-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Threat was a problem in FTM, I seem to recall. It needed some reduction, otherwise one's Threat would prevent your own potential allies from joining your faction, or even getting close enough to your part of the diplomatic triangle to do so in extreme cases. 90% of the world huddled in a little ball near the center of the triangle, appalled and repelled by all of the factions, and no amount of Diplomatic Influence or Relations could overcome it.
It was an overwhelmingly powerful exploit to raise Threat on a member of the other factions, so nobody else could join them.
TFH then reduced Threat by at least an order of magnitude, maybe closer to two orders, instead of the 50-75% reduction that I would have expected, so now it's just about pointless. You get more diplomatic drift from a single trade deal than from GER's insane Threat after DOW'ing half of Europe.
- BTW - THIS is why registering one's game here on the Paradox site is a good idea, so you have the little icons in your signature block that show which games and expansions you have. Other posters can tailor advice to your current version, rather than guessing or having to look back through earlier posts to see if you mentioned it.
- 1
Is there any way to put a figure on what Impossible or Unlikely means in real terms. Norway is Impossible, so I take that as 100% "NO - don't even bother asking". Aust, NZ, Can and SA are all displayed as Unlikely. I spam them with join Allies requests frequently but have yet to have any positive response. If I knew it was 100% no, then I will end my fruitless attempts. I doesn't feel like 95 or even 99% chance. (GER threat is around 240, to me and around 40 to them. My threat to Ger is about 180).
USA still have Neutrality of 52. My fault as UK taking out Japan, which would have been their bigger threat possibly? I am considering an invasion of Ecuador as it has no GUI from USA. My thinking being that will do interesting things to USA threat level.
I did try to register my game here a few times, but was unsuccessful. I had the box collection up to FTM. I forget now what the problem was. I need to hunt down the box for the cd key and try again.
USA still have Neutrality of 52. My fault as UK taking out Japan, which would have been their bigger threat possibly? I am considering an invasion of Ecuador as it has no GUI from USA. My thinking being that will do interesting things to USA threat level.
I did try to register my game here a few times, but was unsuccessful. I had the box collection up to FTM. I forget now what the problem was. I need to hunt down the box for the cd key and try again.
- 1
180 Threat on GER is insanely high for an Allied faction member. The aggressive actions and non-reserve units have probably scared off your potential faction members. Normally, GER ends up with 100-200 Threat, and the UK rarely goes above 50, usually a lot lower than that, unless one of the Axis countries has been successfully raising the UK's perceived Threat. Well. you got your early war entry, so now you're seeing the negative side of it.
- 1
- 1
I'm still curious if there's a way to quantify "unlikey". It seems to be behaving like "impossible". Zero chance?
- 1
Weird. Germany added DoW on Norway finally in July 1940. Of the Dominions, only Canada flipped from Unlikely to Highly Likely. I don't believe the threat changed that much. I'm going to replay the period in slow time to catch the numbers.
- 1
Odd. On replay it was several days after the Norway DoWar that Canada changed it's stance. Straight flip from Unlikely to Highly likely. I don't recall now if there is a state of just "Likely".
Canada joined again at first request.
Canada joined again at first request.
- 1
Could be that Germany's DoW on Norway made GER look scary enough for Canada to seek an alliance.
- 1
So looking at the numbers. Ger threat on CAN was 42.3. Rose to 42.6 after the Ger Dow on Norway. Chance of CAN joining Allies still Unlikely.
Over next 10 days the threat rises to 42.7. The Chance of CAN flips to Very Likely. Sometimes it's soon after the 42.7 is reached, another time it's a week later.
What's bugging me now is that South Africa was the next closest Dominion in terms of Ger threat, and ought to be the next to flip. I tagged into Ger and mass DoW'd the world. Even though South Africa had far greater threat on it than CAN did, it still won't budge from Unlikely.
The other numbers look similar, including UK threat. Though I wonder if threats from others is part of the equation? Like perhaps Canada considers threat from Russia as well as threat from Germany?
Over next 10 days the threat rises to 42.7. The Chance of CAN flips to Very Likely. Sometimes it's soon after the 42.7 is reached, another time it's a week later.
What's bugging me now is that South Africa was the next closest Dominion in terms of Ger threat, and ought to be the next to flip. I tagged into Ger and mass DoW'd the world. Even though South Africa had far greater threat on it than CAN did, it still won't budge from Unlikely.
The other numbers look similar, including UK threat. Though I wonder if threats from others is part of the equation? Like perhaps Canada considers threat from Russia as well as threat from Germany?
- 1
As far as I've seen or read here on the forums, only the highest source of Threat is considered. Then again, the AI uses scripted actions, so some of those countries might be doing some kind of buildup or mobilization before they will accept an offer to join the faction, and won't budge until those preparations are completed. In most cases, they'll offer to join at some point if you forget to ask. With the UK's insanely high Threat, it puts a kink in the normal event chain, so it's hard to predict what will happen.
