More formable countries

[oblio-]

Since so many wants Austria-Hungary, regardless of how fitting it is, how about making it a disaster or event?

Can only happen if Austria has a PU over Hungary, if Austria and Hungary both have Habsburg rulers or if Austria directly owns the majority of the Hungarian cores.
This would unlock a unique governement, double-monarchy with the Austria-Hungary tag nation or something like that, which would function similar to Dutch Republic with a slider on the government interface.

Instead of ruler regency length and the republic bonuses it purely effects stats in terms of nation and ruler management so for example, if it was divided between "centralization" or "Habsburg control" and "decentralization" or something similar you would get different bonuses and such, similar to Orangists and Statists.

When leaning towards Habsburg control you get Monthly autonomy decrease plus something extra like yearly legitimacy, chance of a new heir or diplomatic reputation, but at the cost of unrest or maybe hungarian/noble rebel events.
When leaning towards decentralizing the powers of the nation(s) you would get a decrease in unrest plus accepted culture % (to reflect accepting Hungarian) but at the cost of monthly autonomy increase and maybe defensiveness or manpower/tax.

Thoughts?

Wiz proposed an even better solution, having the name of the largest PU partners become the name of the new country. So, for example France with Austria and Modena in PUs would become France-Austria.

This sounds a lot more generic, therefore suitable to many countries, and would actually describe better what Austria-Hungary was: Austria after going through an instant process which in EU4 would be:
- release Hungary as an independent state (not as a vassal, because afterwards they couldn't be PUd)
- immediately PU Hungary

Having Austria-Hungary as a formable country is silly for anyone who knows the actual history of that state.

 

[Dauth]

This may explain why on the EU4 wiki we keep having people search for Yugoslavia. Its something they wish existed. I can't decide which solution I prefer.

1) Giving in an giving them the country to form

2) Putting a wiki page up which calls them a doughnut and directs them to a post explaining why a Slavic union won't happen.

 

[Nikolaj-11]

Well, a Scandinavian nation is a bit out there too, don't really mind some silly options. It's a game after all. I'll let the devs decide the specific countries.

 

[delpiero1234]

I'm sorry that I upset your feelings by making a joke about the existance of an Iceland tag in a computer game. I'm sure it's a deadly serious topic to you.

That really is not the point.
The point is that the forum rules don't permit trolling and that it is quite ironic that a staff member admitts that he trolled the community. No matter if anybody's feelings are hurt or not. If you don't understand that then why don't you remove that rule from the forum rules?

 

[Wizzington]

That really is not the point.
The point is that the forum rules don't permit trolling and that it is quite ironic that a staff member admitts that he trolled the community. No matter if anybody's feelings are hurt or not. If you don't understand that then why don't you remove that rule from the forum rules?

Do you always interpret everything you read in a 100% literal fastion? Because that has to make life on the internet quite difficult for you.

 

[delpiero1234]

Do you always interpret everything you read in a 100% literal fastion? Because that has to make life on the internet quite difficult for you.

No.
It's quite silly of you to trying to avoid answering a question by asking a new one instead.
So back to the original question: Why is there a forum rule that you don't obey yourself? You obviously seem to enjoy trolling. If the staff can't obey its own forum rules then why should the community?

 

[Wizzington]

No.
It's quite silly of you to trying to avoid answering a question by asking a new one instead.
So back to the original question: Why is there a forum rule that you don't obey yourself? You obviously seem to enjoy trolling. If the staff can't obey its own forum rules then why should the community?

Keep that torch burning, brave freedom fighter. One day you will make the evil game developer rue the wicked words he spoke about the Iceland tag in EU4. One day there will be a reckoning.

 

[knapp86]

Wow, Wiz is having some fun.

On Topic - Austria-Hungary was just Austria until 1867. Forming it early would basicly have to require conquering Hungary as Austria and then releasing it into a PU.

 

[AlphaSonic]

Iceland tag confirmed?

