Naval Ship Capture ?

[legitxmalarkeyx]

the majority of ships was sunk or fled tho. Only very few were actually captured compared to the total naval strenght. Germany did also scuttle as much ships as they could before they got overwhelmed. Ships and for that matter planes could easiely escape and join allied forces unless they werent sea worthy or ready to fly or even simple suprised by the enemy.

With tanks and guns it is a different story, since more often than not they were abandoned (even tho against their order) by their crews and left behind. Thats actually how the UK got hands on Tiger 131, which was standing abandoned on a hill in africa.

That stuff aside, they probably dont allow it for balancing purposes to begin with. Imagine germany seizing a rather big chunk of the french navy (including battleships etc) and also a good chunk of their air force. That could easiely snowball out of controll if germany just invades all of europe for example.

To be honest I feel like it should be more situation related like with Spain as I mentioned which in Spain's case could be made an event instead of a flat out mechanic. it just doesn't seem right for the Republican fleet to just scuttle its self If the Nationalist win their both Spanish and scuttling the whole Spanish fleet just seems weird. unless that actually happen in real life then I'll be satisfied. I feel as if I'd have heard about that though?

 

[olm]

There are 3 different things here:
1. Capturing operational ships of hostile country - rare in practice and never happened with capital ships.
2. Capturing ports with half-completed ships in them.
3. Forcing handover of ships as part of surrender or peace treaty.

 

[SchwarzKatze]

There are 3 different things here:
1. Capturing operational ships of hostile country - rare in practice and never happened with capital ships.
2. Capturing ports with half-completed ships in them.
3. Forcing handover of ships as part of surrender or peace treaty.

You forgot
4. Capturing ships abandoned after battle.
Historically, Japan pressed many incapacitated and sunken Dutch and Chinese ships into service. IJN also attempted to capture USS Hornet (CV-8) which was left adrift after towing and later scuttling efforts failed, but in the end it was assessed beyond repair and was finished off instead.

 

[Sic Domine]

To be honest I feel like it should be more situation related like with Spain as I mentioned which in Spain's case could be made an event instead of a flat out mechanic. it just doesn't seem right for the Republican fleet to just scuttle its self If the Nationalist win their both Spanish and scuttling the whole Spanish fleet just seems weird. unless that actually happen in real life then I'll be satisfied. I feel as if I'd have heard about that though?

Most Republican ships were either captured or fled.

 

[Kitsuka]

This is all great stuff and all, but at the end of the day it depends on what the devs say. What do they say on the matter?

Personally I think it would be it would be unrealistic for the entire enemy fleet to be captured after a country surrendered. Once they surrendered I think there should be an event that says what happens to their fleet. Some would be scuttled, a few captured, and others would join another country as a volunteer force. I think the same idea should be true for all military units.

 

[Nicolas I]

Imagine capturing the whole Swiss fleet, that would be a game changer !

 

[Donkey Kong]

Often ships sunk in port could be repaired.

Which ships were sunk, captured, repaired and brought into service? I know the Americans raised ships at Pearl, but I doubt anyone raised CAPTURED ships and used them against their previous owners.

As for the topic: It's not a good idea, in my opinion. It may seriously change the balance of power if germany captures 8 battleships in Brest.

 

[mackintosh]

I can't think of many scuttled, captured ships returned to service. The only mass scuttling/salvage operations I can think of was the German High Seas fleet at Scapa Flow and the scuttling of the French fleet at Toulon. At Scapa Flow most (all?) of the scuttled ships were eventually recovered and scrapped. Those vessels that survived were transferred to other nations, but they also were subsequently broken up. At Toulon, several cruisers were recovered by Italy and served with their fleet. None of the capital ships scuttled there survived.

There may be other examples, but only those two come to my mind off the top of my head.

 

[SchwarzKatze]

Which ships were sunk, captured, repaired and brought into service?

As I have said, Chinese and Dutch ships in Japanese hands.

 

[Axe99]

Which ships were sunk, captured, repaired and brought into service? I know the Americans raised ships at Pearl, but I doubt anyone raised CAPTURED ships and used them against their previous owners.

From what I've looked at so far, the following were taken by the Japanese when they'd been scuttled, sunk, run aground or in a badly damaged state, and returned to service, and are large enough to be in HoI4 (there were other smaller vessels they did similar with):

- a Chinese light cruiser (Ioshima, ex-Ping Hai)
- a British S-class (1917) destroyer (Patrol Boat 101, ex-Thracian)
- a US Clemson-class destroyer (102-go, ex-Stewart)
- the Dutch Destroyer Banckert.

The Germans also used a few ships they captured in the course of their conquests, and the Soviets even start the game with an ex-British submarine that they had refloated after it had been sunk during operations against the Communists after WW1!

Another layer of complexity is that there were some German and Italian submarines in Japanese ports when they surrendered (the Italian subs in Japanese ports were taken over by the Germans when Italy surrendered, then Japan when Germany surrendered) which were seized and used by Japan.