Native Policies - Which one is the most effective?

[Subai]

If Trade Policy was working (and they haven't patched in the last few hours, have they?) then I'd almost certainly take that always. I'd much rather have better colonies than more of them, it's easy enough to lock at least Africa down early.

Not quite sure I understood what you meant there?

You got that right. But as I wrote with editing my last post I would prefer repression especially in early stages. Oh and I have to mention that I think of MP games while talking about that.

And thank you Golladan for the detailed summary. Again.
Thanks to everyone. Now I think I got it.

 

[Isaios]

that I think of MP games

Yeah, for MP, I'd almost certainly go with Repression, but in MP I tend to shy away from Colonizers, I find it too fiddly for the no-pause rules I most often play with XD

 

[Subai]

Yeah, for MP, I'd almost certainly go with Repression, but in MP I tend to shy away from Colonizers, I find it too fiddly for the no-pause rules I most often play with XD

Nah, my MP group is more a 'have fun' and no 'get the best out of it' one. So my aim for the upcoming game (with RNW) is to get a bloody colonisation empire with the theocracy of Münster. (No big nations being played)

 

[ThePatriotOfDreumel]

You mean trade, right? Because France's bonuses, combined with the trade bonuses, make it just as safe as co-existance.

Yeah, I meant trade.

 

[Cymsdale]

If you have the Coexistence policy, you can get these events:

Yeah, I noticed I'd get a few of these reduced ferocity events while I had coexistence and I wondered why I should care. While you have the policy active, the ferocity is effectively zero, and it's not like you are going to switch policy often enough for it to matter at all.

 

[heliostellar]

Yeah, I noticed I'd get a few of these reduced ferocity events while I had coexistence and I wondered why I should care. While you have the policy active, the ferocity is effectively zero, and it's not like you are going to switch policy often enough for it to matter at all.

In order for it to matter, you would need to have a colony not turned into a city long enough that you've eroded all of the ferocity to zero in many colonies and then switch to Ruthless to speed up the colonization process. It's kind of pointless, since you'd have to artificially slow down their growth to allow this strategy to work. It would be just as well to pick one strategy and stick with it.

 

[LastSalian]

The event "Natives Encountering our Colonies" cannot trigger if you have the DLC. The Native Policy system takes over what this event did.

If you have the Repression policy, you can get these events:
Native Raids - Requires at least 5 aggressiveness, 300 natives, no units in province, colony of at least 200. Allows you to increase aggressiveness and ferocity, but reduce number of natives and slightly lower colony size. Or slightly increase aggressiveness and ferocity at the cost of a larger number of settlers.
Native Exploitation - Requires at least 500 natives, colony less than 200 settlers. Lower the amount of natives in the province, and give you a country modifier that lowers settler chance and growth, or pay 40 ducats and get a modifier that increases settler chance and growth.
Colonial Expansion - Requires ruler with MIL 2, and a neighboring province owned by you. Increase the number of settlers in the colony by 200, pay 30 ducats, and get a country modifier that slightly increases settler chance and growth. Or increase the number of settlers in the colony by 50 and get a modifier that lowers colony growth.

If you have the Trading policy, you can get these events:
Lucrative Trade - Requires at least 50% trade efficiency, and a neighboring colony owned by you. Option to gain 50 ducats, or a modifier on the province that gives trade power for some time and 10 ducats, or gain 20 diplo points.
Spread of Disease - Requires less than 200 settlers, and at least 500 natives. Same effect as Native Exploitation above

If you have the Coexistence policy, you can get these events:
Religious Influences (protestants) - If you're Protestant and the province isn't, and less than 4 aggressiveness. Option to increase the aggressiveness and ferocity of the province as well as change the religion of a colony to protestant. Or lower the aggressiveness and ferocity of the province. Useless event if you ask me...
Religious Influences (catholics) - If you're Catholic and the province isn't, and less than 4 aggressiveness. Option to increase the aggressiveness and ferocity of the province as well as change the religion of a colony to catholic. Or lower the aggressiveness and ferocity of the province. Useless event if you ask me...
Spread of Disease - Same as Spread of Disease above.

You can get these events regardless of the policy you pick:
Native Assimilation in [province name] - Requires a unit stationed in the province, and at least 300 natives. Increases the number of settlers by 100.
Accommodation with Natives in [province name] - Requires a unit stationed in the province OR the Coexsistence policy. Also requires at least 300 natives, 1 ferocity, and 1 aggressiveness. Lowers the ferocity of the natives in the province (useless if you're running Coexistence).

Very illustrative. Thank you. The wiki should be updated with that information.

So in summary:

• Repression policy if you wanna colonize as fast as possible.
• Trading policy if you want to increase the value of your provinces. Example: Definitely Asian colonizers. Maybe Russia and Incas?
• Coexistence policy if you just don't have enough troops to protect your colonies, or you just want to forget about them. Example: small nations.

 

[heliostellar]

Very illustrative. Thank you. The wiki should be updated with that information.

So in summary:

• Repression policy if you wanna colonize as fast as possible.
• Trading policy if you want to increase the value of your provinces. Example: Definitely Asian colonizers. Maybe Russia and Incas?
• Coexistence policy if you just don't have enough troops to protect your colonies, or you just want to forget about them. Example: small nations.

Trading policy if you want to increase the value of your provinces. Example: Definitely Asian colonizers. Maybe Russia and Incas? Or if you're France, whose national idea will make this equivalent to Coexistence in terms of uprisings, but still retain the benefits of Trading.

