New impassible barriers in 1.19? Bad or good?

[Metz]

The mountains in northern Bulgaria could also help shield Wallachia and Moldovia a bit more:

 

[Demetrios]

I agree with several other posters here, while I like the new mountain wastelands in general, there should be a Savoy - Piedmont link!

 

[jebates]

I love all the new provinces, although there might be a few places in the map where they could be reduced in order to expand elsewhere. But the poor Switzerland area looks even worse off now. West Switzerland/North Savoy should be Arpitan (French) and Savoy should start with French culture and have the option to change it by event. Wallis was basically wasteland in game terms- maybe replace it with Ticino? Bring back multicultural Switzerland!

It's also real strange that Geneva isn't represented in game (although its development is given to Savoie province). Savoy never held it in anything but brief vassalage in game terms. I think its development should be given to Vaud province as that's basically where the city is situated anyway. Having no Piedmont/Savoie link just seems crazy.

 

[SchwarzerKaiser]

I find them interesting. Curious to see how they will work in the game and what strategic possibilities they'll give.
Aesthetically, they are horrible, especially the alpine wastelands. I prefer them the way WeissRaben drew them, they look so much better, a bit more subtle and less like blobs. I'm sure they'd create neater borders that way.

 

[Metz]

I also think that impassable terrain would look better as small gray strips that get colored in based on who owns what province next to them. They could be thicker though for larger mountain chains such as the ones in Norway, the Andes, and the Himalayas.

 

[TheDungen]

The mountains in northern Bulgaria could also help shield Wallachia and Moldovia a bit more:

Is that nessecery though? I usually never see them fall to the ottomans anyway. Mostly just to the hungarians.

 

[petertel123]

Would be nice to see Spain yellow for once instead of blue

 

[Dracolithfiend]

I usually see Spain form and hold Iberia. France usually derps around in northern Italy being a afraid to take on major powers. Ottomans usually take Wallachia, southern Hungary, Moldavia, and southern Poland/Lithuania. Maybe every game I've played sing 1.8 is the exception?

 

[Wagonlitz]

Arpitan (French)

Pretty sure that Arpitan was/is a separate langauge which developed from Latin on the same footing as e.g. Italian, French, and Spanish. I.e. directly descended from Latin and not through any of the others. Though I could be wrong.

 

[Metz]

Any opinions on including the Dinaric Alps in the west Balkans?

 

[Zerodv]

Any opinions on including the Dinaric Alps in the west Balkans?

They are quite pathetic compared to others, plus what exactly would they block?

 

[Calanon]

Any opinions on including the Dinaric Alps in the west Balkans?

I'm against it, unlike the other mountain ranges the Dinaric Alps are much more crossable by armies.

 

[Metz]

They are quite pathetic compared to others, plus what exactly would they block?

Spoiler

The main mountain passes of the Dinaric Alps are:
Postojna Gate (Postojnska vrata), Slovenia (606 m or 1,988 ft)
Vratnik pass, Croatia (850 m or 2,789 ft)
Debelo brdo, Serbia (1,094 m or 3,589 ft)
Knin Gate (Kninska vrata), Croatia (about 700 m or 2,297 ft)
Vaganj, Croatia/Bosnia-Herzegovina (1,137 m or 3,730 ft)
Ivan-Saddle (Ivan-sedlo), Bosnia-Herzegovina (967 m or 3,173 ft)
Cemerno, Bosnia-Herzegovina (1,329 m or 4,360 ft)
Crkvine, Montenegro (1,045 m or 3,428 ft)
Cakor, Montenegro (1,849 m or 6,066 ft)

Ruins of fortresses dot the mountainous landscape, evidence of centuries of war and the refuge the Dinaric Alps have provided to various armed forces. During the Roman period, the Dinarides provided shelter to the Illyrians resisting Roman conquest of the Balkans, which began with the conquest of the eastern Adriatic coast in the 3rd century BC. Rome conquered the whole of Illyria in 168 BC, but these mountains sheltered Illyrian resistance forces for many years until the area's complete subjugation by 14 AD. More recently, the Ottoman Empire failed to fully subjugate the mountainous areas of Montenegro. In the 20th century, too, the mountains provided favourable terrain for guerrilla warfare, with Yugoslav Partisans organising one of the most successful Allied resistance movements of World War II

Basically it may either protect coastline settlements (Venice, Montenegro, or Ragusa for instance) or it may make it hard for invaders to move inland if invading from the coast.

