New World Order Achievement Breaking Game Mechanic

[FamSox]

This has probably been posted here before, but when going for the New World Order achievement, if you choose to ally Fascist America into the Axis, he will bring his puppet, the Philippines in with him. This wouldn't be a problem, if he would turn fascist. I hadn't known about this when I turned the US fascist, and I had only discovered this after I had conquered the Comintern and the Allies, a good 3-5 hours into my game, not to mention the additional 2 or 3 I spent attempting to turn the Philippines fascist, doing nothing but waiting around.

I know it is nothing more then an achievement, but dear god, this was such a huge waste of time only to find out that puppets do not flip unless you own them, even if the country owning them is fascist.

Please, Paradox, fix this. I know I can't get my time that I wasted back, but hopefully you can prevent some others from doing the same.

 

[aono]

I know it is nothing more then an achievement, but dear god, this was such a huge waste of time only to find out that puppets do not flip unless you own them, even if the country owning them is fascist.

Actually they don't flip (at least before) even if you own them. The only way people found was annex them through influence system and (if you want) reliberate them.

 

[xtfoster]

Edit your pictures ASAP to remove the symbol that shall not be named...

 

[FamSox]

You mean the flag? Why? Its doing nothing but adding flavor to the game.

EDIT: Just looked up online to see if it was part of the forum rules, it is, changing it.

 

[Oddb@ll]

Don't forget to blur the symbol in the fascist US flag

This is more or less a wc achievement, I don't remember exactly how I did it, but I conquered most nations in the world. The less countries in the world, the less governments you have to care about.

 

[aono]

Screencaps edited because apparently history is offensive.

Just to be honest, it's not completly just. There are countries where said symbol in relation with Germany can be a reason for the legal sue. I'm living in such country, there was event here, when newspaper was prosecuted for creating a collage based on classical cinema made in our country in 1973.
So I believe it's too harsh as well, but can't really condemn Paradox for unwillingness to be put on trial here. Or just be banned from official markets.

 

[FamSox]

I know its not Paradox, but the fact that it is still illegal doesn't make it right. Its censorship, and it does nothing else other than give neo-Nazis fuel for their cause.

But back on topic, they really should either fix the puppet ideology system, or amend the achievement so its something like "Make all countries join Axis" or something of the sort.

 

[aono]

I know its not Paradox, but the fact that it is still illegal doesn't make it right. Its censorship, and it does nothing else other than give neo-Nazis fuel for their cause.

I do agree wholehearthly.

But back on topic, they really should either fix the puppet ideology system, or amend the achievement so its something like "Make all countries join Axis" or something of the sort.

Yes, they should. I found it when I creating a mod about red USA, when only country on the map that wasn't Communist was said Philippines. But I could (and I did) create an event to fix it, that actually isn't hard.
UPD: Sorry for autociting.
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/puppet-ideology-events.989623/

 

[Bambilambi]

Cant you just influence the country until it becomes fascist?

 

[aono]

Cant you just influence the country until it becomes fascist?

That's the thing. If speaking about free country, it would get an event sooner or later. But puppets are directly or non-directly barred from every one of such events.

 

[TheOrangeGuy]

That's the thing. If speaking about free country, it would get an event sooner or later. But puppets are directly or non-directly barred from every one of such events.

I had no idea that was the case, do you know the reasoning behind it?

 

[aono]

I had no idea that was the case, do you know the reasoning behind it?

Can't say I know it, but I believe it to be civil war problem. Thing is, a lot of regime change events including civil wars. So that means if your puppet have such an event, that would create two countries, with war between them, and such way you can lose your puppet just because they failed to be political coherent.
To fix it you just needed to create another event, that would fire on subject and change their regime as it's overlord change it. It would looks nicely, but as (as I'm sure) game on development never was supposed to be played as alternative history simulator, nobody really felt it as something that should be done. "Why do we need to create another check, that can be bad for game stability (every event can)? Who would ever really need it? New World Order supposed to be completed by fighting the world, not make them facist politically."

P.S. Just in case, the last moment I checked this was before Death or Dishonor. Maybe they changed it. But I doubt.

 

[Had a dad]

I know its not Paradox, but the fact that it is still illegal doesn't make it right. Its censorship, and it does nothing else other than give neo-Nazis fuel for their cause.

Knock it off

 

[TheOrangeGuy]

Can't say I know it, but I believe it to be civil war problem. Thing is, a lot of regime change events including civil wars. So that means if your puppet have such an event, that would create two countries, with war between them, and such way you can lose your puppet just because they failed to be political coherent.
To fix it you just needed to create another event, that would fire on subject and change their regime as it's overlord change it. It would looks nicely, but as (as I'm sure) game on development never was supposed to be played as alternative history simulator, nobody really felt it as something that should be done. "Why do we need to create another check, that can be bad for game stability (every event can)? Who would ever really need it? New World Order supposed to be completed by fighting the world, not make them facist politically."

P.S. Just in case, the last moment I checked this was before Death or Dishonor. Maybe they changed it. But I doubt.

That makes sense, although I would prefer if it worked like a neutral country, and the master have a ideology boost in puppets instead, makes it possible to keep the puppet, but not for free

 

[aono]

That makes sense, although I would prefer if it worked like a neutral country, and the master have a ideology boost in puppets instead, makes it possible to keep the puppet, but not for free

...and this is creating script-based system for rare event not supposed to happen.

 

[TheOrangeGuy]

...and this is creating script-based system for rare event not supposed to happen.

I don't think it's too unlikely that an axis player tries to coup any of the UKs puppets? And it does not need to be script driven, a simple modifier in the puppets is enough. That will probably be done with very few lines of code.

Edit: Or commitern/allies boosting in Axis newly created Balkan puppets

 

[aono]

Edit: Or commitern/allies boosting in Axis newly created Balkan puppets

...and that's another point why it's not implemented. )) I mean, it's not how you supposed to defeat your enemy. In Sino-Japanese War you shouldn't be able to just influence Manchu to Communism from d1. It can be possible to tweaked, create some conditions about "there you can, there you can't...", and this is what doing system script-based.
Not as I fully agree, you know. But I do believe it's the reasoning behind blocking ideology change for puppets.

 

[FamSox]

That makes sense, although I would prefer if it worked like a neutral country, and the master have a ideology boost in puppets instead, makes it possible to keep the puppet, but not for free

Yeah, it would be cool if you could get random (but still common) events where you get to extend your "influence" into a puppet, instead of just boosting ideology. Or at the very least, the puppet gets a modifier that changes party support based on the master nations ideology.