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Decius

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I have no twitter account, so take this comment as a "Like" for Arheos comments in the twitter chat about culture/government specific innovation branches, which don't interfere with main innovation trees. They offer more diverse campaigns, if you pick different cultures and/or government types plus the possibility of extra branches provide even more opportunities for future faction and culture DLCs :)
 
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IsaacCAT

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I have no twitter account, so take this comment as a "Like" for Arheos comments in the twitter chat about culture/government specific innovation branches, which don't interfere with main innovation trees. They offer more diverse campaigns, if you pick different cultures and/or government types plus the possibility of extra branches provide even more opportunities for future faction and culture DLCs :)
I do not have enough info to make a judgement, but I like the experience of tribal reform as @nikkythegreat has expressed. I will welcome anything that improves on that.
 
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CaptinObvious

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To be honest, this doesn't have anything to do with the beauty of the map, but with the accuracy^^
TBH half the beauty of a map is it's accuracy
 
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Decius

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TBH half the beauty of a map is it's accuracy
It depends on your personal taste and how you see the map. If @IsaacCAT loves the aesthetics of the I:R map, even if there are modern dam lakes, but because such inaccuracies doesn't bother him, then it's totally fine. I mean, we aren't talking about a street map, where I need accurate information to get from A to B. But I don't consider street maps as beautiful, but it's not their "job" to be beautiful, but accurate. That doesn't mean I think accuracy isn't important on the I:R camapign map, I do, but I can say a map in a PC game is beautiful, if I'm just talking about the aesthetics - and that's what you usually do in games - I think the campaign map in Attila Total War is extremely beautiful, but the accuracy of it is in many areas a joke.

And yes, I take this discussion more serious than I should, but you started the argument with me :D
 

IsaacCAT

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That depends, do you like modern dam lakes in your Hellenistic maps?
You are right, I have seen the posts where those damns are denounced. I am not confident enough to bring this forward to the SPQR, but I will definetively vote yes to correct that.
 

IsaacCAT

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It depends on your personal taste and how you see the map. If @IsaacCAT loves the aesthetics of the I:R map, even if there are modern dam lakes, but because such inaccuracies doesn't bother him, then it's totally fine. I mean, we aren't talking about a street map, where I need accurate information to get from A to B. But I don't consider street maps as beautiful, but it's not their "job" to be beautiful, but accurate. That doesn't mean I think accuracy isn't important on the I:R camapign map, I do, but I can say a map in a PC game is beautiful, if I'm just talking about the aesthetics - and that's what you usually do in games - I think the campaign map in Attila Total War is extremely beautiful, but the accuracy of it is in many areas a joke.

And yes, I take this discussion more serious than I should, but you started the argument with me :D
Man! I didn’t notice the dams until they told me about them. My experience is ruined now! I will not be able to immerse in the game as before while they are not removed! And, please throw in some animated wildlife too.
 
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Man! I didn’t notice the dams until they told me about them. My experience is ruined now! I will not be able to immerse in the game as before while they are not removed! And, please throw some animated wildlife too.
Well, I guess sometimes knowledge can be a burden :D
 
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Decius

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Is that the normal mapmode? That black like doesnt look very aesthetic on the normal map...It looks good on the other mapmode but if thats the normal mapmode it looks a bit as if somebody had draw it with a pen :p
It's the new Atlas map mode. So don't worry that the line appears on the normal map. Same applies to the star and sun symbols, they only appear on this map mode. It's meant for showcase and if you zoom out the map looks more like an ancient pergament map. It's more for screenshots and after action reports, it doesn't really provide a purpose gameplay wise.
 
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Some may find it odd how new governments are unlocked by inventions, but I would rationalize that as a thinker coming up with a philosophy that's gaining traction in the government.
A civic invention doesn't have to be an actual technology after all, it might just be a new school of thought or something of the like.

All in all, I think this is absolutely great for the game, the pacing changes is what's getting me the most exited about 2.0 by far (and that's saying a lot), correcting what I understand to be the most underrated (and to me, the biggest) issue with Imperator right now.
I have already posted my full thoughts about it in the Marius reveal DD but what the heck, I can't get enough of it so I'll post it again:
Well damn, after the flurry of disappointment from last week, you guys managed to turn me back to thoroughly exited in only a week.
I can't help but feel like this whole debacle could've been avoided if this DD was swapped with the last one, but alas, turning the opinion around like that is definitely worthy of high praise.

