MP reminder

[unmerged(15247)]

hello everyone still active in eu2 mp!

as some of might already know i am frequentlly hosting SMALL mp games( that is regularlly 2-3 players, maximum 4). i used to like a lot 14 players mp, however the human factor and small speed takes away the fun for me. in 2-3 players can easilly do 100 years in a few hours session; true, the human interactions is less and there is usually an economic competition but not necesarry if bordering human nations, depends on the mp objectives. however the main BENEFIT of small mp is that the gameplay is smooth almost always at "above speed" no less.(pausing is allowed only when at war, for strategy purpose or bad events such peasents unhapiness)

getting to the point my map is GENERALLY the "vanila" AGCEEP LATEST UPDATE(always whenever new beta gets relesed and yoda master does that sometimes even dailly). however once an mp started same beta will be kept untill the end . i do multiple mp's depending on my available time as well as others. i am looking for various players that want to do a WHOLE campaign. my interset genearlly is for minors in europe OR ANYWHERE outside europe. agceep is EXCELENT in trying asian/african or even inca or atzecs.

my messanger is "beregic@msn.com" .please contact and if all parties available, will do an mp as soon as possible.3 players is ideal( easier to set game quick and TO FOLLOW it in other sessions).

 

[Blaster]

wow! the small mp games u'r talking about must be very NICE!

 

[unmerged(15247)]

wow! the small mp games u'r talking about must be very NICE!

indeed as you well know

 

[BurningEGO]

however the human factor and small speed takes away the fun for me

I am curious here fella... You dont like the human factor? Then why do you play multiplayer? Playing 100 years in a couple of years might be interesting, but you will never manage to maximize your economy and thus wars will be limited (unless you dont care to go to war with a stricken poor country).

 

[unmerged(15247)]

I am curious here fella... You dont like the human factor? Then why do you play multiplayer? Playing 100 years in a couple of years might be interesting, but you will never manage to maximize your economy and thus wars will be limited (unless you dont care to go to war with a stricken poor country).

!?!? human factor = people not beeing able to gather EASILLY at same time ; lol, not sure what you understood; and i am not sure what you mean; maximizing economy is easier in a few people, even vanila map has enough to sustain 2 OR 18 players ...lol(IF that is what you mean)

 

[BurningEGO]

human factor = human interaction = human wars, diplomacy with humans, etc

I didnt understand why you played multiplayer at all if you despised that. For AI bashing it is easier to go with single player. (i have played with a lot of new folk before that passed the entire game AI bashing - and saw me as the devil since i kept attacking em). Of course it seems you had a problem expressing yourself and that i had a problem understanding you so the case above isnt the same as yours.

And hell maximizing economy playing 100 years in a few hours must be hard if not impossible. It is already hard for me to maximize economy on a 4 hours normal session which spreads over 20-40 years. Imagine if you are playing Spain...

Keep in mind that maximize isnt the same as increase. Although not directly related with economy, i do have a hard time using every single explorer and conquistador during the early 1500's as Spain (for example), under BN speed, and most times i dont use them completely. It is very hard to conduct agressive wars to expand your colonial empire, using shift to create exploration routes for every explorer, plus a route back to a port for the same explorers, sending conquistadors from spain or the island they spawned at to the new world, trading, colonizing, building stuff and potentially involving yourself in human wars all in so short time.

You know, i like to play as far as i use my capabilities to the maximum - having my economy being hurt due to game speed and not to any game-related (or diplomatic) issue or due to my bad management, isnt exactly pleasant.

 

[unmerged(15247)]

human factor = human interaction = human wars, diplomacy with humans, etc

I didnt understand why you played multiplayer at all if you despised that. For AI bashing it is easier to go with single player. (i have played with a lot of new folk before that passed the entire game AI bashing - and saw me as the devil since i kept attacking em). Of course it seems you had a problem expressing yourself and that i had a problem understanding you so the case above isnt the same as yours.