 

[Pornek]

I dont think outside of France trading policy is worth anything, even as asian colonizer. Id rather set up the colony faster or be able to use my troops elsewhere. Effectively getting neither doesnt sound too convincing.

 

[Golladan]

I dont think outside of France trading policy is worth anything, even as asian colonizer. Id rather set up the colony faster or be able to use my troops elsewhere. Effectively getting neither doesnt sound too convincing.

If you're playing a new world nation, specially in the RNW, you might want to take Trading over Coexistence. You're going to be getting the benefit of the increased trade goods yourself. And the native uprisings are pretty rare with the -50%. Even rarer if you add in the -25% of one of the Estate interactions. Repression might kick start you up faster in the colonization game. But eventually you'll get to a point where you colonize fast enough without it.

 

[Ricox]

honestly i never bother with any policy besides coexistance

it's something about being really tired of squashing these natives all the time that has been probably, by far, my biggest pet peeve with colonization

i will always take coexistence regardless of anything, it's not like i, as the player, won't dominate the AI anyway that i would so desperately need the other policies, although people going for maximum conquest/territorial landgrab or wc should probably use the +20 settler growth idea until tech advances to the point where the 20 bonus is barely noticeable, early game it can change a lot.

 

[LastSalian]

Trading policy if you want to increase the value of your provinces. Example: Definitely Asian colonizers. Maybe Russia and Incas? Or if you're France, whose national idea will make this equivalent to Coexistence in terms of uprisings, but still retain the benefits of Trading.

I dont think outside of France trading policy is worth anything, even as asian colonizer. Id rather set up the colony faster or be able to use my troops elsewhere. Effectively getting neither doesnt sound too convincing.

So coincidentally playing with France and thought about it carefully. As France putting 3k stack here and there doesn't make any difference and it gives you the +100 population event every now and then. Therefore as France I went with the Repression policy.

BTW problem with 100% native assimilation as France is the -75% autonomy for colonies which make native assimilation bonus insignificant. Think it should also increase manpower as it used to to be more appealing.

That said, in my testing a province with 8K native population like Gold Coast gave me an additional 0.4 goods produced, which was way more than the base value of 0.25. That's why I'd think it might be great for Asian colonizers.

 

[yerm]

If the production bonus is meaningless because distant overseas, what's the point of the colony in the first place? I mean really, I don't like using trading policy myself, yet at least I can logically see its value. Are you colonizing just for the sake of doing it? Are you just painting? Saying that extra goods produced is relatively meaningless is a foolish statement, because by that logic setting up another colony is exactly equally relatively meaningless. If the % of produced goods is higher than the % faster growth of colonies from repression, and all you really care about is the goods produced for trade income, what's the point of repression? I guess I just don't understand this whole line of argument - if the distant overseas makes it meaningless to get a boost, what's the point of the colony in the first place?

Meanwhile, I'm pretty much exclusively running coexistence and enjoying 0% maintenance when at peace and 100% FL when at war. I simply have not encountered a situation recently where I feel like it is optimal to actually maintain a native policing force.

 

[Pornek]

Since goods produced is not affected by autonomy and tradevalue of a province is just GP x price of good, it increases the value of the node the colony is in. Which in return will offer more income when steering from the node.

 

[heliostellar]

So coincidentally playing with France and thought about it carefully. As France putting 3k stack here and there doesn't make any difference and it gives you the +100 population event every now and then. Therefore as France I went with the Repression policy.

BTW problem with 100% native assimilation as France is the -75% autonomy for colonies which make native assimilation bonus insignificant. Think it should also increase manpower as it used to to be more appealing.

That said, in my testing a province with 8K native population like Gold Coast gave me an additional 0.4 goods produced, which was way more than the base value of 0.25. That's why I'd think it might be great for Asian colonizers.

Well, technically the assimilation mechanic is broken in this patch, so that's why you're thinking the bonus is insignificant... It's actually nonexistent ATM.

 

[PlotVitalNPC]

Was France's bonus to the effects of native assimilation always +50%? I remember the old version of the idea being 50% uprising chance, doubled bonus from assimilation.
Then again, with trading policy, they've effectively got coexistence + doubling the effect of the natives, before you consider getting clergy aid in the colony...

 

[LastSalian]

Well, technically the assimilation mechanic is broken in this patch, so that's why you're thinking the bonus is insignificant... It's actually nonexistent ATM.

It's fixed in the beta 1.14.4

 

[Isaios]

BTW problem with 100% native assimilation as France is the -75% autonomy for colonies which make native assimilation bonus insignificant. Think it should also increase manpower as it used to to be more appealing.

Local Autonomy does not affect Goods Produced. The point is to increase the Trade Value of a node, not that piddly little Production income.

 

[heliostellar]

It's fixed in the beta 1.14.4

And it's still that underwhelming?

 

[LastSalian]

And it's still that underwhelming?

Definitely underwhelming for most of the nations. For an 8K native population, you get 0.6 additional goods produced. Would be worth to try it out with Asian colonizers, Russia and Incas, though.

Local Autonomy does not affect Goods Produced. The point is to increase the Trade Value of a node, not that piddly little Production income.

True. Still not convinced it's better than Repressive + 3K stacks. In the colonial race, the faster, the better... unless you can get normal provinces rather than overseas.