As for what is getting me this exited, I could very well say "all of it", but this particular one is the biggest to me:

This is, imo, the most understated aspect Imperator doesn't get right at all atm.
In all other PDX games you can clearly tell that the world has advanced a lot through time.
  • In CK, tech will have you progress from a largely levy based army to a standing one, as well as unlock buildings, succession laws and many other features which allows you to centralize your realm.
  • In EU, you'll have progressed from a tax based society to a production and trade based one, religious wars and even revolutions might've created rifts in the world, and armies will have gone from being composed mainly from pikeman infantry to riflemen and artillery.
  • In Victoria, the most drastic one imo, the very core of nations will be shaken in severe ways. Ideologies will arise and be the cause of turmoil (perhaps even revolutions), great wars and nationalism can break and give rise to some of the mightiest empires in history, and industrialization will change the scale which goods are produced and move large populations to urban areas. In the military, you can see the transition from sail to steam, mobilization will allow you to engage in wars with millions and millions, wars which themselves will have changed to endless meat grinders, and in the end give rise to tanks and airplanes.
  • Even HoI, in a much shorter period, manages to portray the advancements on its own scope. By the end, light tanks give space to modern armor, biplanes to jet aircraft, perhaps even infantry to mechanized, and of course, nukes. You can clearly see an army going from a WW1 structure into the modern era.
Imperator doesn't give any of these feelings at all, besides which colors the map is now painted in, you'd be hard pressed to see any real change to the world.
Perhaps one or two big cities have emerged somewhere, perhaps a lot of roads have been built, but in practical terms, nothing really has changed in a palpable way.
This gives me a big hit to engagement through a campaign tbh, to see a world this static (it was much, much worse before 1.2, granted, where even pops couldn't move on their own), though I'm not sure if that'd be just me.
But I'm indeed very, very pleased to see this on this list of priorities for this all new version of the game.

Edit: also, with all the focus on characters as well, and the new CK3 tech, I can't help but imagine an Imperator with fully animated character models.
I'd definitely not put that on high priority, and would probably be a bigger resource drain than any return it might give, but it's a nice thought nonetheless.
 
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nikkythegreat

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Some may find it odd how new governments are unlocked by inventions, but I would rationalize that as a thinker coming up with a philosophy that's gaining traction in the government.
A civic invention doesn't have to be an actual technology after all, it might just be a new school of thought or something of the like.

All in all, I think this is absolutely great for the game, the pacing changes is what's getting me the most exited about 2.0 by far (and that's saying a lot), correcting what I understand to be the most underrated (and to me, the biggest) issue with Imperator right now.
I have already posted my full thoughts about it in the Marius reveal DD but what the heck, I can't get enough of it so I'll post it again:

Its a bit unimmersive for me, its like you discovering a new way of thinking and suddenly you can make a dictatorship.

What would be better is that the tech would give you access to a mission tree that turns you into a dictatorship.
 

Vohen

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Its a bit unimmersive for me, its like you discovering a new way of thinking and suddenly you can make a dictatorship.

What would be better is that the tech would give you access to a mission tree that turns you into a dictatorship.
It's not merely a tech though, it's an invention, which means it's something you purposefully adopt, not discover.
The concept of a dictatorship shouldn't be alien even at the start date, but to go down a tree adopting "ideas" (basically what civic inventions are) that eventually lead to a dictatorship seems fitting to me.
 

nikkythegreat

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It's not merely a tech though, it's an invention, which means it's something you purposefully adopt, not discover.
The concept of a dictatorship shouldn't be alien even at the start date, but to go down a tree adopting "ideas" (basically what civic inventions are) that eventually lead to a dictatorship seems fitting to me.

Sorry about that, I meant innovation. Still unimmersive for me that getting that innovation you could suddenly turn your country into a dictatorship.

What would be better is that the innovation would give you access to a mission tree that turns you into a dictatorship. Thus requiring you to do some politics or reforms before you can turn your country into such.
 
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Sorry about that, I meant innovation. Still unimmersive for me that getting that innovation you could suddenly turn your country into a dictatorship.

What would be better is that the innovation would give you access to a mission tree that turns you into a dictatorship. Thus requiring you to do some politics or reforms before you can turn your country into such.
Arheo has clarified (see https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/more-twitter-teasers.1451970/post-27219906) that it's actually a process you have to go through while going down that branch of the tree and adopting multiple inventions there, each turning your country more and more authoritarian until the point where you actually become a dictatorship.

I actually quite like the idea of using missions, but I'd argue that, in the end, the result isn't that different from what we're getting here.
 
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