National Ideagroups - 23rd of October A - Mughals & Timurids

National Ideagroups - 23rd of October A - Mughals & Timurids

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They both shared one ideagroup previously, now they have two separate.

Timurids
Traditions
Income from Vassals: +25.0% Years of Nationalism: -5
  1. Timurid Architecture: Prestige Decay: -2.0%
  2. The Mantle of the Great Khan: Cavalry Combat Ability: +20.0%
  3. Unleash the Tiger: Cost of Reducing War Exhaustion: -10.0%
  4. Chagatai Literature: Yearly Legitimacy: +1.00
  5. Timurid Renaissance: Technology Cost: -5.0%
  6. Control of the Silk Road: Domestic Trade Power: +25.0%
  7. Build the Largest Mosque in the world: Yearly Prestige: +1.00
Ambition
Discipline: +5.0%



Mughals
Traditions
Cavalry Combat Ability: +20.0% & Core-Creation Cost: -25.0%
  1. An Indian Padishah: Tolerance of Heathens: +3.00 & Religious Unity: +35.0%
  2. The Jagir and Mansabdari Systems: Discipline: +5.0%
  3. Control over the Clergy: Cost of Reducing War Exhaustion: -10.0%
  4. Ibadat Khana - House of Worship: Idea Cost: -10.0%
  5. Zabt System: National Tax Modifier: +10.0%
  6. Mughal Architecture: Yearly Prestige: +1.00
  7. Fatawa-i-Alamgiri: Stability Cost Modifier: -10.0%
Ambition
Technology Cost: -5.0%
 

Castrolol

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Has anything been done for the hordes so the AI is more willing to form the conquest nations? Ever since the (ridiculous) change that required hordes to reform before becoming those nations I haven't seen a single AI Qing or Mughals (nor is there much investment for players to form them). Seeing Timmy blob all across Arabia instead of India is also annoying.
 

hashinshin

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Anyone else find it funny that an idea named "unleash the tiger" is about ... reducing war exhaustion?
 

uishax

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The Mughal ideas are brutal
calvary+core
Super tolerance+unity
5% discipline
Stab and tech reduction.
That's amongst the strongest ideas in the world,

Finally the big nations are seeing some changes, hopefully Qing can see some buffs.
This way India and China have their respective major powers getting some decent ideas.
 

hashinshin

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So I'm comparing the two timurid ideas and it seems it's a nerf, right? Income from vassals basically is useless, while reduced coring cost is suuuper useful, especially early game. Reducing war exhaustion is also terrible irrelevant although useful at the right times.
 

itsuart

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So I'm comparing the two timurid ideas and it seems it's a nerf, right?
Looks as a nerf to me too. It seems PI heavily encouraging Timmy to form Mughals. But that's fine I guess - it's never enough Mughals!

Looking at other NIs, income from vassals is "oh we need to put something here too, eh?"-like stub. But that's fine too. Better this than generic NI.
 

PedroVargas

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So I'm comparing the two timurid ideas and it seems it's a nerf, right? Income from vassals basically is useless, while reduced coring cost is suuuper useful, especially early game. Reducing war exhaustion is also terrible irrelevant although useful at the right times.
Agreed, thought the same. The Timmies now actually have some of the worst horde ideas (considering war & expansion) so forming Mughals seems essential.
 

Rabid

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Mughal ideas are by far the strongest of the new ones we've seen - the only thing they really lack is perhaps a manpower or morale bonus, but the early bonuses and reduced idea cost are just fantastic. Shame the tech bonus doesn't come earlier, though it's obviously still good!
 

Krajzen

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Oh my God, I absolutely adore Mughal ideas.


Timurids are obviously nerfed but

1) They have still solid NI group and

2) THEY NEEDED NERF. Timurids in EU4 were waaaaaaaaay too powerful and had way to long lifetime while Mughals appeared rarely. I like to see these two nations rebalanced :)
 

PhroX

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Agreed, thought the same. The Timmies now actually have some of the worst horde ideas (considering war & expansion) so forming Mughals seems essential.
It's kinda odd, as the Timmy ideas here aren't bad at all, there a solid bunch. It just highlights how good both the existing horde ones and these new Mughal ones are...
 

User4035

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Timurid Renaissance???
You can't just make stuff up, lol.
 

Krajzen

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Demetrios

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Or he could just read up on Ulugh Beg. He has a crater named after him on the Moon, for good reason. It's not often that "leader of a horde nation" and "one of the greatest scientific minds of his century" combine in a single person!
 
Last edited:

Trin Tragula

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Timurid Renaissance???
You can't just make stuff up, lol.
The Timurid renaissance is pretty much the period covered by EU4. Patronization of the arts, sciences, etc was a pretty defining feature of the Timurid dynasty and others tried to emulate them all over the Persianate world. Conquest of new lands however didn't really happen much in this era apart from by Babur (even their greatest leader Abu Said only tried to reconquer Timur's old empire).
Another defining feature was fratricide and patricide but that doesn't really make for a great NI ;-)
 

PhroX

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Hell, even Temur himself, for all the brutality of his conquests, heavily encouraged the arts and sciences to flourish in his heartland around Sammarkand.
 
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lucaluca

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About time!!!! No more free relgious unity for timmies so they can properly crash and burn
 

Mingmung

General
34 Badges
Aug 23, 2014
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  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition