My anti wish list

[BarrosRodrigues]

6) Albania shouldn't ever be able to conquer the world solo in 10 years. I love the sandbox concept but this is done when game mechanics are broken.

I agree with everything except this. I have said 1000th times that it is not the mechanics fault, the problem is the very weak AI that can barely play the game. It does not matter if they make the AI gang up on the player if the AI is brain-dead. I literally declared war on the entire world by mid-1937 as Japan and still managed to conquer ~95% of the world IIRC by 1944 and at that point I decided to take a 3 months break form HOI. I am pretty sure that I would still achieve a WC even if I disbanded my entire army, air force and navy after declaring war to the whole world. Btw EU IV is a game that (at least in theory) is rigged to make the AI gang on the player if he is too aggressive but that does not stop WCs; for example I conquered the world by 1763 starting as a 1 province minor which is more or less the same time that I needed to conquer the world as Albania in HOI III. A much better AI would make WC impossible but the easiest way is to do it with artificial restrictions but that won´t make the game better quite the opposite if you ask me (...)

 

[-Stukov-MK VII]

I agree with everything except this. I have said 1000th times that it is not the mechanics fault, the problem is the very weak AI that can barely play the game. It does not matter if they make the AI gang up on the player if the AI is brain-dead. I literally declared war on the entire world by mid-1937 as Japan and still managed to conquer ~95% of the world IIRC by 1944 and at that point I decided to take a 3 months break form HOI. I am pretty sure that I would still achieve a WC even if I disbanded my entire army, air force and navy after declaring war to the whole world. Btw EU IV is a game that (at least in theory) is rigged to make the AI gang on the player if he is too aggressive but that does not stop WCs; for example I conquered the world by 1763 starting as a 1 province minor which is more or less the same time that I needed to conquer the world as Albania in HOI III. A much better AI would make WC impossible but the easiest way is to do it with artificial restrictions but that won´t make the game better quite the opposite if you ask me (...)

Eh that's fair Barros, I knew that line would bring you out eventually. I will agree with the AI in general. It would be nice if the Ai would ever concentrate force for an attack ever, or simply did not act in a complete idiotic way

Also I agree on artificial restrictions being silly as well, as all they do is mask the problems rather than fix them.

 

[Mr_B0narpte]

I completely agree with the OP and the many comments requesting HoI4 beta to be tested by HoI online players. I know someone who will go out of his way to find all the major game mechanic exploits. He has done so on HoI3, HoI2, AoD, DH, and even Crusader Kings II. I remember him listing exploits in other games I've never heard of. If Paradox do decide to let HoI online players test the beta, I highly recommend they include this guy (I can message you his username - I'm pretty sure he's up for testing HoI4 out).

 

[ZeroMoon17]

I agree with everything except this. I have said 1000th times that it is not the mechanics fault, the problem is the very weak AI that can barely play the game. It does not matter if they make the AI gang up on the player if the AI is brain-dead. I literally declared war on the entire world by mid-1937 as Japan and still managed to conquer ~95% of the world IIRC by 1944 and at that point I decided to take a 3 months break form HOI. I am pretty sure that I would still achieve a WC even if I disbanded my entire army, air force and navy after declaring war to the whole world. Btw EU IV is a game that (at least in theory) is rigged to make the AI gang on the player if he is too aggressive but that does not stop WCs; for example I conquered the world by 1763 starting as a 1 province minor which is more or less the same time that I needed to conquer the world as Albania in HOI III. A much better AI would make WC impossible but the easiest way is to do it with artificial restrictions but that won´t make the game better quite the opposite if you ask me (...)

Eh that's fair Barros, I knew that line would bring you out eventually. I will agree with the AI in general. It would be nice if the Ai would ever concentrate force for an attack ever, or simply did not act in a complete idiotic way

Also I agree on artificial restrictions being silly as well, as all they do is mask the problems rather than fix them.

