Muscovy first idea groups

[MiniaAr]

We're still talking MP when other player would notice you expanding so fast and won't stay iddle when you're behind in MIl tech?:unsure:

 

[TheMeInTeam]

We're still talking MP when other player would notice you expanding so fast and won't stay iddle when you're behind in MIl tech?:unsure:

I'm not talking MP, no. In your case just use the horde CBs until you finish expansion and start getting better military via ideas. You can burn diplo on annexing big vassals w/o influence if it means you can actually fight competent opposition nearby, but do try to full annex --> release to get them into Orthodox at least, and leave them at home unless you're still in a timeframe where horde units + tech is worth something.

 

[-Malovane-]

We're still talking MP when other player would notice you expanding so fast and won't stay iddle when you're behind in MIl tech?:unsure:

I was talking SP, but in MP you don't have to fall far behind, necessarily. You can stagger the ideas and still keep up in mil-tech. One good reason for taking Aristocracy early.

Early game, going religious allows you to get up to 8 or 9 in mil-tech, if memory serves, before delving into military ideas. From there, you should be able to both keep up (ie, don't waste on ahead-of-time), and drop points into mil ideas. This gets more true the more military ideas you get, since each gives -2% to mil-tech cost.

Your second ruler, if he doesn't die early, gets 5 MP. Set the national focus to military. Throw in a +1 or +2 advisor - and you're set. Muscovy has a lot of iron, so it usually gets that -10% mil tech from arms trading.

 

[Magean]

PA takes forever to build but it will eventually and Christianity gets + strength decisions from tech too. Eventually with PA, decisions, and DotF you can blast through most of the actually difficult provinces to convert, or kick someone like LO into Orthodoxy and make them do it. Same thing if you go into Persian region; just feed Persia, Najd, or even Hejaz when they're Orthodox; all of them take religious ideas (as does Syria) and can easily convert even Mecca or Constantinople.

How can I feed Orthodox vassals in the steppes or the Middle-East ? They won't take Sunni provinces, and we're playing without any DLC so no occupation-transfer.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

How can I feed Orthodox vassals in the steppes or the Middle-East ? They won't take Sunni provinces, and we're playing without any DLC so no occupation-transfer.

Without the DLC it's much harder, you'd have to full annex --> release each one, though this has a prohibitive impact on your relations.

 

[Artyom87]

never played on MP, but on SP with AI hard and AI bonus and ironman I'd try starting off with administration or influence or diplomacy or trade.

Religious is very bad first pick since it wont really add anything to you for quiete some time. The culture discount it provides is useless since you will be swimming in diplo points anyways at certain times. And it will be like at least 20 years before you will actually need to convert stuff.
Moreover, religious casus belli is not really needed at start, as you can just write claims.

Manpower with russia is a big issue especially early game. For fastest expansion, I'd take administration. There are countless number of neighbours just waiting to be annexed and/or vassalized and vassal fed. Admin provides cheaper mercs which would be perfect to get on an early roll and it makes coring cheaper which you need because you wont be able to vassal feed everything.

Trade is also a good first idea simply because diplo points are worthless and believe it or not, your economy will eventually be relied on trade, not on production or taxes. Your economy will also eventually suck, It only seems pretty at the beginning

Dont take Humanism. Theres really no need. The revolts are not that many as long as you dont decrease the autonomy anywhere and only increase it in high revolt provinces.

Despite what people say, I think quantity is the best Military idea to take first. Mainly because you are poor though and you will be swimming in military points by the time you get to the third idea.

Whichever idea you start with, consider grabbing lvl 2 admin advisor from start. Novogorod will cost a good 500 or so points to core.

also, double-declare war on novgorod. Novogorod allies ryazan as soon as the first war is over, so write claims on ryazan before you truce with novogorod. Iam not sure, but I think you might be able to fully take novgorod in just 2 wars. But last time I came to 101% on war #2 so it took me 3 wars


I'd try the strategy admin/influence-religious(for the convert %)- expansion - quantity. And try to westernize by 1500.

 

[Magean]

you end up getting better, and cheaper, cavalry (and Eastern Cav is nice - even if you aren't Poland).

Are you sure of that ? I recently made a spreadsheet to compare cavalry units for each tech group. Turned out that Eastern cavalry isn't that great. It's average most of the time. The only good thing is that you can go up to 60% cavalry without malus, but... Does that make cavalry that good if you aren't Poland ?

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Are you sure of that ? I recently made a spreadsheet to compare cavalry units for each tech group. Turned out that Eastern cavalry isn't that great. It's average most of the time. The only good thing is that you can go up to 60% cavalry without malus, but... Does that make cavalry that good if you aren't Poland ?

It doesn't jump out to me but it's also solid at each tech. Cavalry heavy is best in the time before fire multipliers start taking off, since cavalry in general gets good shock multipliers (much better than infantry at most techs).

You can make a strong case for it from a manpower efficiency standpoint, and the extra flanking damage is welcome too.

Later in the game it falls apart since infantry fire and especially arty fire really take off; even halved the damage multiplier on arty hits really freaking hard.

I'd not go in that path though. As Russia in MP I'd want expansion, innovative, quality, offensive, quantity, and defensive. Maybe I'd toss in religious too later on, or earlier if you can't transfer occupation (dump defensive then). Enable the policy for 20% infantry combat ability and the one for .5 trad and +1 leader fire. At that point, you're sitting on a permanent 80 AT minimum with a base +2 fire stat and 20% infantry combat ability with a very large number of inexpensive units.

In total you'd have from ideas/policies:

30% infantry combat
70% FL
50% Manpower
20% manpower recovery
10% arty combat
10% discipline
15% morale
+2 leader fire
+1 leader shock
+1 leader maneuver
-35% attrition
-30% maintenance (before NI)

Of course that's 6 idea groups so it'd take time to set up, probably longer than a MP game would last. Depending on diplo situation in Asia and pressure in Europe you might swap around what you take when.

 

[Beagá]

Are you sure of that ? I recently made a spreadsheet to compare cavalry units for each tech group. Turned out that Eastern cavalry isn't that great. It's average most of the time. The only good thing is that you can go up to 60% cavalry without malus, but... Does that make cavalry that good if you aren't Poland ?

If you go Aristocracy, yes.

 

[l3ol3o]

I'm currently playing a Muscovy game. A few things to realize if you haven't played the new patch. Getting PA is much harder now. Event's are rare. Getting accepted culture is also very unlikely because of all the new cultures.

With that said I went:

Religion: The CB is awesome right from the start. You will also have tons of land to convert as Russia.
Offensive: My favorite Mil idea. Force March is a godsend for Russia.
Expansion: Yes 2 Adm idea early is a pain but the colonist early allows to you spread east quickly
Diplomacy: Solid idea and by now you should be swimming in Dip
Quality: Forcelimits should be high at this point so why not make the troops better

I haven't decided what my last 3 ideas will be. Probably trade and another mil idea. Not sure about the last one.

 

[Freudia]

and we're playing without any DLC so no occupation-transfer.

I feel bad for anyone in your game who is expecting to go reformed, as vanilla reformed is really bad.