• Crusader Kings II Expansion Subscription

    Subscribe to the CK II Expansion and enjoy unlimited access to 13 major expansions and more!


  • Paradox Midsummer Sale has arrived! Up to 75% off!

    Enjoy some sun and song this Midsummer, but when the sun goes down, the fun doesn't have to stop! Paradox has a festive sale on plenty of games to keep your summer nights going!


    June 18th - June 30th
  • Crusader Kings III Available Now!

    The realm rejoices as Paradox Interactive announces the launch of Crusader Kings III, the latest entry in the publisher’s grand strategy role-playing game franchise. Advisors may now jockey for positions of influence and adversaries should save their schemes for another day, because on this day Crusader Kings III can be purchased on Steam, the Paradox Store, and other major online retailers.


    Real Strategy Requires Cunning

almoravid

I ignore U
51 Badges
Sep 8, 2003
1.271
130
Visit site
  • Age of Wonders
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Crusader Kings II
  • For The Glory
  • Majesty 2 Collection
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
East and West Georgias where called (and sometimes called themselves) Iveria/Iberia and Kolkhis. I know it because I read historic documents, royal letters etc. I thought it would be pretty to have different names for country and province. As for my proposed Kuban province, I must assure you that there were no significant settlements, so that Taman can safely be it's capital. That is my opinion.
 

Mad King James

Buzzkill Extraordinaire
66 Badges
Jan 18, 2002
7.148
300
40
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • 500k Club
There is however the slight issue of ownership.

In the beginning of the game, Kouban should be owned by the Golden Horde, and then become part of Crimea.

Taman however begins as a Genoan posession, and fell to the Ottoman Turks.

They would not be united in one province until the Russians conquered both of them 300 years later.

For 80% of the game, if they are one province, they are a glaring innacuracy. For that matter, who do you give uber-Kouban to? GH? Genoa? Ottomans? Crimea?
 

almoravid

I ignore U
51 Badges
Sep 8, 2003
1.271
130
Visit site
  • Age of Wonders
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Crusader Kings II
  • For The Glory
  • Majesty 2 Collection
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
I believe that we can represent Genovese position with Kaffa, because Taman, in comparison to the Crimean towns, is an empty steppe/shore. But if you feel the urge to represent the tiny Genovese posession on that side of the Kerch strait as a city, it's OK. I'm however against it, for it isn't enough to be counted a province IMO.
 

Mad King James

Buzzkill Extraordinaire
66 Badges
Jan 18, 2002
7.148
300
40
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • 500k Club
While a telling argument for almost everywhere else, in southern Russia not so much, since EVERYTHING was organized that way (city in the middle of endless rolling steppe).

Under this logic, why not just have a "hordes" province with Sarai as its capital? :rofl:
 

nalivayko

General
49 Badges
Mar 15, 2001
2.487
256
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • March of the Eagles
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Stellaris
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
Need your input on Ukraine - this is the copy of the post on MJK's Map thread:

...suggestions for Ukraine (moving from west to east):

http://www.soloveyonline.com/eu2/concept/ukraine.gif

1. Change borders of Red Rus (Ruthenia, if u absolutely must, but it does sound strange to us, so-called 'ruthenians'), Volyn and Chelm. Historically, Galicia (Red R.) and Volyn were apprx. the same size.

2. Change borders of Podolia and Braclav - they never extended that far north and east.

3. Remove Kiev province. Ukraine should have Kiev as capitol, it makes no sense to keep them separate. Just because Russians got Kiev in the peace of Andrusov it should not be represented as its own province.

4. Instead of adding Kiev province, add one to Zaporozhie. Zaporozhian lands extended to both sides of the river Dnieper. A two province Zaporozhia will be historical and more fun to play, if someone designs a scenario for it. I am not sure about the names for these two provinces, any suggestions are welcome. Some variants: W. Zaporozhie - E. Zaporozhie, Kryvyy Rih - Zaporozhie. Still researching the subject.

5. Made Cherson area smaller. I do like the name, since the city has been there forever. Jedisan was rather temporary.

6. Enlarged Pereyaslavl province at expense of Chernigov. More historical border.

7. Migulinskaya is a very modern name. I am sure you took it from Vicky. Don province would make more sense as for the most time of EU2 timeframe it was controlled by Don Cossacks.

