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Dezimus

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Apr 18, 2018
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Yes, I came to similar conclusions.

Battletech computer games have been primarily SP for 30 years.
I mentioned this in the early posts in this topic. Personally I began to get actively involved in Battletech in the communities who wanted more than the single player could give. We tried to somehow entertain ourselves using the weak multiplayer capabilities that these games gave. I know hundreds of people who have fallen in love with BattleTech in this way.
I would love to see this become a good multiplayer game, but the basics need to be fixed first. More playstyles and weapon combos need to be viable before we can reasonably expect MP to not just be a cheese-fest.
I agree that in the current form, multiplayer is poorly suited for a serious competitive game. This happened primarily because of the fact that the whole mechanics were thrown out of the core game, and completely new ones were added instead. Naturally, the balance has shifted unpredictably. One (or more) polishing pass is required for all digits. And of course the QoL improvements , bug fixes and instruments to keep community healthy.
But anyway we will have several lance compositions that are certainly better than the rest. So we have to limit the free choice of Mechs for your lance (for example, by forming an available pool according to the Field Manuals rules; add permanent destruction and Mechs repairs, alike in the single player; objectives for matches others than "destroy them all"). In other words, you need to add variety and, consequently, interest in the game, a sense of progress from your participation. But yes, this will require considerable effort, and therefore unlikely.
 

Democratus

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MP isn't why I funded this game.

I'd rather they burn development cycles on new SP content.
 

Kurnn

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I didnt choose Battletech for multiplay. The single play was what made me buy it.
HOWEVER, I can see the potential in developing multiplayer to an advanced version of Solaris VII.

Also, there are a few users on these forums I would like the chance to launch a volley of SRM on!
 

Max Force

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I played a ton of multiplayer in the beta but hadn't touched the multiplayer in the final game until yesterday (wanted to finish SP first). I still dig it, but I agree it has a lot of problems.

The biggest, for me, is just the fact that it's so hard to get into a match. I'd say at least 75% of the time, I can't connect to a host, or someone can't connect to me. %50 of the time, we lose connection mid-match. I did not have these problems in the backer beta on the same machines, so I'm genuinely confused as to why there's so many lost connections in current MP. I'm genuinely happy to get to play a game, ANY GAME, simply because it so rare to be able to connect and, once connected, stay connected.

Are their firewall settings I need to set? Settings I need to tweak? I have no connection issues with any other MP game I'm playing now (Battletech is the only one) so I figure there has to be SOMETHING specific that I can fix.

As far as actually MP, I think the biggest problem is min/max. Ultimately, we want to win, and in Stock, there are really only a few mechs that make sense due to weaponry, c-bill cost, and armor, meaning you'll encounter those meches almost exclusively (Firestarter, Cent, etc).There's no good reason to take any stock mech other than the favorites.

In Custom, you get lots of mechs, but almost all of them are either an LRM boat or a flamer boat. Go in without those, and you will likely get stomped. So matches devolve to who can overheat or knock down all the other mechs first. Fun, but I wish there was more variation in mech types.

Ultimately, I think this has to come down to ground rules, as in the tournaments already mentioned. People need to set rules (no flamers, etc) to battle the min/maxing caused by some strategies being super-effective (like a Grasshopper with 6 flamers).

I want to play more multiplayer, but I need to 1) figure out why I get d/cd so often and 2) join a group that plays games with specific house rules to avoid min/maxing all the time.
 

Bassoonist

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I'd like to throw in my $0.02.

I think it's a false dichotomy to state single- and multi-player games are mutually exclusive. There are many games out there that prove the opposite.

It's also fallacious to say this game was always single-player focused. KickStarter backers were promised robust multi-player and HBS utterly failed to deliver. HBS gave us the most stripped-down, bare-bones version of mutli-player possible.

