I definitely don’t want gavelkind. Too much hustle with either bastards or succession.
I want Feudal Elective with being the only elector
So maybe I do both Jain and Stewardship genius heirs 
Mordvin Kingdom - playing tall
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I want Feudal Elective with being the only elector
So maybe I do both Jain and Stewardship genius heirs .png){kind=avatar}
But not having full control over your heir is half the fun!
But anyway, if that's your goal, then you should make a custom kingdom. The duchies of Vladimir, Mochkava, and Murom is ten provinces large, so you can reasonably hold them and form a de jure kingdom from them. Then, anyone outside these three duchies can be held by vassals, but will have no rights to vote on any election.
Or, you can just stay Muslim and use Open. Or reform Suomenusko to use Agnatic Clans and use Open that way, instead.
But anyway, if that's your goal, then you should make a custom kingdom. The duchies of Vladimir, Mochkava, and Murom is ten provinces large, so you can reasonably hold them and form a de jure kingdom from them. Then, anyone outside these three duchies can be held by vassals, but will have no rights to vote on any election.
Or, you can just stay Muslim and use Open. Or reform Suomenusko to use Agnatic Clans and use Open that way, instead.
I’m not if it changed with holy fury but I think in kingdoms only dukes are electors, not counts. So if you stay king tier, keep two duchies for yourself amd have the rest one county counts you just mught keep control over you inheritance.
Or even with one duke vassal you keep control since at a tie king wins the elections.
Or even with one duke vassal you keep control since at a tie king wins the elections.
Do not forget that first wifes stewardship also counts towards the deesne limit, but only at half rate aka 5 main guy stewardship = 10 first spouse leadership
Damn, yesterday was tough. I made a stupid mistake. I was like: "okay, the sooner I get that free cities & temples per province Feudalism gives, the sooner I become RICHHHH!". So, I moved into Feudalism.
Couple of year later. I am unreformed Suomenusko again, but this time Feudal. So, no mass conversion for me anymore, right?
Remember the thread on raiders being insignificant nuissance? Well, not my story. Especially when their stack of 2-3k raid my province that is so conveniently located next to my capital but between two major rivers. Damn they own that thing and my armies too, when I send them over river. That poor province is gonna be total sh*t for ages to come.
I am also rather poor, and can't win an offensive war againt that Merya chief with equal (after he calls in his tribal buddies) sized armies.
So, any tips for getting back on my feet?
Rich invites suffering accidents? Spy on focus on 'ransom capable' high chiefs/chiefs? Raid like crazy and cross fingers to get some prisoners?
Couple of year later. I am unreformed Suomenusko again, but this time Feudal. So, no mass conversion for me anymore, right?
Remember the thread on raiders being insignificant nuissance? Well, not my story. Especially when their stack of 2-3k raid my province that is so conveniently located next to my capital but between two major rivers. Damn they own that thing and my armies too, when I send them over river. That poor province is gonna be total sh*t for ages to come.
I am also rather poor, and can't win an offensive war againt that Merya chief with equal (after he calls in his tribal buddies) sized armies.
So, any tips for getting back on my feet?
Rich invites suffering accidents? Spy on focus on 'ransom capable' high chiefs/chiefs? Raid like crazy and cross fingers to get some prisoners?
I strongly suggest grabbing a developed coastal county or three, (or develop it yourself - easy to do if is a tribe) and then spend most of your time being 'viking' after you form your kingdom. The reality is that you can't really build up tall unless if you have a good source of income to actually make the upgrades (once you hit Feudalism).. and making other tribes tributaries, just wont give you enough money. This does mean going beyond your controlling Kingdom, but really, all you need is a handful of ships to raid.
Once you secure a steady source of money (and prestige), you can build up the tribes in your core demesne. Four fully developed tribal demesne along with a good councillor and high martial will allow you to field over 15k levy easily (thats not even counting your retinue). Once you get to that point, you work your way towards Feudalism. As a Feudal lord, I strongly suggest spamming baronies in your Capital county to control directly while spamming cities in other counties in your duchy for vassals. If over demesne limit, feel free to grant a county under the Duchy to someone else, as you can always plot to revoke counties in your capital duchy.
Controlling Uppland like this as Feudal lord, I was able to field over 20k levy even though Im only half way upgraded with my baronies.
Once you secure a steady source of money (and prestige), you can build up the tribes in your core demesne. Four fully developed tribal demesne along with a good councillor and high martial will allow you to field over 15k levy easily (thats not even counting your retinue). Once you get to that point, you work your way towards Feudalism. As a Feudal lord, I strongly suggest spamming baronies in your Capital county to control directly while spamming cities in other counties in your duchy for vassals. If over demesne limit, feel free to grant a county under the Duchy to someone else, as you can always plot to revoke counties in your capital duchy.
Controlling Uppland like this as Feudal lord, I was able to field over 20k levy even though Im only half way upgraded with my baronies.
Don’t give counties in your capital duchy away. These give you a levy bonus and if you want to revoke it you most likely have to go to war for this and you siege away its prosperity.
