff first?

 

[fcmsaab]

So, you're basically saying that I should stick around in the HRE for a bit before trying to independence? Try to increase my power and prestige by marriage and other stuff first?

Yah. Marry into the different familes of the HRE. Get their land. Form a kingdom inside the HRE. Before you declare independec, marry into the independet neighbors of the HRE life france, england and ERE. If you got high relation with them before declaring independece they will aid you in your war.

 

[Doomstack]

Alright, sounds like a plan.

Now I just need my new computer to get here asap.

 

[Isaios]

Yah. Marry into the different familes of the HRE. Get their land. Form a kingdom inside the HRE. Before you declare independec, marry into the independet neighbors of the HRE life france, england and ERE. If you got high relation with them before declaring independece they will aid you in your war.

This. With a few outside allies and a solid Faction inside, you can pretty neatly dismantle the HRE. (Or take the Imperial throne of course.)

 

[Doomstack]

One of my main reasons why I wanted to get this game was to take a lowly count/duke and make his dynasty huge. I love that the game (though it might be hard) allows you to do that. Starting as a king is fun too, but it's more interesting to me to start lower.

Can't wait to get started.

So, my priorities for when I do start would be to marry into other families, ally with independent kingdoms (France for example), and get involved in factions.

How do I form a kingdom inside of the HRE? Marrying into other dynasties doesn't feel like it's going to work. Wouldn't their heirs be the ones to inherent?

 

[Isaios]

There are several benefits to marriage, depending on who you marry where.

Marrying your heir to a woman who will inherit ensures that THEIR child inherits both your titles.

Marrying younger sons to landed women will ensure that their children are of your dynasty, increasing your dynastic prestige and allies.

Marrying daughters usually only results in alliances, but you can marry daughters matrilinearly to the younger sons of other nobles so that THEIR children will be of your dynasty with claims on new lands.

 

[Doomstack]

Ok, I guess that makes sense.

 

[XRW]

Nabbing the Pagan Baltic Coast is also advisable, since you have plenty of distant kin to whom you can deed those titles, increasing your prestige and investing in greater power down the road.

Better yet, make them all Lord Bishops. Bishops pay you taxes, don't generally aquire land outside the duchy, don't inherit, don't marry, get a big bonus to relations if you have whatever law that is not papal supremacy (#@$% forgot the name). Many consider this gamey, but I don't think it is if you do so sparingly.

Edit: The law I am looking for is "Free Investiture". You want to be in that. Minor penalty with the pope, big boost to vassals relations. If you keep getting excommed. Join a crusade. You get a big boost to relations with the pope if you join and a good trait if you land troops somewhere in the crusade target. Serious effort is not required. Just land troops. Maybe occupy a holding or fight a battle for some extra piety.

 

[Doomstack]

How does it work when you're a duke in an empire when it comes to declaring war?

I was running into trouble in my last game when I tried pressing 1 of my de jure claims on that county in the HRE. I would have to declare war on the HRE which lead to me getting stomped by the might of the empire. Say I do the same for the other county in the Kingdom of France, wouldn't the entire French army arrive on my doorstep?

 

[Isaios]

As long as you're a vassal in the same Kingdom, then no. You get to rumble with the army of the bloke you declare on, plus allies. If you've switched to the HRE, then YES you will get roflstomped by France, but you should expand within the Empire while in the Empire. That's the entire point of being in the Empire.

 

[Tokie]

How does it work when you're a duke in an empire when it comes to declaring war?

I was running into trouble making 1 of my de jure claims on that county in the HRE, I would have to declare war on the HRE which lead to me getting stomped by the might of the empire. Say I do the same for the other county in the Kingdom of France, wouldn't the entire French army arrive on my doorstep?

The entire French army would be at your footstep indeed. That is the purpose of swearing fealty to your liege lord, it is to grant protection from outside attacks.

You can usually attack other people in your empire if crown authority of the kingdom permits it(Limited, Low only). Attacking other dukes is ok, but declaring war on your liege is treason! Trying to take land from your liege's demesne is unwise! Unless you want to go independent of course.

 

[Ahaz Flagg]

Still new myself, let me caution you, keep an eye at all times on Heir and the next 2 in line, if possible educate them yourself. Do not ever get a dwarf as a king!! Frigging not one person would marry my poor small King!! Watch for all traits on marrige, that is how I got a dwarf as a king. Funny thing happened to me, I was marrying family all over the place, not paying attention, next thing I know My Family is King of Scotland, Navara, and holds 3 duchies in the HRE.

 

[sergeant113]

Gah, I thought this was a guide started by The Esteemed DoomDark =))

 

[Doomstack]

Gah, I thought this was a guide started by The Esteemed DoomDark =))

Yeah. I realized that my username is a little too close to Doomdark. Also, it's a very common term in CK2. I asked a mod to see if I could change it.

 

[Isaios]

Yeah. I realized that my username is a little too close to Doomdark. Also, it's a very common term in CK2. I asked a mod to see if I could change it.

Nono! It's an awesome nick! Of course, I'm imagining you're a gestalt consciousness, so it might be giving the wrong impression

 

[Tufto]

If you want to nab something which in the Emperor's/French King's personal demesne, then don't. If you're in the HRE and wish to attack other HRE members, you can do so without antagonising your liege, but you can only declare war within the realm if the crown authority is low enough.

I think (think) you can attack outside at any crown authority, though it might be limited, I can't remember. If you want to attack a French count/duchy, then unless you think you're powerful enough to take on the King, wait until a rebellion sparks up. If the land you want splits off of France in that war, attack it and take it quickly before the war finishes.

And marriage, as said above. Lots and lots of marriage. But make sure you don't accidentally marry your land away; try to make other people's land come to you. This can be annoying in Germany; isn't there salic law there?