Furthermore, a lot of people's fears and gripes about multi-player in this game are hyperbolic:
  • In the dozen or so online matches I played not one person was toxic in chat. Most were silent, all the others were kind and cordial.
  • Many opponents disconnect, but you shouldn't hold this against them. Why make them stick around when they see no avenue to victory? It's frustrating that it negatively impacts our Steam achievements, but I don't want to bore someone for a byte of digital validation.
  • Most people run the pre-formed lances. I haven't run into any "cheese lances." Honestly, I don't even know what one would look like.
  • The game runs stable. I haven't experienced any disconnects on my end.
I played through the campaign constrained by a self-imposed iron-man mode. It was a blast, but now I'm bored with the AI. My lance is never in any real risk of harm; most times the AI barely scratches the paint on my mechs. The joy of playing through a campaign is found in the story and surprises it delivers along the way, so there's very little interest in playing through it again. HBS would have to create some type of planetary-conquest mode, something akin to the Civilization or Total War franchises, to draw me back to single-player.

Mutli-player is the next happy home for players like myself. I love BattleTech and want more. Table top is completely impractical: even if you can find a group that regularly plays a game Catalyst barely supports, it would require a time commitment that most people with jobs and families can't afford. The ability to switch on my laptop and play BattleTech against another human is a godsend.

If multi-player dies out, players like myself will just end up playing other games. We'll never buy any BattleTech DLC because we won't know about it. BattleTech will be a long forgotten gem in our Steam libraries. Without our purchases, the resources to continue supporting BattleTech will greatly diminish. Then new single-player content will dry up because HBS will have to move on to a new IP to feed their own families. Therefore, irrespective of whether we love single- or multi-player, it's in all our best interests to support all aspects of this game if we truly want to see BattleTech thrive.
 

Prussian Havoc

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I agree with @Bassoonist. :bow: I KickStarted BATTLETECH to the level I did and bought as many game keys as I did specifically so my family could best enjoy PvP Multiplayer BATTLETECH.

The more PvP Multiplayer gamers like myself who come to BATTLETECH...

The more gamers who come to BATTLETECH for the Solo-Campaign...


...together we will ensure the greatest amount of Success for BATTLETECH, HBS, Paradox and of course fans of BATTLETECH. : )
 

2fisted

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I am a founder because I have high hopes for a more in depth PvP Battletech. Like the original TT game is. 2v2, 2 on 1, vehics, inf. ie: Everything megamek has with the amazing gfx! But at this point I'd there is a long way to go. Fingers crossed!
 

Zakhodit

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@Max Force

Some tips to help with the MP interface:
1) Everytime you try to set up a match, start with a fresh client. As in restart the game before you create or try to join a lobby. This seems to resolve 80% of the issues. IF you see a player trying to connect to your lobby and they just get disconnected a second later, It would fix the problem if they restarted.
2) Which is why it's best to have a secondary means of communication. Like these forums or even, I don't know... A discord channel? https://discord.gg/k4rgbsq find an opponent there and set up a private lobby. If one player hasn't restarted their client for a while, it may be hard to connect or stay connected.
3)There will still be issues. They cannot be resolved by anything other than time. Some days the servers just don't want to play nice.
 

Havamal

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Greetings Mechwarriors,


Too much focus on others, not enough on one's own perspective.


Please do not post dismissiveness of others rather than points of discussion.

Please post topically towards discussion and not at each other personally.

Please post with civility and respectfully even in critique and disagreement.

Please agree to disagree.

Please do not reply to disrespect, please do report it. Please do not attempt to self moderate other community members on this forum.

Posts disregarding the above have already and going forward may experience Jump Drive malfunctions to the Far country to be used as nesting materials by the locals.



Thank you.
 

Akito272

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Apr 26, 2018
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Cheese can be address by stock only leader and then a free(cheese) ladder and done. Also if you add to the whole game anti cheese rules like 2 of the same weapon generates more heat or limit hardpoints , etc you could have more realistic matches. Add a team mode where 8 players can battle(each in one mech),etc,

That being said, this company does not have the resources to fully make both probably. Making games is not cheap, nor easy.
 

Dr. Banzai

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Concerning toxic PvP environments, cheese and whatnot:
I've been around when Quake3 and Dota first hit, been playing leagues back before eSports became a thing and what I learned is the bigger and more anonymus a playerbase became with any given game, the more toxic that base became as well.