But think about it this way, if they make an awesome AI so that it acts like a real human, that will kill our MP community, because people won't need to play with other people any more :O.

 

[Mr_B0narpte]

But think about it this way, if they make an awesome AI so that it acts like a real human

If they make such an AI, I think that game would easily become one of the best selling grand strategy games.

 

[Klausewitz]

If they make such an AI, I think that game would easily become one of the best selling grand strategy games.

If they make such an AI they do need to bother with HoI4 any longer.
They just can sell the thing to the highest bidder and retired to their own caribean island.

 

[Secret Master]

If they make such an AI they do need to bother with HoI4 any longer.
They just can sell the thing to the highest bidder and retired to their own caribean island.

If they could build an AI like that, the staff at Paradox would find themselves black-bagged and taken to a secret location, with all of their files and hardware from their office, and with agents from a foreign power demanding all the secrets of this new AI. Failure to disclose those secrets would result in confinement to the Comfy Chair for an unspecified duration.

 

[Beagá]

I will just point out that asking for a better AI is like asking for a cure for cancer. Very easy to ask in the comfy chair.

Now, try doing it yourself.

Also it should be obvious that more complex games mean making a better AI more difficult, but apparently it isn´t. Better to have features adapted for an AI that can use them, than putting tons of stuff only a human will use properly, thus breaking difficulty. Which is why removing divisional leaders was done, for example.

 

[-Stukov-MK VII]

Eh I think the only way to really made the ai any decent is just to let them cheat like hell
Like giving the ai a 400% production bonus of equipment and give them unlimited manpower, of course none of this matters when the soviet ai sends it's entire army to guard Siberia I guess

 

[Kovax]

Eh I think the only way to really made the ai any decent is just to let them cheat like hell
Like giving the ai a 400% production bonus of equipment and give them unlimited manpower, of course none of this matters when the soviet ai sends it's entire army to guard Siberia I guess

...or it sends all 500 divisions to one province to face your lone visible division, and then you bomb the infrastructure around that province out of existence. I recall too many games where the German AI sent over half its army to either Norway or India to starve, then sent more reinforcements when the effective fighting strength dropped. When the AI defeats itself without human assistance, it's neither fun nor challenging. On the other hand, if you make it simple enough for the AI to handle, then we might as well play Risk instead.

 

[-Stukov-MK VII]

Agreed lol

Which is why you gotta play multiplayer man!

 

[callanquinn]

Another thing worth mentioning that I have seen ruin MP games is the whole fleet ping-pong scenario when a fleet runs out of org and is trying to pull out of a sea zone, leading to overstacking and losses that are out f both players hands.. Stukov and others have already covered most of what is wrong in naval combat in regards to MP, but this issue in particular always seems to recur.

 

[Beagá]

Well, maybe do like EU4 and don´t allow to retreat fast? MAybe after 4 hours?

Or allow retreat time to rely on admiral skill. So skill 5 = retreat after 2 hours, skill 0 = 7.

Agreed lol

Which is why you gotta play multiplayer man!

MP isn´t the answer for everyone. It´s extremely time consuming and depends too much on having reliable people to play with. And it´s not like I don´t play online, I probably played some 800 hours of MP Company of Heroes 1 and 2 - it´s so much simpler to play a 40 minute game than a Paradox game...

 

[Beagá]

Ahem, you CAN'T voluntarily retreat to transports Kovax. Walking on to them with a move order is the only way, and once attacked, you're stuck. You can't choose to retreat onto a transport like you can into a neighboring province.

You alo can't load some troops onto the transports while others hold the line and retreat last onto the transports, which is a serious failing in the retreat system IMO.

Wow wow, wait a moment. It´s accurate that some people wouldn´t be able to embark in transports at all. If what you´re proposing is that eventually the last divisions fighting should magically be able to retreat-embark that is BS.

IF a province is overrun while the battle is being fought ALL divisions not embarked SHOULD be lost.