And hell maximizing economy playing 100 years in a few hours must be hard if not impossible. It is already hard for me to maximize economy on a 4 hours normal session which spreads over 20-40 years. Imagine if you are playing Spain...

Keep in mind that maximize isnt the same as increase. Although not directly related with economy, i do have a hard time using every single explorer and conquistador during the early 1500's as Spain (for example), under BN speed, and most times i dont use them completely. It is very hard to conduct agressive wars to expand your colonial empire, using shift to create exploration routes for every explorer, plus a route back to a port for the same explorers, sending conquistadors from spain or the island they spawned at to the new world, trading, colonizing, building stuff and potentially involving yourself in human wars all in so short time.

You know, i like to play as far as i use my capabilities to the maximum - having my economy being hurt due to game speed and not to any game-related (or diplomatic) issue or due to my bad management, isnt exactly pleasant.

ok you way out of toping here.this is NOT what this post is about.looks like you just do not understand what "human factor" means IN MY PERSPECTIVE( you simplly aplly your opinion that human factor means to everyone what it means to you it seems ); however now that you mentioned please read again initial post where it says CLEARLLY that this is mostlly small nations small mps; from WHERE did spain even came in discussion!?!? it has been LONG ago since i played all majors, both mp and sp. many of eu2 players love 1-2 province starting nations that is very fun to do it in small mp since no CODES( cheating) is possible.(ask yourself how many times in sp you been tempted and USED eventually some of the cheats )

using capabilities at maximum ECONOMIC wise has NOTHING to do with SPEED; i am not sure what you trying to say maybe but a player that knows all the economic aspects( at least) will never have such problem; LOL; maybe i am missing something...

you say yourself that you atack your friends ai bashing! therfore you could obviouslly have NO PROBLEM to manage economy ( since you have that spare time on your hands from what i understand)

regardless clearlly my mps are not for you; i like laid back games where taking decisions AT ABOVE SPEED still lives me enough time to do house work WHILE playing eu2( NOT alt tabbing, i detest that).

SUGGESTION: try "loraine"( 1province minor with GREAT potential due to having german and french culture) providing you succed to expand a bit initially(90% of times you would get annexed likelly if you take warmonger path). that will requier extreme attention IN MP(NO CHEATS).
after you do that (IF it is your "cup of tea") come and tell me how that applies comparing to playing the mighty spain)
playing loraine/savoy/ and another german minor(3 players mp) it is VERY chalanging; if you try to prove your skills and atack another human would be a siucide move in long run (VERY HARD, COWARD AGRESSIVNESS settings) i doubt that even if you take out another human you will survive and take over ai tech levels for example). so what happens; each player tries expanding around WHILE KEEPING AN EYE ON the other 2; every player knows that if he gets too big (economic and size wise as well) the other 2 will get gelous and try to stop his getting ahead plan. so therfore you must play balanced( including a lot of ai diplomacy, vassals for spare troops if another player dows you. ok so everyone steady expands and to feel confident that has a strong support limit/possible minting cash/etc we are in the 16th centuary when paralel expansion with colonies starts as well. only after the first 100 years ai does not matter anymore as you say would be ai bashing...but by this time you have 3 nations of relativelly same size OR economy( trust me the eu2 engine does not let you get ahead in tech , at least for 150years) if research infra the ai will take advantage on that and with ai land 9-14 and you 5 or less(couse you researched infra) i DOUBT you will have still the time to mind other humans( unless you take siucidal path of course and simplly want to take down someone at any costs to you)
it is only after 1600's that ONLY human to human interaction by war would be possible( on very hard you will have a lots of vassals since bb 1/2 of limit must NEVER be crossed to facilitate a GOOD economy simultaniouslly). becouse all 3 humans have worked hard to reach their status, wars will not be generally possible to end in TOTAL difeat for either.(unlike having spain or france with 200+k support going at each other blitzkering style). so it will take until after 1700 to have a clear "winner" ; if income/or size is the objective.

by the way i did a test with loraine and is possible to own all western europe including england and NOT go over bb limit; but that requiers each province to be taken at 1bb no more.

i hope i gave you a GENERAL picture of playing MINORS in MP

 

[BurningEGO]

Beregic, i did follow your suggestion.