In line with that and also greatly troubled by the technical issues the game is still flawed with my experiences at running an anonymous BattleTech MP games was a mess.
People were not able to join the lobby or simply leaving the lobby again without a word said, quitting on me after a couple of turns ingame or the game would disconnect with my opponent gone afterwards for lack of ingame communication. BattleTech MP imho is hard to have fun with on it's own.

However I was not willing to just let the chance to revive my teenage gaming experience pass. So I rather went out to ask well known community members such as Anaro Sunfire, HBS_ECK, Prussian Havoc or Callidus for games. "Simply to see a full game pace out" as I put it back then. I think it was Anaro who pointed me to the HBS unoffical Battletech Discord.
And *bam*, there it was. The chatting, the private talk, the endless discussions about lance compositions, prefered playstyles and everything else. I was not looking for a PvP experience or a ladder or any of that. I was looking for a online gaming group and I found it in those people.
6 weeks later most of us know each other and spend quite some time chatting and generally interacting on a human level as well. It's like my local gaming store from the 90s enclosed the whole globe all of a sudden. Hell I just had a friendly game and a nice chat with someone in Hawaii, with a 12 hour time difference.

So yeah, MP is technically in a bad shape, has been from the launch and has seen no dev attention since release. But the people forming a community around it make it work regardless, and I feel the reason for it is we are a small, tight knit group. I wouldn't even want it any other way. Just please do address the glaring technical issues and known bugs.
 

BigBadBear

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Jun 9, 2018
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OP claims no one played TT by themselves. I ran scenarios against myself all the time. I played the Tukayyid campaign solo and that was a lot of fun. The MP in this game excited me at first but then during the beta I saw we couldn't bring our mechs and pilots into the battle so I lost interest in it. I have come to enjoy playing the game against the AI. The campaign story was not that great to me but put into context of the Battletech novels it fit into the universe quite well.

My largest gripe with the MP was the fact I needed additional log in points to be able to go play online. I purchased the game and that should have been enough for me to be able to jump in on the MP side of this game. The time it takes to catch an actual game of MP turned me off of Battletech MP. When I have 30 minutes to play, spending 30 minutes waiting for a MP match to load in is not what I call relaxing or a wise investment of my money or time. Even though it takes near 5 minutes for my campaign to load(yes I erase all the extra saves) at least I can jump into a mission and leave on my timeline rather than be trapped in some game that took forever to queue up and now my opponent is taking their sweet time choosing their mech's movement.

The SP has been far more gratifying than I thought it would. The MP of Battletech fell flatter than I had hoped it would. I hope future expansions, dlc, games in the Battletech universe focus more on single player experiences.
 

Jack Ryan

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I'd like to throw in my $0.02.

I think it's a false dichotomy to state single- and multi-player games are mutually exclusive. There are many games out there that prove the opposite.

It's also fallacious to say this game was always single-player focused. KickStarter backers were promised robust multi-player and HBS utterly failed to deliver. HBS gave us the most stripped-down, bare-bones version of mutli-player possible.

Furthermore, a lot of people's fears and gripes about multi-player in this game are hyperbolic:
  • In the dozen or so online matches I played not one person was toxic in chat. Most were silent, all the others were kind and cordial.
  • Many opponents disconnect, but you shouldn't hold this against them. Why make them stick around when they see no avenue to victory? It's frustrating that it negatively impacts our Steam achievements, but I don't want to bore someone for a byte of digital validation.
  • Most people run the pre-formed lances. I haven't run into any "cheese lances." Honestly, I don't even know what one would look like.
  • The game runs stable. I haven't experienced any disconnects on my end.
I played through the campaign constrained by a self-imposed iron-man mode. It was a blast, but now I'm bored with the AI. My lance is never in any real risk of harm; most times the AI barely scratches the paint on my mechs. The joy of playing through a campaign is found in the story and surprises it delivers along the way, so there's very little interest in playing through it again. HBS would have to create some type of planetary-conquest mode, something akin to the Civilization or Total War franchises, to draw me back to single-player.