- 1
You're right in that something else is going on unseen. I went into the savegame and gave South Africa a massive threat boost from Germany and the join chance remained unchanged. I also added extra threat from Italy (another Axis), and from Russia, and slashed UK threat. Still the stance remained "Unlikely". Also let the game run a few days.
There seems to be no other stats to play with in that part of the savegame.
There seems to be no other stats to play with in that part of the savegame.
This has driven me insane but finally got something near a solution.
Here's what changed Canada's decision to join the Alliance from Likely ( i.e. NO ) to Highly Likely. It was not my threat, or our trading or anything to do with spies or diplomacy. What changed it was that Canada's IC went above 50!!!!
There's a file called ai_diplomacy and it's mentioned in there. Canada was building IC and the few days delay in becoming operational was the quirky variation I was seeing.
Having found the file and trying to figure out what it meant, I discovered this old thread. It covers some pretty important stuff on diplomacy.....
forum.paradoxplaza.com
Here's what changed Canada's decision to join the Alliance from Likely ( i.e. NO ) to Highly Likely. It was not my threat, or our trading or anything to do with spies or diplomacy. What changed it was that Canada's IC went above 50!!!!
There's a file called ai_diplomacy and it's mentioned in there. Canada was building IC and the few days delay in becoming operational was the quirky variation I was seeing.
Having found the file and trying to figure out what it meant, I discovered this old thread. It covers some pretty important stuff on diplomacy.....
FTM "Invite to Faction" Summary and Proposed Changes
Here's how the current "Invite to Faction" process works in FTM: To enable the option to invite a country to your faction: The target country must be closely aligned to your faction (use Influence Nation) The target country must have an...
- 1
Put your spies in Germany from day 1 and put all points in "raise threat" (no points in counterespionage). You can declare war on Germany after Anschluss. Since it is an offensive war this will put you at war with Japan, so I advise garrisons in Borneo, Malaysia and the Dutch East Indies. At that point, use your navy and overseas airbases to strangle Italy and Japan.
- 1
- 1
It's something I may try next time around. My aim here was to avoid an early europe war. Take the Far East strategic events by grabbing bits of Guanxi and Japan. Could then let France fall later while picking on Italy. Leaves final one on one with Germany, then perhaps Soviets.
Worked out as an easy start because I crushed the Japanese navy much easier than I was comfortable with. I should have given them extra time to gain power and be a better challenge.
Worked out as an easy start because I crushed the Japanese navy much easier than I was comfortable with. I should have given them extra time to gain power and be a better challenge.
Just discovered that being at war with Germany after Anchluss throws all the Munich Treaty stuff out. As a result Germany will not get any of the Czech bonus. This will reduce their manpower and also Armour builds. Also (I think) Poland attack event goes out too possibly along with the M-R treaty?
- 1
M-R Pact is probably out the window, but as long as GER starts the process (Remilitarize the Rhineland and/or Anschluss), they should still trigger "Danzig or War" on schedule. Playing a minor country in one game, I killed off German spies in CZE, delaying Munich by several months. They triggered "Danzig or War" before they were able to do the "First Vienna" decision.
- 2
Thanks Kovax. So what will that mean for AI Germany? They'll keep all of Poland but have a small hostile border with Russia?
- 1
Most likely, GER will take all of Poland, and the later events where the SU demands Bessarabia from Romania won't trigger, so Romania won't join the Axis. The SU also won't annex the Baltic states, leaving them neutral. Overall, I'd say that losing out on a handful of IC from Bessarabia and the Baltic states hurts the Soviets a bit less than the Axis' loss of Romania's 20-ish mediocre divisions, but the extra IC and resources from (non-core) eastern Poland should adequately compensate Germany.
For a human playing Germany, that's a great tradeoff, since it gives you an extra year to build up infrastructure in eastern Poland before sending your army deep into Russia, as well as putting more IC into your own capable hands instead of those of an uncontrollable ally with weak techs. Been there, done that, and it makes the whole Barbarossa invasion look like the proverbial hot knife through butter. For the AI, it's just more things to possibly go wrong.
The wild card in the whole affair is, with no non-aggression treaty in place, the German AI's potential to jump the gun and invade the Soviets a year early. The odds of that may vary quite a bit, depending on events elsewhere and the overall balance of forces visible to the AI. There's plenty that can go either right or wrong, or both, so enjoy the madness.
For a human playing Germany, that's a great tradeoff, since it gives you an extra year to build up infrastructure in eastern Poland before sending your army deep into Russia, as well as putting more IC into your own capable hands instead of those of an uncontrollable ally with weak techs. Been there, done that, and it makes the whole Barbarossa invasion look like the proverbial hot knife through butter. For the AI, it's just more things to possibly go wrong.
The wild card in the whole affair is, with no non-aggression treaty in place, the German AI's potential to jump the gun and invade the Soviets a year early. The odds of that may vary quite a bit, depending on events elsewhere and the overall balance of forces visible to the AI. There's plenty that can go either right or wrong, or both, so enjoy the madness.
- 1
- 1