Give awa counties in other duchies. You can plot to revoke them as well if the character holds a second county or his county doesn’t belong to the duchy he holds. So give the count you want to revoke some duchy will allow you to plot revoke his county.
Or give it to a heathen. With the right law you can just take it whenever you want.
Give awa counties in other duchies. You can plot to revoke them as well if the character holds a second county or his county doesn’t belong to the duchy he holds. So give the count you want to revoke some duchy will allow you to plot revoke his county.
Or give it to a heathen. With the right law you can just take it whenever you want.
Since it is Ironman, is there a way to get back to tribal?
If I get to tribal I would have a penalty for owning castles right? And I would not be able to develop them?
Regarding sea port, perhaps I must abandon my wish to do a clean K_Vladimir run and conquer some whatever seaside province as my port town...
If I get to tribal I would have a penalty for owning castles right? And I would not be able to develop them?
Regarding sea port, perhaps I must abandon my wish to do a clean K_Vladimir run
and conquer some whatever seaside province as my port town...
At the moment I have only 1-2 castles, the rest are still tribes. And I can temporarily move capital if needed, no problem.
Yeah, that's the other reason you don't go feudal early as the Mordvins. Suddenly you're the #1 raiding target.
I've been Tribal for a century in my game, and I still feel good about it.
(Koshel the Grinner is actually a few leaders ago; I got deposed through a strong claim duel but I've been rebuilding croon the inside from here, making sure the kingdom's successors don't screw up. Of course, with Eldership, it's easy to get back on top; just name the king your heir and wait to die. So I'm not rushing returning to the throne.)
I've been Tribal for a century in my game, and I still feel good about it.
(Koshel the Grinner is actually a few leaders ago; I got deposed through a strong claim duel but I've been rebuilding croon the inside from here, making sure the kingdom's successors don't screw up. Of course, with Eldership, it's easy to get back on top; just name the king your heir and wait to die. So I'm not rushing returning to the throne.)
Since it is Ironman, is there a way to get back to tribal?
If I get to tribal I would have a penalty for owning castles right? And I would not be able to develop them?
Regarding sea port, perhaps I must abandon my wish to do a clean K_Vladimir run
1.) yes, give your heir a tribal barony, then give him an equal rank title as you have then make succesion happen
or play with gavelkind and after succesion nonprimary heirs sometimes get randomized government s after succesion
if you want to turn provinces tribal aswell you can burn down its holdimgs
2.) or maybe you could make it dejure drift into Vladimír bypassing that rule
After today’s session things look much brighter.
I think move to Feudal was made more difficult by death of the character, and I had to live 6-7 years through the regency.
Now Tikshaya The Butcher is 23, veteran of Followers Warriors Lodge, I make around 10+ ducats a month, 7k army (incl. 2,200 inherited light infantry/archer retinues). Castles get slowly developed.
Recently due to 3 sons to avoid succession crisis I again switched away from Suomenusko, this time to Romuva, but I can’t see option for Eldership succession - why?
I think move to Feudal was made more difficult by death of the character, and I had to live 6-7 years through the regency.
Now Tikshaya The Butcher is 23, veteran of Followers Warriors Lodge, I make around 10+ ducats a month, 7k army (incl. 2,200 inherited light infantry/archer retinues). Castles get slowly developed.
Recently due to 3 sons to avoid succession crisis I again switched away from Suomenusko, this time to Romuva, but I can’t see option for Eldership succession - why?
i have a feeling like eldership has "tribal" in its potential, try looking into the succesion laws file and look for "potential"
Some tips, perhaps not for seasoned players:
1) check out couple of invites. Maybe you get lucky with rich (50+ ducats make difference) childless elder. You do not even need to kill him. His ducats are like deposit now.
2) I used retinues advice from forum. At some point I only had 1,200 realm army, but had saved 2,200 tribal retinues (LI + Archers) that opérate by prestige. I put them all on same flank under direct leadership of my guy. He got Light Foot, a bit later Inspired Leader. Now he added Shield of Tundra. That flank was my savior in close battles against raiders and other “problems”.
3) use each and any option to make vassals happy. All minor titles, guardians if possible. Make them like you.
1) check out couple of invites. Maybe you get lucky with rich (50+ ducats make difference) childless elder. You do not even need to kill him. His ducats are like deposit now.
2) I used retinues advice from forum. At some point I only had 1,200 realm army, but had saved 2,200 tribal retinues (LI + Archers) that opérate by prestige. I put them all on same flank under direct leadership of my guy. He got Light Foot, a bit later Inspired Leader. Now he added Shield of Tundra. That flank was my savior in close battles against raiders and other “problems”.
3) use each and any option to make vassals happy. All minor titles, guardians if possible. Make them like you.
So, I was about to stay in Vladimir only, but there was an opportunity to do couple of conquests/ “force vassalization” and capture 4 Romuva sites. And I took it.
As a result - reformed Romuva into some Buddhist hippy religion.
Peaceful (+3 demesne, +15 vassal opinion)
Astrology (so that my non-martial rulers get some society)
Monasticism (2 learning)
Autonomous (2 diplomacy + whatever I pick on school).