But i must say, that playing Lorraine, specially on AGCEEP, is a walk in the park. There are a lot of countries being inherited around Lorraine, meaning, you can conquer a lot of provinces getting only 0.25 badboy points in the process.

France for example is inherited by someone at the start, and you, with a monarch leader, can steal a lot of sieges if you plan carefully. Brabant is also inherited by Burgundy later and so is Burgundy inherited by Spain, giving you plenty of oportunities to grab a lot of provinces.

Not to speak about the reformation that delays convertions and allows you to virtually DA all of north germany.



1550. Very Hard / Coward settings. I got 16.9 badboy points. I got LT 12, NT 9, infra 5, trade 3 (and am 8 years away from trade 4). My monthly income is 66,9.

Also worth noting was that i kept playing as a vassal of provence from the 1430's to the 1470's (imagine if i didnt!). I also just got about 100-150 galleys and am about to steal portugal's maps in order to go to india.

Oh, and it was my first time playing as Lorraine... You said that you get annexed 90% of the times you play as Lorraine if you go warmongering? Then i guess i fell into the 10% chances of surviving.

Only about 4 AIs bypass my tech levels, and even so only by a little (1-3 land or naval techs).

And since you were gentle enough to give me a suggestion, so will I retribute the gesture: if you really think that playing lorraine is HARD, then go try play Xhosa - a 1 province PAGAN country.

P.S: And no, i never used cheats in single player, exception being when i am testing stuff for multiplayer purposes. IE: using robespierre to max serfdom/narrowminded to check what my stability costs will be in the future.

Oh and, a good economy can be reached even after breaking the BB limit, even in multiplayer. I have done it before. And in fact, i was the richest nation by the end of the game once i did it.

 

[smn_]

This thread made me smile

Beregic, what you seem to be marketing is playing kind of single player along with friends. That's very different from the multiplayer usually played on these forums.

Speaking of minors, what's the best anyone has seen being developed out of a human minor in actually competitive environments? Has there been any?

I'd like to think the Bavaria me & Miozozny built back in Götterdämmerung was a good one, but that was on the WaTK map.

 

[unmerged(15247)]

Beregic, i did follow your suggestion.

But i must say, that playing Lorraine, specially on AGCEEP, is a walk in the park. There are a lot of countries being inherited around Lorraine, meaning, you can conquer a lot of provinces getting only 0.25 badboy points in the process.

France for example is inherited by someone at the start, and you, with a monarch leader, can steal a lot of sieges if you plan carefully. Brabant is also inherited by Burgundy later and so is Burgundy inherited by Spain, giving you plenty of oportunities to grab a lot of provinces.

Not to speak about the reformation that delays convertions and allows you to virtually DA all of north germany.



1550. Very Hard / Coward settings. I got 16.9 badboy points. I got LT 12, NT 9, infra 5, trade 3 (and am 8 years away from trade 4). My monthly income is 66,9.

Also worth noting was that i kept playing as a vassal of provence from the 1430's to the 1470's (imagine if i didnt!). I also just got about 100-150 galleys and am about to steal portugal's maps in order to go to india.

Oh, and it was my first time playing as Lorraine... You said that you get annexed 90% of the times you play as Lorraine if you go warmongering? Then i guess i fell into the 10% chances of surviving.

Only about 4 AIs bypass my tech levels, and even so only by a little (1-3 land or naval techs).

And since you were gentle enough to give me a suggestion, so will I retribute the gesture: if you really think that playing lorraine is HARD, then go try play Xhosa - a 1 province PAGAN country.

P.S: And no, i never used cheats in single player, exception being when i am testing stuff for multiplayer purposes. IE: using robespierre to max serfdom/narrowminded to check what my stability costs will be in the future.