8. Rename Novgorod-Severski to Sloboda. Possibly break Sloboda into Belgorod and Sloboda. Different border variants are suggested. Sloboda was to the south of the city of Belgorod and to the south west of the city of Voronezh.

9. Extended Taurida a bit to the east. Crimean Tatars did control the mouth of the river Don for a long, long time.

This is it for now. Please let me know your thoughts.
 

unmerged(34273)

First Lieutenant
Sep 13, 2004
289
0
Hallsten said:
Sure is, but could you make Kexholm lean a little less? Look at my map for reference, it's pretty accurate... :)

The border of kexholm should be just slightly east of your current one making savolax somwhat bigger. Then the borders will follow those of the peace of Nöteborg.
 

Archaalen

Colonel
40 Badges
Mar 19, 2003
1.135
0
Visit site
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Victoria 2
  • War of the Roses
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis III: Collection
  • Humble Paradox Bundle
  • Magicka 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Knights of Pen and Paper 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Teleglitch: Die More Edition
  • Age of Wonders: Shadow Magic
  • Age of Wonders
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Deluxe edition
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall - Revelations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Ancient Space
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Knights of Pen and Paper +1 Edition
  • Magicka
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Rome Gold
  • Sengoku
This has nothing to do with the current discussion, but I was wondering if the events allowing the Golden Horde to become Crimea if it doesn't form have been put back in yet. This was something that I liked and someone said was being put back in. Does anyone know?
 

Norrefeldt

Porphyrogenitus
Aug 1, 2001
7.433
0
Visit site
Last map piece for Europe.
There might still be some very minor changes here and there, but the version that is already out is sufficient basis for publishing in the various threads. No time to lose. Try to focus on the issues at hand, changes to the map are very very likely to be included in the first release. It will all be for later releases.
For this thread, just discuss provinces numbered in white! The rest will be in other threads. Maps without the chicken scratch will replace this one as soon as I get my hands on it.

We need help with
  • Make conversion list for old ID - new ID(s). This will be used for converting knownprovinces lists in 300 country files. They should be configured like this to be readble to Aegnor's program:

    One old to one new conversion:
    Code:
    oldID1-newID1 #Old name
    oldID2-newID2 #Old name
    oldID3-newID3 #Old name
    etc..
    One old to multiple new conversion:
    Code:
    oldID1-newID1 #Old name
    oldID1-newID2 
    oldID1-newID3 
    etc..
    One old can convert into several new ones, but never the opposite! It's no exact science as it's only for this sole purpose.
    If there is no new one that fits, as if it's been covered in PTI, write 0.
  • Make the province.csv entries.
  • Make the 1419.inc entries. (Not the knownprovinces part.)
  • Make revolt.txt entries.
As default provinces coming from a split old EU2 province in the new map get the combined tax values of the old one +1. Countries need to invest some to get the value out of the provinces, and this addition is an easy way to make up for it. There's already too much manpower on the map, and armies are several times the historical ones, and require no investment, so I don't think manpower should be affected. This formula is best applied to regions, like all provinces on this map piece.

Example: A region of old provinces had combined tax value X. Y new provinces added to the area gives a combined tax values on the new map X+2Y.

 
Last edited:

unmerged(5145)

Attractive Nuisance
Jul 31, 2001
120
0
Visit site
Norrefeldt said:
Same as above. Note that there are two provinces with same ID 850: Samoyedia and Kimakia. Will be fixed.[/QUOTE=Norrefeldt]

Shouldn't province 1220 (Wusuli) be split into 2 or more provinces for gameplay reasons, to enable a port to be available for Russia even if China, Japan or Manchu starts colonizing?
 

Norrefeldt

Porphyrogenitus
Aug 1, 2001
7.433
0
Visit site
spikebrennan said:
Norrefeldt said:
Same as above. Note that there are two provinces with same ID 850: Samoyedia and Kimakia. Will be fixed.[/QUOTE=Norrefeldt]

Shouldn't province 1220 (Wusuli) be split into 2 or more provinces for gameplay reasons, to enable a port to be available for Russia even if China, Japan or Manchu starts colonizing?
Perhaps in the next version, I'll keep the comment for then.
My personal opinion is that the map work for AGCEEP is so slow, that indefinitely adding changes to what we got is the same as effectively cancelling the whole project. (But we'll have a perfect theory of a map ;) ) As unsatisfying as this may seem I think we should just try to get it out and playable ASAP. AGCEEP is very good at bugfixing. :D