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TRP is on the top of my list too. WiF would make the game seriously limited and accurate. I want a little more realistic combat, so it wouldn't be total infra whoring and mass attacks... you know what I mean. 
But still some freedom for the players.
One of my suggestions... which apparently nobody likes... Would be to leave Germany to the AI. Make the difficulty very hard and furious, take DAIM or WiF and then we against the evil Germany. Like Firestorm's AAR, it's so cool!
...But everyone so far, are against the idea, so ok, TRP ftw!
But still some freedom for the players. One of my suggestions... which apparently nobody likes... Would be to leave Germany to the AI. Make the difficulty very hard and furious, take DAIM or WiF and then we against the evil Germany. Like Firestorm's AAR, it's so cool!
...But everyone so far, are against the idea, so ok, TRP ftw!
Playing MDS in MP gives you LAG. You fall behind couple of months in a good connection and normal speed.
I say no for WIF and TRP since WIF unbalances the game into the favor of the allies and TRP has a way too effective elastic defense which easily leads to unbreakable fronts (You cant bash trough as you could do in WIF). I also say no to 33 since its the same thing as 36 just that we have to wait 6 years instead of 3 that the war starts.
I am for:
-Kaiserreich (We can include into the rules that the player playing it cant chose the kaiser looks into the future even or just edit the game so one doctrine is disabled).
-Fallout is OK
-Domination of the Draka
-Random scenario
-Fatherland
-Tomorrow the world
-1914
-No WW1 MOD
I am for:
-Kaiserreich (We can include into the rules that the player playing it cant chose the kaiser looks into the future even or just edit the game so one doctrine is disabled).
-Fallout is OK
-Domination of the Draka
-Random scenario
-Fatherland
-Tomorrow the world
-1914
-No WW1 MOD
I disagree, more years mean more chances of an ahistorical outcome. Plus mod-33 is totally different from vanilla. Not that I want to play mod-33, but still.
While I agree that TRP favors the defenders, I think it's still better than winning/losing Barbarossa in the same year. Too short a timeframe to enjoy it. TRP et similia offer a better environment in my opinion. In vanilla it's either black or white, once you lose one, you've lost it all - see Teemu's Barbarossa. With TRP, we could have a decent barbarossa lasting for more than one year, hopefully.
Have you ever tried the WiF multiplayer scen? Maybe if it swings the balance...
Who says that the war starts in -39?
Well Kaiserreich is one option. Althrough balance again...
Just that one huge Draka Empire there? I recall that the mod was still in it's early stages...
Are you serious? :rofl:
That might be cool. Two sides already, so a good balance.
I remember that name from somewhere, but don't really remember the thing... What was the thing in the mod?
What's the point in NOWW1 really? I think 1914 would be way more exciting.
I'm with DVD on this one. Since France nor China will be human, (At least I thought we will go along those lines)... The only thing is the USSR. And I think Germany can pull it off very well, even in TRP. The same mod helps Germany to guard her beaches well and makes air support even more dominant. So I'm strongly for TRP.
DvD-IT-What ahistorical outcomes? There just cant be war before Danzig or the scenario would be unbalanced for Germany, since 38 and 39 are the most important years for it.
And about TRP. I don't see a real way how to play it, since i don't see any way how Germany could break France with all the elastic defense and similar (If a player plays it and UK cooperates). WIF is a way better option in that case (I had a battle lasting half a year and couldn't take the province with over 72 divisions attacking with no penalty non stop).
Storm501-I don't know how it could swing the balance. The game is very unfriendly to axis and commies. One of the things that can really be exploited, is that ground bombardment is almost non functional and therefore Germany cant use it (Which it historically did with great effectiveness). I think also that one of the reasons that Germany lost Barbarossa in our game was for the ground bombardment rule, which is quite stupid per my opinion. If you don't believe me go on wikipedia and write STUKA bomber.
Well the war has to start 39 or the game will be unbalanced.
I don't understand your comment with Draka.
Japan versus Germany
hebelecan-I am against both of them. WIF is a better option then, although we are constantly playing the one and the same 36 (Or 33 which is not a big deal) scenario, which I find quite boring.
And about TRP. I don't see a real way how to play it, since i don't see any way how Germany could break France with all the elastic defense and similar (If a player plays it and UK cooperates). WIF is a way better option in that case (I had a battle lasting half a year and couldn't take the province with over 72 divisions attacking with no penalty non stop).
Storm501-I don't know how it could swing the balance. The game is very unfriendly to axis and commies. One of the things that can really be exploited, is that ground bombardment is almost non functional and therefore Germany cant use it (Which it historically did with great effectiveness). I think also that one of the reasons that Germany lost Barbarossa in our game was for the ground bombardment rule, which is quite stupid per my opinion. If you don't believe me go on wikipedia and write STUKA bomber.
Well the war has to start 39 or the game will be unbalanced.
I don't understand your comment with Draka.
Japan versus Germany
hebelecan-I am against both of them. WIF is a better option then, although we are constantly playing the one and the same 36 (Or 33 which is not a big deal) scenario, which I find quite boring.
Ahistorical outcomes like a White Russia, a fascist Scandinavia or Holland. American civil war, a lot of stuff. What if Germany won't become national socialist, but communist or even democratic instead? ...Balance is a major problem there, but we could get into the action earlier.
