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Doomdark

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Well, you have certainly chosen a touchy subject. Let us hope that this thread does not turn ugly. ;)

While a world without borders is certainly a beautiful thought, it--like oh so many other utopian dreams--is like a delicious cake with a tactical nuke inside. Take a bite and everything will blow up in your face.

Why can't we just open the borders and institute a world government then? I foresee the following problems:

1) Humans are territorial by nature. We stake out our claim and everything inside is ours. We want to own things, we want a spot to call home, we want to belong to a group of people who are similar to ourselves.

2) Considering the vast cultural differences between the countries of the world people would feel that their ethics and lifestyle were being trampled by the edicts and laws of the federal government.

3) The bureaucracy needed to govern the whole world would have to be of titanic proportions. Recalling the problems that the EU is having and the Soviet Union had we can extrapolate the terrible ineffectiveness of a world government.

4) (This is controversial.) Some cultures are simply better than others. The Western sphere has more beneficial ethics to the advancement of society and respect for law than the Eastern and third world cultures.

On to nationalism. Nationalism is a powerful romantic archetype that strikes a chord in most people's souls. It feels good to belong to a culture you can feel proud of. A culture that has rich traditions and peculiar traits that clearly set it apart from others. Symbols and rituals can be devised to reinforce this division between nations. Like most ideals, nationalism can turn ugly if it crosses the line to supremism.

However, even supremist nationalism can be beneficient. Most people would probably agree that the Roman Empire did more good than harm to its conquered provinces, since it forced its superior culture on barbarian neighbors (excepting Egypt and Greece).

Is nationalism a purely modern (18th century) invention? Of course not! It was merely fanned by the new powerful national bureaucracies that grew at a pace with the industrial revolution. The ancient Chinese were nationalists, just as the Egyptians, the Romans and the Sumerians for all we know.

The chaos following the fall of Rome and the checkerwork of wandering tribes smothered nationalism until it could eventually re-emerge stronger than ever.

I am a nationalist and I am not ashamed to say it. However, the traits that I find most admirable about my country and my culture are weakening. In many ways, this is a deliberate process that is going on not just in Sweden, but all across Europe and in the USA. It may either lead to the decline of Western civilization (as I fear) or to something new and better.

Ok, hit me! :)

/Doomie
 

Doomdark

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I visited your homepage a while back and so was a little bit surprised to read the above. That's because on your homepage you bash the Christian ethics that make up our society and lean more towards the oriental/new age thoughts and ethics...

Heheh, I haven't updated that page in a long time and my views might have changed somewhat. Anyway, looking at the heart of Christianity, Jesus said very little that I disagree with. However, I can't stomach any form of censorship or 'moral majority' movements.

Christian ethics are not enough to explain the growth of western civilization though. Lex Romana was also an important cornerstone.

/Doomie
 

Doomdark

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Christian,

Those were the days..... to bad that Scandinavia didn't become one country. Not alone are we all Scandinavian brothers, but we would also have been one mighty nation!!

It is never too late... IMO, the EU could go frag itself if we had a healthy Scandinavian Union movement! (Including, of course, Finland, Iceland, Greenland and possibly the Baltic States.) When do we begin? ;)

/Doomie
 

Doomdark

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Yndenwal,

A great history of Union and friendship, heh? Well, from one Denmark, we now have Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Iceland, Finland, Greenland and soon Feroe...

The key phrase you use is 'one Denmark'. The Danish kings treated the Union of Kalmar as a kind of greater Denmark with first and second class citizens. No attempts were made to integrate the three kingdoms. Also, remember that Finland (Eastern Sweden) was cut from Sweden by force. There is nothing to say that our unity would not have lasted.

A true Scandinavian Union would require a different approach--one of integration--but despite past conflicts it would be a very natural thing. Danish, Swedish and Norwegian are closely related languages that could probably be brought even closer together by common media and education.

I definitely think that a Union would be to our benefit. We would have Norwegian energy, Danish foodstuffs, Swedish and Finnish industry and raw materials, and land aplenty. Not to mention that together we would have some true political clout.

Best of all, a 'United States of Scandinavia' is actually feasible (unlike the European ditto). ;)

Unfortunately, there are great outside interests that would probably do everything in their power to stop a hypothetical Scandinavian Union. Neither EU, nor NATO, nor Russia would like to see the formation of such a political entity.

/Doomie
 

Doomdark

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AdMartin

Actually, in parts of Estonia the people speak Swedish and political relations (using a game term) are quite good. Swedish companies also invest quite a lot in the Baltic states.

True. Also, let us not forget that the Estonian language is close to Finnish. Furthermore, both Estonia and Latvia have had strong ties to Scandinavia in the past (ahem), and would probably welcome membership in a Scandinavian Union if they cannot join the NATO as full members.