My 30 Intrigue Spymaster Wife

[LikeNothing]

Relatively new player here.

So I randomly received an Attractive Quick courtier with really good stats, including 30 Intrigue. I made her my Spymaster. We became Lovers and have consistent 100 Opinion of each other. My first wife was perfectly fine, but I like my super hot and super capable Spymaster better and she's also 5 years younger with a nice looking portrait. So I murdered my wife and married my Spymaster, and made her my Regent too. I also got some nice Lover events which made this seem the happiest marriage ever.

Now my youngest brother is a very good military leader with 17 Martial. I conquered a neighboring Duchy with his help, so I landed him in the Duchy. I also made a really good marriage deal for him with an Attractive princess from another kingdom. Just before my youngest brother could get married, he died in suspicious circumstances. Since I was his heir, I inherited his Duchy which was admittedly a nice Duchy.

A quick look in a save file confirmed my suspicion that my darling Spymaster wife killed my little brother. She's not Cruel or Ruthless or Kind or Family Person, just your regular Quick Ambitious Diligent Patient 30 Intrigue Illusive Shadow Spymaster.

Question: Why did she kill my brother? Is it because I was my brother's heir?

Is she going to kill other members of my house? Especially my heir whose mother was my first wife? Is she going to kill me, her liege and lover who raised her from obscurity to the elite of the world? My eldest son and carefully-groomed heir is 14 years old with 13 Intrigue. I have 22 Intrigue. My youngest brother whom my Spymaster wife killed had 3 Intrigue. I have a son by my Spymaster wife who would become my heir if my eldest son dies.

How do I prevent my overpowered Spymaster wife from killing members of my own house? I like her but this killing has got to stop. I give the word for the killings here, not her.

Oh and my Spymaster wife keeps uncovering Plots from my other trusted advisors including my Marshall and my Treasurer. Needless to say I did nothing about those. Is she moving to kill them too?

Please help. I feel trapped.

Edit: Yes she reminds me of Yuno Gasai, who is one of my favorite fictional characters ever. <3

She'd do anything for love. Anything.

Edit: Her portraint is a cute little blonde. Looks a lot like Jennifer Aniston.

She has 30 Intrigue and 22 Diplomacy.

 

[bkerns]

I wouldn't be surprised if she tried to kill your first son so her own could inherit. To prevent this, you could imprison her and just deal with the tyranny and having to find a new spymaster. With her 30 intrigue she might escape though and plot from someone else's court.

Her uncovering other people's plots is her job, it isn't an indication that she wants to move against them.

 

[Beyond Disbelief]

If those sons aren't hers, then yes.

I've personally never given wives spymaster positions but I've seen enough plots from vassals to stay away from it. You're lucky that you manage to become lovers with her, otherwise she'll likely plot your death to install her son.

 

[bkerns]

Don't forget your anniversary.

 

[Beyond Disbelief]

Also, spouses already grant half of their stats to yours. As a councillor, she cannot have her stat counted to more than 1 source, so you lose half her stats in Intrigue as spymaster.

 

[LikeNothing]

I wouldn't be surprised if she tried to kill your first son so her own could inherit. To prevent this, you could imprison her and just deal with the tyranny and having to find a new spymaster. With her 30 intrigue she might escape though and plot from someone else's court.

Her uncovering other people's plots is her job, it isn't an indication that she wants to move against them.

Does my heir's decent (13) Intrigue make him less easy to kill? His wife also has like 18 Intrigue with Grey Eminence. I gave my heir a Court Education too and he's turning 15 in a bit. If he gets Illusive Shadow too would that help him survive?

 

[LikeNothing]

If those sons aren't hers, then yes.

I've personally never given wives spymaster positions but I've seen enough plots from vassals to stay away from it. You're lucky that you manage to become lovers with her, otherwise she'll likely plot your death to install her son.

So it would be a good rule of thumb to marry people with good Traits, but not too high Intrigue?

Also, spouses already grant half of their stats to yours. As a councillor, she cannot have her stat counted to more than 1 source, so you lose half her stats in Intrigue as spymaster.

Actually since her Intrigue is about twice as high as my second highest option, it doesn't affect my State Intrigue that much whether I make her my Spymaster or not.

But I'll definitely never make my spouse my Spymaster again.

 

[bkerns]

I'm not sure how exactly plot success chance is determined. The paranoid trait reduces the chances of being killed, and trusting is really bad. The best defense against plots is usually being well liked by the court you're residing in, so no one joins the plots against you. Even with very high intrigue no one will hit the necessary plot power to make an attempt if they're the only one plotting.

 

[LikeNothing]

I'm not sure how exactly plot success chance is determined. The paranoid trait reduces the chances of being killed, and trusting is really bad. The best defense against plots is usually being well liked by the court you're residing in, so no one joins the plots against you. Even with very high intrigue no one will hit the necessary plot power to make an attempt if they're the only one plotting.

