'Must not marry an infidel'
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Incorrect, it works perfectly fine in the latest build; just now I married a Catholic with a Sunni by adding the intermarry lines. You only have your own incompetence to blame. Next time, pay closer attention or at the very least learn how to mod first before opening your trap.
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I'm using Project Balance with SWMH. However, any non-Asatru woman I tried to marry was denied because of the "must not marry an infidel". I don't know if that's coming from the base game or the mod, but I don't know why someone would mod the game to make it more restrictive.
I also think that the latest patch presents quite a good balance. Other religion gives you -5 penalty which is reasonable and appropriate given how other religions were perceived at the time. Playing as a norse king of Jorvik, I was recently able to marry one of my daughters to a Hungarian noble of Tengri faith. The religion gave -5 modifier, opinion about my king +5, and the other factors like her skills and age decided that the marriage went on.
"Intermarry" is OFF by default--one would have to add intermarry lines to enable it. So, either you're running an outdated version of your mod, or your mod didn't explicitly permit intermarry. Nothing should stop you from editing the 00_religions.txt file yourself, of course.
So the ability for pagans to marry pagans isn't the default condition, as stated by the prior poster?
In vanilla, pagans are able to marry within the pagan group, as Halcyan, Kamamura, and even myself have already mentioned. Intermarriage between different religion groups, however, is OFF by default, which is what I presumed your mod did if you weren't able to intermarry this Asatru religion with other pagans. Why don't you just check the 00_religions.txt file for yourself? Otherwise, go ask around in your mod's thread instead.
It's just the renamed Norse faith. And I don't remember having this problem, so it might be some sort of prestige/rank related effect limiting their selection.
Aren't these two sentences contradicting each other? If one religion belongs to group Pagan and another religion belongs to group Pagan aren't they by definition part of the SAME religion group? Why would "different religion groups" even be part of the discussion?
You didn't by any chance take the Norse, er "Asatru" religion out of the pagan group, even unintentionally, in your mod?
I didn't do anything to the mod other than install it. When I look at the ruler portrait the popup shows "Pagan" as the group. I don't know where it pulls that text from so I suppose it's possible that it's not really part of the Pagan group.
Because the game often uses conflicting terms.
1. What the game considers "Same Religion" for the Character Finder filter (includes others in the same religion group)
2. What the game considers "Same Religion" for free revocation at Medium+ Crown Authority (non-infidels + non-heretics; but for Pagans does NOT include others in the same religion group)
3. What the game considers "Same Religion" for purposes of marriage and vassalization
4. What the game considers "Same Religion" for no opinion modifier (exact religion must match)
There are clearly some inconsistencies there (which I personally don't mind, but they are there).
So, if I understand correctly, for marriage purposes, an "infidel" is someone outside your religious group. So for 3. above, marriage and vassalization, as long as it's the same group you are considered the same religion (similar to 1.).
For 2., infidels and heretics are not considered part of the same religion and are open targets. What is considered an infidel, anyone outside your group, as for 3.?
Yes, for marriage purposes, an "infidel" (which causes a hard block) is someone outside your religious group.
An exception exists for Pagans. Trying to marry another Pagan will result in a "Must not marry infidel" penalty but this one is NOT a hard block and can be overcome with sufficient green positives.
Vassalization is different. Vassalization can only be for the exact same religion. Those in the same group (Cathodox/Orthodox or Norse/Suomenousko) are NOT considered the same religion for vassalization purposes.
An infidel is generally someone outside your religious group. (Though the infidel opinion penalty can be waived with the Sympathy trait).
This is most likely the cause of my issue. I didn't know that you would still see the "must not marry infidel" mesage as a modifier. I probably just can't make the marriage arrangements because I don't have enough positive modifiers, whereas I thought I was being blocked completely based on the message. It makes more sense now
If it's a marriage between normal courtiers (not close relatives of either side) then you'll usually need around 100 opinion to get them to agree.
If the marriage involves a close relative (sibling/child) on their side, then a prestige gain can also overcome this.
If you are offering a female for the marriage, then the skills of that female can also help.
Lastly, depending on the exact political situation, you may get additional pluses of minuses based on Political Concerns.
This is the first time I've started in 867 and was trying to find a wife for my unmarried ruler. I also have to marry off my heir. When I propose the marriage, who does it look at for religious purposes? In this example, he and I are of the same religion but there cases where I might be offering for marriage someone with a different religion. Does it use my religion or the prospective groom/bride, and likewise for the other side of the equation?
Oops! I meant Catholic/Orthodox! :laugh:
Generally the best thing to use is the Character Finder.
If you choose the marriage rings, it looks for eligible women and girls who are of noble rank (automatically filters out lowborns) and only looks for marriage offers that would be immediately accepted (doesn't account for matches that would work after a gift of gold). The latter will often filter out a lot of the other Pagan religions since you often need to gift them gold to get them to accept.
Also, whether it's by design or a quirk, the game mainly checks you (the offerer's) religion and the liege of the other person. What sometimes happens is that characters are in the court of someone with a different religion. Even though you are proposing a match where both parties are the same religion, it may encounter a hard block because you are a different religion than the religion of the other lord.
For example, if I am a Catholic ruler. I propose a marriage between my Norse courtier, and the Norse courtier of a Muslim ruler. I will get the "must not marry infidel" hard block. Even though the two Norse characters are the same religion, the game sees Catholic and Muslim and disallows it. In such situations, I often find it hard as a Catholic to marry away Muslim women to Muslim men in the court of a Muslim ruler. One possible exception is if the other ruler has the sympathetic trait (when I was Norse, I did manage to get a Muslim ruler to marry off a Norse woman once, but it was probably b/c the Muslim ruler was a former Norse with the sympathetic trait).
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