As I said, France will be AI, along with China. Also we could agree that the UK won't send any troops to France. (They were pretty minimal anyway) ...As for the USSR, I think a long front like that is more maneuverable. Germany has two summers to reach Stalingrad anyway.
I recall that in these mods ground bombardment has a larger importance. In non-supported land battles organization drops slowly, but a good air support can really help. I don't know if you think that org bombing is as inefficent, but I had the impression that it really does something.
I completely disagree on that. The Germans were encircled under a month, so no ground bombardment would have saved them. The big fight took place in the northern forests and swamps anyway. The Germans tried too much and failed to encircle the Pripyat swamps, althrough they were really close. Air support wouldn't had maked a major difference there, my masses were constantly putting pressure on them.
You mean this? That on one lucky day a Stuka fleet was able to destroy 500 vehicles? A tank division has 1000 tanks in HoI terms, so that would be 50% of it. But surely this involves supply trucks, command units and such. That is represented by org bombing.Wikipedia said:
So if on one lucky day the Germans were able to destroy half of a tank division, that isn't enough to allow a full scale ground bombing that would destroy 100s of divisions (mostly infantry).
This is my comment. So who is going to fight against who, or are we just going to pull off a regular -36 scen here?
Looks like we have a lot of mods to handle here. I think we should take our time and discuss about the mods, drop the most opposed ones along the way. After a few days, Wednesday-Thursday we should have a final mod, or 2 mods at the most. Then we will vote between those mod(s) and vanilla (In case too many people are unhappy with the chosen mod). So then we should have 2-3 days to install the mod, so it should go ok.
TRP or -33 sounds nice btw.
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Ok, a lot of mods, but I suggest that you guys check this out...
http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?t=398368
http://hoi2-worldatwar.freehostia.com/WAW_v1_03.htm
I have been in touch with the mod's creator and he would actually give us this unreleased mod, and even finish it a bit for us. I asked him that if he could get the final improvements done by Friday.
Personally I think that multiplayer mod is just what we are looking for and it's for 1.3b. It will make the pre-war years faster, but still gives plenty of choices. USSR is way more defensive... I could go on forever with this stuff.
I will test it tomorrow and post some screens. But ofc we will still vote, this is just my personal #1.
http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?t=398368
http://hoi2-worldatwar.freehostia.com/WAW_v1_03.htm
I have been in touch with the mod's creator and he would actually give us this unreleased mod, and even finish it a bit for us. I asked him that if he could get the final improvements done by Friday.
Personally I think that multiplayer mod is just what we are looking for and it's for 1.3b. It will make the pre-war years faster, but still gives plenty of choices. USSR is way more defensive... I could go on forever with this stuff.
I will test it tomorrow and post some screens. But ofc we will still vote, this is just my personal #1.
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Hello all, I created the World at War mod that Storm is referring to (he and I have been discussing the mod a bit through PM's). His summary above hits the major points of World at War pretty well. Another big change in the mod is that all the pre-scripted HoI2 events have been removed (such as Danzig or War, MR-Pact, etc); the idea here is that players determine the flow of the war rather than a heavily scripted scenario.
This mod's specifically designed for multiplayer... in fact, it doesn't really play well at all if there aren't players for Germany, UK, Soviet Union, USA, Japan, and Italy. The AI is very passive, little AI minors will no longer drag human majors into wars they don't want (always a problem in MP games I've played in).
It's still in a beta phase, we've only played 1 session so far in an MP game (up to October 1st, 1939). So it may have a few kinks to be worked out, but nothing major so far. I've worked out all issues we ran into during session 1, we're playing a 2nd session this Tuesday and I may make a few modifications then. If you're okay with playing a pretty new mod, though, this is a good one for multiplayer, IMHO. Other nice thing is that with the later start date and the pre-war buildup, it doesn't take massive numbers of sessions to get everyone into the action.
I'll post a link to the latest version sometime later this week (probably Thursday). If you guys decide to go with it, I'll probably try to join up with your sessions here and there as I can (won't be able to do regular Saturday games, but could probably drop in as a minor from time to time), and I'd be happy to address any issues between sessions that may come up.
This mod's specifically designed for multiplayer... in fact, it doesn't really play well at all if there aren't players for Germany, UK, Soviet Union, USA, Japan, and Italy. The AI is very passive, little AI minors will no longer drag human majors into wars they don't want (always a problem in MP games I've played in).
It's still in a beta phase, we've only played 1 session so far in an MP game (up to October 1st, 1939). So it may have a few kinks to be worked out, but nothing major so far. I've worked out all issues we ran into during session 1, we're playing a 2nd session this Tuesday and I may make a few modifications then. If you're okay with playing a pretty new mod, though, this is a good one for multiplayer, IMHO. Other nice thing is that with the later start date and the pre-war buildup, it doesn't take massive numbers of sessions to get everyone into the action.
I'll post a link to the latest version sometime later this week (probably Thursday). If you guys decide to go with it, I'll probably try to join up with your sessions here and there as I can (won't be able to do regular Saturday games, but could probably drop in as a minor from time to time), and I'd be happy to address any issues between sessions that may come up.
I only got one question with the passive AI. Balkan Cluster Fuck. Gonna happen or not?
Nope, no BCF. AI minors won't declare war on their own, only way they get into war is if a human major DOWs them or they are in an alliance that gets pulled into a war.
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