Oh and, a good economy can be reached even after breaking the BB limit, even in multiplayer. I have done it before. And in fact, i was the richest nation by the end of the game once i did it.

lols, nice going; i see this became a "pissing" game dont forget you played that SP, no competition from a human german minor or french
but nice going regradless, a bit small for 1550 and i would add too much bb;stab costs must be high.

since you TOOK the chalange maybe you should try to do that with me; i would take luxembourgh ; i am looking at the map you have and there is NO WAY you can actually own all europe by 1820's
90% survival reffers to WARMONGORING play( the "let me annex a minor right at start"). of couse if you "take it like a man" and stay put as a vassal nobody would have reasons to eat you up
remeber colonization is just for FUN ; the costs rendered in making colony, support it, and TRADERS cost IF get a cot makes colonization only an "ego" aspect; well the same for europe of course , but with the money you use to get to india you could make a few more vassal meanwhile and MAYBE succed in diplo annexing europe by 1820))) basically what i mean here is that colonization is way overated especially IF strting too soon; after 1700 is too easy and very boring

 

[unmerged(15247)]

This thread made me smile

Beregic, what you seem to be marketing is playing kind of single player along with friends. That's very different from the multiplayer usually played on these forums.

Speaking of minors, what's the best anyone has seen being developed out of a human minor in actually competitive environments? Has there been any?

I'd like to think the Bavaria me & Miozozny built back in Götterdämmerung was a good one, but that was on the WaTK map.

contradictions

may i ask how many PLAYERS where in your game as bavaria?

i dont know how to load maps; but i have loraine forming present european union as well as bavaria; navara became irrelevant now that it does not have both major cultures anymore(agceep)

 

[unmerged(34338)]

may i ask how many PLAYERS where in your game as bavaria?

14 at start. NL was released later on and several player-countries did not see the end of the game.

 

[BurningEGO]

lols, nice going; i see this became a "pissing" game dont forget you played that SP, no competition from a human german minor or french
but nice going regradless, a bit small for 1550 and i would add too much bb;stab costs must be high.

since you TOOK the chalange maybe you should try to do that with me; i would take luxembourgh ; i am looking at the map you have and there is NO WAY you can actually own all europe by 1820's
90% survival reffers to WARMONGORING play( the "let me annex a minor right at start"). of couse if you "take it like a man" and stay put as a vassal nobody would have reasons to eat you up
remeber colonization is just for FUN ; the costs rendered in making colony, support it, and TRADERS cost IF get a cot makes colonization only an "ego" aspect; well the same for europe of course , but with the money you use to get to india you could make a few more vassal meanwhile and MAYBE succed in diplo annexing europe by 1820))) basically what i mean here is that colonization is way overated especially IF strting too soon; after 1700 is too easy and very boring

getting asian cots gives you many abilities:

1º you can easily trade there
2º you get extra merchants per year thus stability wont even be important for trading
3º you can even get monopolies greatly raising your income
4º you can ban whoever you want cripling their income if you hold the majority of the cots

And, the price for getting to india are only about 1500d. The province with the COT itself will contribute 100d per year, not to speak about trading income. If you do everything as it should, your adventure will pay itself pretty fast.

stab costs must be high.

330 stability costs (and serfdom and narrowminded arent even maxed!). Despite all the wrong religion provinces. Oh, and i wasnt trying to conquer all of europe... Such is boring. If i keep playing that i will only conquer all french-german provinces.

And Boo, Provence was a 1 province minor and i was the one leading the alliance all the time, with kleves-mainz and koln, minors that i was trying to vassalize (and which i managed to). I just kept as their vassal because i thought it would be possible to inherit provence and consequently get some cores in naples but i guess i didnt check the files properly. But nevertheless Provence was totaly unable to defend me for sure.

I remember when France DOWed me. It was crazy. Hopefully i managed to invite Aragon and Castile to save my ass and France came crashing down.