 

[Zerodv]

Spoiler

The main mountain passes of the Dinaric Alps are:
Postojna Gate (Postojnska vrata), Slovenia (606 m or 1,988 ft)
Vratnik pass, Croatia (850 m or 2,789 ft)
Debelo brdo, Serbia (1,094 m or 3,589 ft)
Knin Gate (Kninska vrata), Croatia (about 700 m or 2,297 ft)
Vaganj, Croatia/Bosnia-Herzegovina (1,137 m or 3,730 ft)
Ivan-Saddle (Ivan-sedlo), Bosnia-Herzegovina (967 m or 3,173 ft)
Cemerno, Bosnia-Herzegovina (1,329 m or 4,360 ft)
Crkvine, Montenegro (1,045 m or 3,428 ft)
Cakor, Montenegro (1,849 m or 6,066 ft)



Basically it may either protect coastline settlements (Venice, Montenegro, or Ragusa for instance) or it may make it hard for invaders to move inland if invading from the coast.

So what would it block at the end? You have too many passes to block any in game province.

 

[Regaccio]

Mods like MEIOU & Taxes have had these for years and I think they're a great idea. They not only help defenders funnel attackers through specific points but they're just more realistic. You shouldn't be able to move troops en masse across an inhospitable desert, or over mountain peaks. And if there are mountain or desert passes, those can be reflected as "straits" in between otherwise isolated land provinces, so that anyone attacking from them or into them gets a hefty penalty.

 

[Chagall]

I love them! Now natural borders are really powerful, much more realistic
The only thing that seems strange to me is that Savoy is completely separated from Piedmont, so if Savoy loses his foothold in Switzerland (that is what happened historically) there is no way to reach the other part of the duchy without asking access to France or Switzerland...
Also I read that this feature has not been implemented for Andes mountains, I hope they will find a way to place this wastelands without screw Incas gameplay...

imo there should be more freedom of movement in the HRE. Split territory like with Savoy, Austria or Prussia was common and they did march their armies around when necessary. Being able to core through it just like with vassal would be good as well. But this is a topic for another day.

 

[Steph]

Being from Savoy (see Avatar), I think it is important to have a link between Piemont and Savoy.
But I also think the Alps could be difficult to cross for and invading army.

So why not add the concept of "mountain pass": keep the Alps as they are in the screenshot, but add a special graphic feature (a like straight) to indicate mountain passes.

A mountain pass can be crossed freely, but only if you control both sides.

So Savoy could move freely from Savoy to Piemont. But if Savoy is invaded, then they invader couldn't go straight to Piemont?

 

[Dafuka72]

Pretty sure that Arpitan was/is a separate langauge which developed from Latin on the same footing as e.g. Italian, French, and Spanish. I.e. directly descended from Latin and not through any of the others. Though I could be wrong.

You're right.

A mountain pass can be crossed freely, but only if you control both sides.

So Savoy could move freely from Savoy to Piemont. But if Savoy is invaded, then they invader couldn't go straight to Piemont?

I think it's possible to manage it with a fort in Savoy (as Montmélian in reality) with the ZoC mechanism, blocking access from France until it will be taken.

 

[Zerodv]

Being from Savoy (see Avatar), I think it is important to have a link between Piemont and Savoy.
But I also think the Alps could be difficult to cross for and invading army.

So why not add the concept of "mountain pass": keep the Alps as they are in the screenshot, but add a special graphic feature (a like straight) to indicate mountain passes.

A mountain pass can be crossed freely, but only if you control both sides.

So Savoy could move freely from Savoy to Piemont. But if Savoy is invaded, then they invader couldn't go straight to Piemont?

That doesn´t make much sense, you already have many terrain penalties for the enemy with mountains when you own them