Mountain Passes

[TheDerpyBeagle]

Throughout the history of warfare, controlling passes through mountain ranges was integral to winning a war in mountainous terrain. Notably in the Swiss defense plan against Germany, their entire plan relied on making the Alps a fortress and holding the mountain passes against German and Italian forces, as most of the Alps was impassible without going through the mountain passes. In the First World War, when the Russians stormed through Galicia in 1914 and again in 1916, they were stopped, or at least slowed down by the Carpathian mountains, in that they were forced to go through mountain passes to advance further. And further west on the Italian front, the entire war there ended in a stalemate due to combat only being able to occur on some parts of the front, thanks to the Alps.

There are several mods I have seen for EU4 and Victoria 2 that make some provinces impassable in between each other in mountain ranges such as the Alpine or Caucasus mountains, while leaving single provinces can pass through. I think that this a feature that should be duplicated for Hearts of Iron 4. It would better simulate mountain warfare, and illustrate how hard it is to attack in the mountains much better, allowing for more realistic war, allowing fortification to be placed more strategically.

 

[safe-keeper]

Perhaps "Mountains" and "Mountain passes" could be separate terrain types, like "Desert" and "Coastal desert" in EU4? "Mountain passes" could have less attrition, but far more narrow combat width, or something?

Then again, I think this is akin to how bridges aren't modelled, not even the major ones; they're just too small to be depicted in a grand strategy game.

And as a side note, this is why I'd love to see a "tactical Hearts of Iron" game, where every province is a far smaller area and you control individual companies, not divisions, and perhaps even smaller units than that. It would allow the depicition of individual roads, mountain passes, bridges, and other stuff too "small" to make it into regular HOI. Perhaps an idea for a mod, but I digress.

 

[tommylotto]

I would like adjacencies to have variable frontage so that Paradox or modders could control how many troops can fight going from one province to another. With this you could simulate narrow mountain passes as well as small Pacific islands, or Gibraltar, where only a small force could realistically operate.

 

[LordOfWar16]

All terrain is passable, there is no more inpassable terrain but attrition while moving through some terrain will make you cringe. You also suffer from lower speed and much narrower combat width, which means a country like switzerland that propperly themself in in the mountains will be able to withstand the massive armies of italy and germany for quiet a while. It should also be noted that states are quiet large and even provinces are, so modeling in mountain passes as inpassable terrain doesnt work that easiely.

Attacking into mountains, however, is pretty much suicidal, since it gives massive defense bonsues to abstract said passes. If you add forts ontop of that it gets near impossible or atleast extremely costly to go through there, to an point where it is probably not even worth it anymore. Ontop of that attrition in mountains and while moving through mountains will make you cry. Especially armor will be likely to break down while passing through mountainous terrain.

 

[WSnova]

Its too small of a scale.

Attacking through mountains give you less movement speed, less combat width and a malus for attacking. That is meant to represent all problems a big force has to deal with to pass through a mountain.

Bridges are not represented either. Maybe when CA releases Total War WW2 or something we can cheese the AI in bridges like always XD

 

[Mandraug]

Attacking through mountaints give you less movement speed, less combat width and a malus for attacking. That is meant to represent all problems a big force has to deal with to pass through a mountain.

Spot on. That said, I wonder if making the stacking penalty a function of terrain type (steeper stacking penalties in mountains than on plains) could better account for the kind of funnel effects you observe with mountain passes and similar features. Of course, the reduced frontage idea:

I would like adjacencies to have variable frontage so that Paradox or modders could control how many troops can fight going from one province to another. With this you could simulate narrow mountain passes as well as small Pacific islands, or Gibraltar, where only a small force could realistically operate.

may be a better representation still.