More dynamic end of war options?

[DPKdebator]

Hello all, and for the first time in a long time, I'll be doing a slideshow!

In HOI3, I've always thought end-war was bland. You could either conquer, puppet, change ideology (and that worked well, didn't it?), maybe capture an odd-looking region.

Thus, here is my idea for an improved end of war (note that these provinces have nothing to do with ingame provinces):

There's friction on the borders. Tensions are rising We get it already... between the Netherlands and Belgium over Ned Flanders's ownership.

what do you mean the netherlands thinks its okay to invade belgium?

Well, they want to, and they're going to try and win-

Now, if over half your cities are taken over, you have an option to surrender. If you surrender, the wargoal of the other nation automatically is applied.
If you're a player and a country surrenders or you feel you're satisfied with your conquests you can open the peace editor. This allows you to change what provinces you annex, if you puppet the country, or if your warscore is 100- annex it.

Since the Netherlands won the war, their wargoal of annexing Flanders is implemented.

Questions, comments, criticism? Post below!

 

[SpanglishEmpire]

For me the time period is too short to warrant more options, We only get a 9 year period, In EU IV or CK2 yes we have hundreds of years to take neighbors piece meal in smaller conflicts rather than 1 big war to the death. It serves little purpose adding things like this.

If you fight for two years and take only a part of the country what next it is not like you are going to leave them in a weakened state for long while you rebuild your forces. You only have 7 years left.

 

[Eh up me duck]

When I used to play Darkest Hour in MP (sorry, I skipped out on HOI3), I always wanted some dynamics for a cold war/post war scenario. There were several countries where the USSR and the allies had partitioned amongst themselves, but there was never any proxy war or anything - both sides of the country simply kept building up their armies and nothing ever happened.

I don't think it would be *too* complex to code something like :

if (communist_provinces>3 && democratic provinces >3) { trigger civil_war}

where civil_war has some generic events for both sides being supported by their overlords.

 

[Leermeister]

Best thing to do would make the game go beyond 48, like Armageddon or darkest hour. If the game ended in say 1960 alot more factors come into play in 1944-45 for the coming cold war. Otherwise it doesn't really matter because if you take your time game ends anyway in 1948. So hopefully one day there is an expansion that includes a longer timeline.

 

[ViKiNG-NoR]

Thats what i dont like in these games. the timeline. i want to be free to play as long as i want, counqer what i want and use my time. i feel like these scenarios with timelimit gives me a demo feeling and its not letting me play the game full out. if i used many hours\days\weeks on one game to counquer half europe for example but i want to take mutch more, and then get a message that the game scenario is ended i just lose all the progress and stuff i build up and my plans forward. Thats not fun at all. Really hope they can give me the option to play unlimited time.

 

[Qemarar]

The only time I could see this system working is only for conquering large countries like the USSR, Germany, or China where their fate would be up to a lot of decision making. For example, if the USSR hadn't helped defeat Germany, the allies might have made different decisions about what to to with some of its holdings.

For example, the UN could administrate portions of Germany,

or the allies might just give East Prussia to Poland,

or the allies might even create a Free State of Prussia.

 

[agentgb]

Has mentioned for HOI, since the time period is so short, it hardly seems worth it, although a part of me would like to see such functions may in case a modder could make use of them and bring a cold war version of HOI.

I mean, if paradox made a cold war DLC, it could give players somthing to play past once ww2 is over, and then such mechanics may come into there own. But then i feel the nuclear system would need to be revised, to compliment the expansion of the timeline. But could make HOI a bit more interesting, and a slighty more intriguing end game. Would be nice to throw all these fancy teched up weapons at someone, instead of the war being over when you have helicopters, jets, and nukes before they have seen any real action. Could be fun having transport planes upgraded into some alternative helicopter unit that not only drop units behind lines, but pick them up from there aswell.

but wud need a revised nuclear system, as i suggested here.
http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum...garding-nuclear-amp-V2-Development&highlight=

 

[justin6477]

I'd argue allowing us to annex specific territories has a lot of value. Let's say that, as France, you push back the Germans and the allies force Germany to the peace table early. What should happen? Well France is going to want the Saarland and maybe the entire left bank of the Rhine. If Germany beats the crap out of the USSR, do we really want a Drang nach Osten button again? Maybe I want Russian provinces but I don't want to go all the way to the Urals, maybe I just want the Ukraine, why should I not be allowed to decide what territories I want? And, on that point, HOI IV should probably crib (and improve) the puppet state system that launched with AoW. Maybe I don't want anything east of Poland, but I see no reason why I wouldn't want a Ruthenian puppet state to bear the brunt of future Russian aggression. Even on the point of minors, say Greece joins the Comintern and picks a fight with Axis Turkey, why shouldn't they be able to enact their earlier Megali Idea?

Not every conflict by every state should be all-out total war with the future of nations hanging in the balance.

 

[ViKiNG-NoR]

So i cant take what territories i want? like u say, if i only want ukraine from soviet and nothing more, thats not possible? I tought this game was going to be more sandbox. more free to do what i want.