 

[MiniaAr]

Wiz, what about the sensible ideas proposed in this thread:

• Golden Horde as a Tatar union tag. Current Golden Horde renamed to Great Horde.
• Yuan for Mongolia and similar tags and/or cultures for a Mongol takeover of China (when Qing is a Manchu takeover tag).
• Kingdom of two Siciles: historical union of Sicilian and Napolitan crowns.
• Lotharingia: It would be a pretty interesting tag to form as Burgundy/Lorraine/Brabant (or other valid countries). Better than France or Netherlands in my opinion.
• Latin Empire for crusader tags (Knights, Athens, Achea, Naxos...) and/or proper cultures (Flemish, Francien?). Why not if we have kingdom of Jerusalem? There were still people claiming this title at game start.
• Rajputjana or Rajasthan for rajput culture countries.
• Turkey for Anatolian Beyliks and non-monarchy Ottomans (collapse via event instead of decision?)

I'm talking only of formables, I'd like countries like Iceland to be included as well, but it's for another topic.

 

[Wizzington]

Golden Horde as a formable: Ehh, I'd prefer something like 'Tatarstan' or 'Tataria' even if it's not historical, I don't like tags that have the government form in the name and would change the name of GH if there was anything reasonable to replace it with.
Yuan: I could see this being added.
Two Sicilies: Not significant enough. Sardinia-Piedmont at least has a use in upgrading Savoy from Duchy to Kingdom, but both Naples and Sicily are Kingdoms already.
Lotharingia: Very anachronistic. Probably not.
Latin Empire: Would be a cool alternative to Jerusalem, only thing I don't like is 'Empire' in the name.
Rajputjana: Sure, why not?
Turkey: Ehh, I think some sort of non-dynastic naming for dynastic countries that turn republics would be better.

 

[HabemusZlatan]

Yuan tag for mongolia confirmed
H Y P E B O Y S

 

[theJ]

I'm kinda hoping for Carthage, myself. Not as a cultural union, but as an alternative way of achieving relevance in the arts and sciences(I.E. westernising):
Requirements:
Be a relevant culture, own Tunis(the province), have admin tech 10, have completed trade ideas.
Effects:
Country tag and ideas changes to Carthage - ideas being focused on trade, mercenaries, and tolerance.
Tunis renamed to Carthage OR New Carthage.
Tech group changes to western.
Possibly change government to republic.
Various events become available, including the rebirth of the old carthaginian religion(assuming the devs can be arsed).

Along the same lines, we COULD have other cool new formable nations around the same "achieving semi-westernisation reformation" idea - we could have successful Zulu reformations(they got REALLY close irl), as well as completely made-up but reasonably realistic ones, such as an Andean Empire tag, various tags for successful north american native federations, a "great Kongo"... list goes on.

...see, I've kinda sorta realised that this game is always at its most interesting when you're playing towards some sort of goal - historical or not - and as such it would be a good thing if as many nations as possible had "natural" goals represented in-game to aim for.
Regardless of how likely these things were to happen IRL.

Also, unique tags are cool.
Even minor ones you've got no chance of playing as yourself.
ESPECIALLY minor ones you've got no chance of playing as yourself.
This is why the "Iceland" mentioned earlier is such a good idea...
...along with Macedonia, Sapmi, Lotharingia, Rus, Two Sicilies, and a whole host of others.

...yes, I realise some of those might actually be in the game already, they just never bloody spawn is all...

In fact, with the swanky new area system, we could (theoretically) have a separate tag for every single one of them, and have an event which spawns a "separatist movement" or even "cultural divergence" if unrest drops to sufficiently abysmal levels.

....and this is where my wishlisting may have gone just a tad too far... I'll be going back to my corner now

 

[Wizzington]

I'm not sure I can imagine anything less plausible or more anachronistic as a formable than Carthage in the EU4 era.

 

[Nikolaj-11]

I'm not sure I can imagine anything less plausible or more anachronistic as a formable than Carthage in the EU4 era.

I can: Aztecs conquering and forming Britain!

 

[zsImmortal]

Wiz, what about the sensible ideas proposed in this thread:

• Yuan for Mongolia and similar tags and/or cultures for a Mongol takeover of China (when Qing is a Manchu takeover tag)
• Turkey for Anatolian Beyliks and non-monarchy Ottomans (collapse via event instead of decision?)

