Naval battles: kill or escape

[unmerged(52571)]

After playing USA in the pacific I would propose a tweak in the game mechanic for naval encounters:

If a large fleet with CVs encounters a small fleet like 2DD+3TP then the result of the encounter should be a clear kill or the planes did not find the spotted targets and the small fleet escapes unscratched.

Stacking penalty should not apply because the Admiral will not strike a small fleet with 300+ planes. This is also true for non-CV fleets, nobody will risk friendly BB fire while fighting two small ships.

Technology advances shall influence the hit/miss ratio

Large fleets shall ignore the small ones if they contain loaded transports or have a shore bombardment mission.

I think that such rules can make naval battles more decisive without sinking large fleets in hours like in HOI2.
Any suggestions?

 

[Mortu]

Agree on the no-stacking penalty for large carrier fleet attacking small fleets. Not so sure on the non-carrier fleets: If you detach screens to deal with a destroyer flotilla, there is no guarantee, that your detachment will finish the job. Alternatively, consider FOW: you spot three destoryers. Do you know there are only these three? Will you detach escort cruisers to kill them and risk being pounced by more ships from the enemy?

HOI/AOD is not a tactical game, so we have no choice but to accept combat generalization.

 

[unmerged(652)]

I just got an idea for carriers - could the stacking penalty be tied to doctrine techs? So that on early techs, you cannot operate more than maybe 2 CVs together effectively but later on you can handle more and more? (Historically I believe the Japanese at the start of the war had trained to handle larger CV groups whereas the Americans could barely operate two CVs together in the same task force.)

(Amphibious invasion has a penalty tied to tech level, so it should be possible to set up something similar for CVs.)

 

[Titan79]

(Amphibious invasion has a penalty tied to tech level, so it should be possible to set up something similar for CVs.)

OMG, I play HoI2 since so much time and didn't ever noticed that...? What is it, please?

 

[walrus]

OMG, I play HoI2 since so much time and didn't ever noticed that...? What is it, please?

Intitially it is 3, but one of the doctrines on the Base Strike tree upgrades that to 6, IIRC. There may be one more that ups it to 8, but I can't quite remember

 

[Fürstbischof]

(Amphibious invasion has a penalty tied to tech level, so it should be possible to set up something similar for CVs.)

OMG, I play HoI2 since so much time and didn't ever noticed that...? What is it, please?

Intitially it is 3, but one of the doctrines on the Base Strike tree upgrades that to 6, IIRC. There may be one more that ups it to 8, but I can't quite remember

Yes, that's correct:

FIB
-Fleet in Beeing (1938) 4 divs
-Maritime Power (1944) 5 divs

BS
-Base Strike (1938) 4 divs
-Massive Strike (1943) 5 divs
-Amphibous Operations Doctrine (1952) 8 divs

SLI
-no change -> max 3 divs

 

[DarkSoul1984]

If a large fleet with CVs encounters a small fleet like 2DD+3TP then the result of the encounter should be a clear kill or the planes did not find the spotted targets and the small fleet escapes unscratched.

A clear kill on DDs? The tiny targets that are very fast and maneuverable? The sort of target that not a single aviator in all of WW2 was even consistently proficient at hitting when it was actually moving under its own power at sea and not tied up in port?

 

[Murkk]

I just wish there was a way to remove super fleets from the game. They totally ruin the naval meta game ATM, in the same way super stacks ruined ground combat in ARM.

 

[DarkSoul1984]

So far, the only super fleets I am noticing are those put together by the human player.

The AI has never thrown anything more than 24 ship fleets at me, and they always contain 4 or less CVs.

 

[Sturmwrath231]

The fleet battles do drive me nuts some times..the Dutch had some really annoying 2-4 destroyer fleets that kept killing my IJN transports and all my battle groups were struggling to engage them for 6-8 months. If felt like whack-a-mole for a while.

 

[unmerged(172138)]

This is my idea:
each carrier have one squadron of planes.
when a carrier group attacks ships , the number of squadron(carriers) envolved depends on the type and number of ships.
For example
3CV attacking 2 Destoyes one CV is envolved in the battle ( assuming one squad of planes can easily handle 3 destroyers)
3CV attacking 4 Destoyes two CVs is envolved in the battle ( assuming one squad of planes can easily handle 3 destroyers)
3CV attacking 1 Destoryer and 1 BB all cv's will be envolved in battle ( the BB will be attacked by 2 squads).


Before attacking the capital ships, the CV's should disorganise/sink the screens.

 

[DarkSoul1984]

Before attacking the capital ships, the CV's should disorganise/sink the screens.

That flies in the face of pretty much every carrier doctrine.

 

[DarkSoul1984]

The fleet battles do drive me nuts some times..the Dutch had some really annoying 2-4 destroyer fleets that kept killing my IJN transports and all my battle groups were struggling to engage them for 6-8 months. If felt like whack-a-mole for a while.

What year was it and what was the composition of the battle groups involved?