 

[Kovax]

The lack of suitable wargoals, and having to annex an entire country to get the handful of provinces that I want, have been a pet peeve of mine since the initial release of HOI3. That goes for Germany in Poland, Yugoslavia, or Russia, or for any of a dozen other countries that had an interest in a particular area, but didn't really want to have to conquer and garrison an entire other country to get it.

My "pet peeve" is that Hungary had something over half of its pre-WWI land area and 40% of its population turned over to the surrounding countries (Romania, Yugoslavia, Czechoslovakia, and even a tiny sliver to Austria) at the end of WWI. Historically, about half of the lost land was regained (briefly) through the 1st Vienna conference, the breakup of Yugoslavia, and 2nd Vienna. Unfortunately, the game provides no way of obtaining the OTHER half of that lost land (extending to, and following, the ring of the Carpathian Mountains) without annexing the entire set of surrounding countries in their entirety (YUG, ROM, and SLO). They don't even get cores on that other land (because it was ethnically "mixed", like the rest of HUN), even if Italy gets cores on land in YUG despite far less historically or ethnically valid claims. If I manage to defeat ROM or YUG, I want the ability to reclaim the territory that represents what Hungary historically struggled to regain, not settle for what it gets in the game automatically, whether it does anything or not, and not have to garrison the entire annexed country to get the moderate-sized piece in dispute. Of course, now, after close to a century of existence under other governments, and the passing of virtually everyone who was alive at the time of its separation, it's no longer "Hungarian", but at the start of HOI3, the "30 year rule" was still only 18 years along its course, and a reintegration with the country would have been hailed by roughly half the population as "liberation".

 

[f1nalstand17]

The lack of suitable wargoals, and having to annex an entire country to get the handful of provinces that I want, have been a pet peeve of mine since the initial release of HOI3. That goes for Germany in Poland, Yugoslavia, or Russia, or for any of a dozen other countries that had an interest in a particular area, but didn't really want to have to conquer and garrison an entire other country to get it.

My "pet peeve" is that Hungary had something over half of its pre-WWI land area and 40% of its population turned over to the surrounding countries (Romania, Yugoslavia, Czechoslovakia, and even a tiny sliver to Austria) at the end of WWI. Historically, about half of the lost land was regained (briefly) through the 1st Vienna conference, the breakup of Yugoslavia, and 2nd Vienna. Unfortunately, the game provides no way of obtaining the OTHER half of that lost land (extending to, and following, the ring of the Carpathian Mountains) without annexing the entire set of surrounding countries in their entirety (YUG, ROM, and SLO). They don't even get cores on that other land (because it was ethnically "mixed", like the rest of HUN), even if Italy gets cores on land in YUG despite far less historically or ethnically valid claims. If I manage to defeat ROM or YUG, I want the ability to reclaim the territory that represents what Hungary historically struggled to regain, not settle for what it gets in the game automatically, whether it does anything or not, and not have to garrison the entire annexed country to get the moderate-sized piece in dispute. Of course, now, after close to a century of existence under other governments, and the passing of virtually everyone who was alive at the time of its separation, it's no longer "Hungarian", but at the start of HOI3, the "30 year rule" was still only 18 years along its course, and a reintegration with the country would have been hailed by roughly half the population as "liberation".

Precisely. One of My pet peeves was the fact that GER did not have cores on Alscace-Lorraine, and the cores in Poland varied (for some reason) from only Danzig-West Prussia to all the land lost to Poland after WWI.

 

[wingo]

Hungarians should stop complaining about lost land, it was never truly theirs to begin with. Turkey got over the loss of Balkans, why can't you?

 

[Glustrod]

He's not complaining about his lost land(he even said today the claims aren't valid anymore).

He complains that the Kingdom of Hungary cannot be restored with ingame tools. Which is kinda true, even if i'm not interested in Hungary a single bit (other than annexing it sometimes as germany... ).

It's the same with greece not being able to conquer Constantinople and minor asia west coast, there is just no region selectable to conquer. They must conquer Turkey as a whole. (And yes I know there were barely any greek ppl living at the weast coast anymore)

 

[LCH98]

The thing that has always bugged me is if you want a part of country you sometimes have to conquer most of the country anyway, making total annexation more economic.

As germany, if i want to have just the danzig corridor (attacking before the czech event and thus the protection of poland), i'd have to invade the entire country, defeat their army and take most of their cities. annexing the entire country would take the same amount of effort and ground conquered, but with much more gain.

The same goes for the Soviets sometimes having to take Helsinki before being able to annex karelia.

The more logic thing would be to be able to claim certain territories, and when all of them have been in your hands for over a certain amount of time (to prevent a spam of paratroops by belgium taking the ruhr and annexing it), you can take those area's.

 

[CanOmer]

 

[Kadanz]

alright alright. We belgians like to be in spotlight from time to time, so the whole world knows we still exist. But why does it always have to end in us being conquered? :unsure:

 

[Opanashc]

alright alright. We belgians like to be in spotlight from time to time, so the whole world knows we still exist. But why does it always have to end in us being conquered? :unsure:

The fact, that most maps need a magnifying glass to find Belgium, might have something to do with it.
Sorry.

 

[CanOmer]

Bakker Schut Plan

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_annexation_of_German_territory_after_World_War_II