Mutli-player is the next happy home for players like myself. I love BattleTech and want more. Table top is completely impractical: even if you can find a group that regularly plays a game Catalyst barely supports, it would require a time commitment that most people with jobs and families can't afford. The ability to switch on my laptop and play BattleTech against another human is a godsend.

If multi-player dies out, players like myself will just end up playing other games. We'll never buy any BattleTech DLC because we won't know about it. BattleTech will be a long forgotten gem in our Steam libraries. Without our purchases, the resources to continue supporting BattleTech will greatly diminish. Then new single-player content will dry up because HBS will have to move on to a new IP to feed their own families. Therefore, irrespective of whether we love single- or multi-player, it's in all our best interests to support all aspects of this game if we truly want to see BattleTech thrive.

That's very well stated. Nice to see people like you on the forums.

People are either silent or decent and will happily chat if you take the effort to do so yourself. I have made at least one Steam firend for doing so.

As for the Cheese lances... I have encountered them. In fact, I faced two last night, it happened to be a friend I was playing against who was mounting AC20's and Flamers on Enforcers and had a 3 LRM20 Stalker... I still beat him, with stock mechs. I have, in fact, beaten every cheese lance I have ever faced with stock mechs (6-7 of them thus far). It's not impossible, you just watch your facing, brace when you want to fire and think a lot more. There are inherent flaws in building lopsided mechs that a robustly balanced stock mech can capitalize on.

The biggest problem I have faced are time outs on matches between US and Asia with my friend. But the servers seem to go to hell in a hand basket around 4-5AM no matter what we do.
 

Jack Ryan

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I agree with @Bassoonist. :bow: I KickStarted BATTLETECH to the level I did and bought as many game keys as I did specifically so my family could best enjoy PvP Multiplayer BATTLETECH.

The more PvP Multiplayer gamers like myself who come to BATTLETECH...

The more gamers who come to BATTLETECH for the Solo-Campaign...


...together we will ensure the greatest amount of Success for BATTLETECH, HBS, Paradox and of course fans of BATTLETECH. : )

Another well stated post. All true
 

Dezimus

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Apr 18, 2018
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So yeah, MP is technically in a bad shape, has been from the launch and has seen no dev attention since release. But the people forming a community around it make it work regardless, and I feel the reason for it is we are a small, tight knit group. I wouldn't even want it any other way. Just please do address the glaring technical issues and known bugs.

Honestly, I'm also not against relatively small communities playing this or that BT game. By the way, I have not seen Battletlech communities based on other principles.

There are some difficulties associated with the lack of multiplayer diversity, the lack of any significant goal (except that we will invent to ourselves), the attraction of new players, etc. But since we have no other options, I also encourage players who are not indifferent to PVP to give it a chance and play at least a couple of matches with people who are in the HBS unoffical Battletech Discord.

We definitely do not bite.
 

jss78

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Going to join the (by now very big) choir, just not interested in online PvP at all.

Here's my problem. I likea good PvE game. I also like playing PvP in person, on tabletop. But I really, REALLY don't like playing with other people, faceless, over the internet.

People in general have good impulses and bad impulses. Online PvP tends to bring out the worst. When the game starts a lot of us get competitive. But when that living, breathing human being is sitting at the same table, we're wired to try and be pleasant to that person. But competitive play, anonymously over the Internet, only brings out the worst in people.

About 15 years ago I spent some time playing Bloodbowl, a game I really love playing on tabletop against people, on the Internet. Not going to repeat the same mistake with BT.
 
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Prussian Havoc

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I disagree. When engaged, I've been quite pleasant to all I've gamed with here and received pleasant comms in return.

Not all experiences are similar. As they say, "Your Mileage May Vary." :bow:
 

Pewpew!

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Apr 24, 2018
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A lot of people mention toxicity and bad sportsmanship rampant in online games. There are many games out there that have this but THIS game is not one of them. I have 100? hours of exclusive online play in this game and I can count on less than one hand how many bad sports and trolls I've come across. This game attracts a much older gaming crowd than most other games so there is a high maturity level here. Also, if your afraid of cheese builds etc try STOCK ONLY games. I play stock only exclusively and I love it.
 
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