 

[Jazumir]

No, i think he´s proposing that when 4 divs defend a coastel province and you know they will be beaten eventually, that you can volunarily withdraw 3 of them to the transports ashore while the fourth holds the line until the other 3 have embarked. This seems to not be possible atm.

 

[Porkman]

Well, maybe do like EU4 and don´t allow to retreat fast? MAybe after 4 hours?

Or allow retreat time to rely on admiral skill. So skill 5 = retreat after 2 hours, skill 0 = 7.

Like all most of the ideas that anyone suggests for HOI4, the 4 hour retreat delay was already done in Arsenal of Democracy and thus will not be in HOI4.

 

[Beagá]

No, i think he´s proposing that when 4 divs defend a coastel province and you know they will be beaten eventually, that you can volunarily withdraw 3 of them to the transports ashore while the fourth holds the line until the other 3 have embarked. This seems to not be possible atm.

The point still stands, if the 4th division loses and is overrun the 3 other divisions should be destroyed or retain only the strenght they had already embarked, with the rest being lost.

I do hope that embarking is a process that takes time to do. It´s what happened in Dunkirk. There WERE forces holding the line while the retreat was going on.

Also obivously retreating or not should also rely on a decent port that allows evacuation. If you are on a province with level 10 port or mountain province with no port should make a big difference.

 

[brisduv]

I agree with the OP's list. I will add an additional comment about the AI and scenarios in general.

While I agree HOI3 is a very moddable game, it should arrive from the developer 'ready to play' - it shouldn't take users 'fixing' the game just to make it playable. For example whoever creates the various campaign scenarios spend real time researching names of ships, divisions, leaders and geography so I don't have bogus OOB's to try to fix. And scenarios should match each other.

Realistically the AI will never be able to compete with a human as long as you have total control over your units, I prefer this but seems only by letting your lower commanders be as stupid as the AI's (in other words computer control over your tactical moves) will it have any chance. Hopefully there can be some improvement in HOI4.

I often play Italy or Japan from the '36 scenario (TFH) and see the German AI get hung up in Norway or more recently in DENMARK?! I opened up the Denmark AI in Sept' 39 and discovered it had built 2 levels of fortification and upgraded its one division in Copenhagen to level IV. Despite having the strongest Army in the world the German AI couldn't figure out how to capture the one city. It could have bombed using ground attack until it disappeared, it could have assaulted it - but NO HQ was sent to lead the 12 divisions stacked there. SO no attack on the West in 40 and game is basically hosed. Read up on the conquest of Denmark, it lasted one day. I don't have an issue with Denmark player/AI improving its defense, it is realistic if they really wanted to. But the AI didn't use its Navy to land troops on adj. hexes or to bomb it or use even a corp sized HQ to lead the attack.

PLEASE fix this in HOI4! I preordered HOI3 and its given me more playing time probably than any other Paradox game, hope the next version is even better, thanks.

 

[KevinG]

Well, maybe do like EU4 and don´t allow to retreat fast? MAybe after 4 hours?

Or allow retreat time to rely on admiral skill. So skill 5 = retreat after 2 hours, skill 0 = 7.

There already is a minimum retreat time for naval combat in HOI3 that's adjusted for speed and the blockade trait. I believe he was referencing how sometimes when you retreat a fleet, you have no choice on where it retreats to. In these cases, the fleet will always ping pong back between the same 2 provinces every time when retreating, thus leading to you inevitably losing that stack 100% of the time because its stuck in an infinite retreat loop between 2 provinces that you can't break.

 

[Galverizer]

"1) Ninja Landings. "

I didn't play HoI 3 much, but in 1 & 2 there was no problem defending from this. You just put 2-3 inf divisions(lesser axis power) on the ports and it was very hard to take it. And having ports uselly next to each other you could get 6-9 divs there fast. So thats just bad defens if they managed to do that to you.