Thanks! It seems the game is reasonably designed.

I gave all my children Court Education and my heir is Attractive, Gregarious and quite well-liked by everyone so that helps.

Of course I'll never let any of my children become Trusting (I'm a cat person) but I've never seen any event that makes them Paranoid either.

 

[Beyond Disbelief]

So it would be a good rule of thumb to marry people with good Traits, but not too high Intrigue?

Probably a good idea but you don't have to go out of your way to find someone with low intrigue.

The main issue is not that she has 30 intrigue (although that alone does makes her very formidable), but 1) her role as a Spymaster and 2) the conflict of interest as your spouse and 3) if said conflict of interest involves you, you would never hear a thing about it (she IS your source of realm intelligence)

Being a spymaster inherently grants her a tremendous boost - we're talking a case where while most people would have 3-12% plot power, I've not seen a single spy master have below 70% plot power and I've seen it gone as high as 150+% plot power from a SINGLE person.

Note that assassinations need 100% plot power to even happen, and 150% to have a reasonable chance of going undetected. (and keep going higher to increase your chance of the assassination to go through in shorter period of time)

With 30 intrigue I would not be surprised if you started a plot with her and found out that she alone contributes high 200's % plot power against someone within your realm with average intrigue.

 

[Rubidium]

Also, don't cheat on her. Ever.

Her reaction is likely to be unpleasant, and involve exploding manure.

 

[Beyond Disbelief]

It's important to note that even if a spymaster (wife or otherwise) will still perform their job and uncover plots normally (excluding their own, but while performing things of their own interest), there are sometimes decision events of various members of your realm falsifying accusations against a rival of theirs. These decisions are separate from plots uncovered.

In those events, as far as I know I believe only your own intrigue is contested against the accuser's, so its up to your own character to reverse the accusation and direct imprison the fraud.

I'm not sure if the spymaster can be involved in falsified accusations, just something to keep in mind.

 

[JMensch]

I find my wives generally try to kill landed people I'm the heir of. I've never had one succeed but I chalk that up to my low intrigue wives.

 

[Liar]

Your wife is both the Spymaster and has high intrigue. It's nearly guaranteed that she will succeed in killing your son if she chooses to. How is her diplomacy? If her diplomacy is high, she may very well be able to have other courtiers and vassals join in on the assassination attempt.

I find my wives generally try to kill landed people I'm the heir of. I've never had one succeed but I chalk that up to my low intrigue wives.

It just shows the level of love she has for you.

 

[Zepheyr]

My understanding is that her 'ambitious' trait makes her much more likely to plot against you and to just plot in general. It's not that she has high intrigue, it's that she's an ambitious individual and would plot anyway; having high intrigue just makes her plotting extremely dangerous. I never marry ambitious people or install ambitious vassals if I can avoid it. 'Content' is the way to go, imo. Unless it's my imagination, I've never had a content character initiate any plots or ever try to rebel.

 

[aitaituo]

My understanding is that her 'ambitious' trait makes her much more likely to plot against you and to just plot in general. It's not that she has high intrigue, it's that she's an ambitious individual and would plot anyway; having high intrigue just makes her plotting extremely dangerous. I never marry ambitious people or install ambitious vassals if I can avoid it. 'Content' is the way to go, imo. Unless it's my imagination, I've never had a content character initiate any plots or ever try to rebel.

Having content disables the ability to do any plot except through the plot to kill button in the character sheet of the target IIRC, but the AI seems to only target through the intrigue menu plot button. I can't remember if content directly effects the AI for joining factions, but the opinion bonus alone makes them much less likely to ever join.

 

[Azarias59]

Okay, that's a little sick that you murdered your first wife for no reason at all.

 

[Baron Badwolf]

Also, don't cheat on her. Ever.

Her reaction is likely to be unpleasant, and involve exploding manure.

lol I just got that event for the first time last night.

 

[The Fremen]

Did she have the crazy eyes?

 

[LikeNothing]

Your wife is both the Spymaster and has high intrigue. It's nearly guaranteed that she will succeed in killing your son if she chooses to. How is her diplomacy? If her diplomacy is high, she may very well be able to have other courtiers and vassals join in on the assassination attempt.

Her Diplomacy is like 22.

I fired her from her Spymaster position (still has 100+ opinion anyway) and she soon starts plotting to replace my next Spymaster, and instantly get 3 of my direct Vassals and about 10 others backing her.

She is so overpowered. I'm glad at least she's not killing anyone. At the moment.

Did she have the crazy eyes?

No she's a cute little blonde. Looks a lot like Jennifer Aniston. <3