So, was about to grant independence to everyone, when voila - The Mongols. Year is only 1000 AD for Perkunas sake!
As a result - reformed Romuva into some Buddhist hippy religion.
Peaceful (+3 demesne, +15 vassal opinion)
Astrology (so that my non-martial rulers get some society)
Monasticism (2 learning)
Autonomous (2 diplomacy + whatever I pick on school).
So, was about to grant independence to everyone, when voila - The Mongols. Year is only 1000 AD for Perkunas sake!
I know non-martial rulers can join the Society. But if you happen to have a frail diplomat you are not getting the most out of it. Duels would be a suicide. On other hand they can easily promote through ranks of Hermetics.
Yesterday I got annoyed by stupid war score mechanics.
So, I got Bulgar Chiefdom as my Tributary State and then some Perm far North guy declared on them. It was a claim CB.
He NEVER moved his forces out of that North Pole! And war score never ticked up. Wtf?
So I delayed my Warrior Lodge progress since could not duel or raid due to being in war for 6 years (expected war score to go up). In the end sent my forces up North, ate attrition, sieged the bastard, sweared a lot in the process and got the war ended... only to have my other Tributary State Ryazan drag me vs Ha Ha my other Tributary State Chernigov. Man those Tributary State mechanics are so inferior to proper vassals!
So, I got Bulgar Chiefdom as my Tributary State and then some Perm far North guy declared on them. It was a claim CB.
He NEVER moved his forces out of that North Pole! And war score never ticked up. Wtf?
So I delayed my Warrior Lodge progress since could not duel or raid due to being in war for 6 years (expected war score to go up). In the end sent my forces up North, ate attrition, sieged the bastard, sweared a lot in the process and got the war ended... only to have my other Tributary State Ryazan drag me vs Ha Ha my other Tributary State Chernigov. Man those Tributary State mechanics are so inferior to proper vassals!
If you want to know why the Abbasids in 769 never amount to anything despite being the largest blob, this is why.
Wow, that was a fantastic character last play session.
He was named Tylze after God of the Moon and started as a Dull guy of Martial Education, he lived through the times of Black Death and during middle of his reign got the not so flattering "The Frog" nickname.
Mongols arrived a bit early
But his personal combat skill let him progress through the Band of Medeina warrior lodge. Legendary gathering was started when he got diagnozed with cancer aged 50. Mystic physician kept him going. He got exalted by men. He survived long enough to build a Great Library, loose Dull trait and become known as a patron of Arts. Also he helped few realms with conversion to Romuva.
Legend bar slowly filled up. He was not allowed to contribute via duels due to bad health, but he was allowed into his last adventure - the Legendary Journey in France. Aged 59 he battled some of the toughest men in France and survived them all returning home as a hero. Meet King Tylze The Philosopher of Mordava, founder of his own bloodline (even two):
greatest Mordvin ruler so far
He is still alive and is facing one of the most defining challenges for his lifetime. Mongols had conquered neighboring provinces. Now, what should The Philosopher Warrior king of Peaceful Romuva Mordvins? Swear Fealty to Mongols, join the Defensive Pact or hope that assassins manage to kill great Khan before he attacks Mordova? His son is betrothed to daughter of Mongols' heir, therefore Non-Agression pact would come into force as soon as the Old Khagan rides into the other side of the Sun.
p.s.
Quite fun to play the tall game. Economically and by research Erzyanpils is the center of Eastern Europe. At the same time any war provides a real challenge, at least during the first 5-10 years of a new ruler. Or having a non-martial ruler.
He was named Tylze after God of the Moon and started as a Dull guy of Martial Education, he lived through the times of Black Death and during middle of his reign got the not so flattering "The Frog" nickname.
Mongols arrived a bit early
But his personal combat skill let him progress through the Band of Medeina warrior lodge. Legendary gathering was started when he got diagnozed with cancer aged 50. Mystic physician kept him going. He got exalted by men. He survived long enough to build a Great Library, loose Dull trait and become known as a patron of Arts. Also he helped few realms with conversion to Romuva.
Legend bar slowly filled up. He was not allowed to contribute via duels due to bad health, but he was allowed into his last adventure - the Legendary Journey in France. Aged 59 he battled some of the toughest men in France and survived them all returning home as a hero. Meet King Tylze The Philosopher of Mordava, founder of his own bloodline (even two):
greatest Mordvin ruler so far
He is still alive and is facing one of the most defining challenges for his lifetime. Mongols had conquered neighboring provinces. Now, what should The Philosopher Warrior king of Peaceful Romuva Mordvins? Swear Fealty to Mongols, join the Defensive Pact or hope that assassins manage to kill great Khan before he attacks Mordova? His son is betrothed to daughter of Mongols' heir, therefore Non-Agression pact would come into force as soon as the Old Khagan rides into the other side of the Sun.
p.s.
Quite fun to play the tall game. Economically and by research Erzyanpils is the center of Eastern Europe. At the same time any war provides a real challenge, at least during the first 5-10 years of a new ruler. Or having a non-martial ruler.
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