I'm talking only of formables, I'd like countries like Iceland to be included as well, but it's for another topic.

Mongolia already is the Yuan as is. It's the Northern Yuan. If there's anything they could make for an Altaic union, maybe the Dayan Khanate (Great Yuan Khanate). Though this only makes sense if its the Borjigin clan that is leading (same issue with the Yuan), but since the Ottomans can switch dynasties, it's probably not that big of a deal.

Like I've mentionned before, Turkey doesn't make sense since Turk is a European term for the Ottomans. Would probably just be fine if they kept their own dynasty names. Or maybe just forming the Sultanate of Rum if they have the appropriate provinces (kind of like the Ruthenia decision).

What about the Maratha? Would be pretty cool to be able to form the Maratha if you have all of their cores and have Maratha as the primary culture (would require shift in 1444).

 

[Wizzington]

I can: Aztecs conquering and forming Britain!

Are you telling me that British culture is *not* founded on sacrificing people to appease invisible forces?

Someone should tell the current government.

 

[Kapitalisti]

Ice... land?

Did you mean 'Western Norway'?

I think he means "Southern Jan Mayen".

 

[MiniaAr]

Golden Horde as a formable: Ehh, I'd prefer something like 'Tatarstan' or 'Tataria' even if it's not historical, I don't like tags that have the government form in the name and would change the name of GH if there was anything reasonable to replace it with.
Yuan: I could see this being added.
Two Sicilies: Not significant enough. Sardinia-Piedmont at least has a use in upgrading Savoy from Duchy to Kingdom, but both Naples and Sicily are Kingdoms already.
Lotharingia: Very anachronistic. Probably not.
Latin Empire: Would be a cool alternative to Jerusalem, only thing I don't like is 'Empire' in the name.
Rajputjana: Sure, why not?
Turkey: Ehh, I think some sort of non-dynastic naming for dynastic countries that turn republics would be better.

Thank you very much for answering.
Some follow ups:

• For Golden Horde, you could use Kipchak or some variation of it. This has the advantage of not having Horde in it .
• Lotharingia might seem anachronistic, but both Philippe and Charles of Burgundy asked the Emperor for a crown (and got refused). Nobody knows exactly which crown was asked, but the one of Lotharingia is an usual suspect. A Lotharingia tag would be based on what if it was accepted.
• About the Latin Empire, you're right. Romania was also a name for it, but this is already used elsewhere. Or maybe we could have two Romanias, as there are already two Munsters. You could name it Romaniæ (German Munster is actually Münster). You don't get that many opportunities to use æ nowadays.
  

  Spoiler

  The Empire of Romania (Latin: Imperium Romaniae), more commonly known in historiography as the Latin Empire (Greek: Λατινική Αυτοκρατορία) or Latin Empire of Constantinople, was a feudal Crusader state founded by the leaders of the Fourth Crusade on lands captured from the Byzantine Empire.
  The original name of this state in the Latin language was Imperium Romaniae ("Empire of Romania"). This name was used based on the fact that the common name for the Eastern Roman (Byzantine) Empire in this period had been Romania (Ῥωμανία, "Land of the Romans").

Mongolia already is the Yuan as is. It's the Northern Yuan. If there's anything they could make for an Altaic union, maybe the Dayan Khanate (Great Yuan Khanate). Though this only makes sense if its the Borjigin clan that is leading (same issue with the Yuan), but since the Ottomans can switch dynasties, it's probably not that big of a deal.

Well, you're right on flavor, but gameplay wise, implementing a Yuan forming decision based on the Qing one would allow Mongolia to get upgraded to Empire (something the Northern Yuan were adamant they still were), as well as giving claims and more generally, a good sense of fullfillment while playing in this region (in my opinion of course). Therefore, I think this formable has a lot of merit being included into the game. Forming Yuan would of course require to own Beijing and a good chunk of NorthEast China.

 

[Nikolaj-11]

Are you telling me that British culture is *not* founded on sacrificing people to appease invisible forces?

Someone should tell the current government.

I don't think High Priest Cameron would listen anyway.