Monotheism Rising: The Age of Faith General Discussion

[ThePatriot1776]

After much discussion between all the coders of the mod, we have decided to implement a new trait system that brings CK2 closer to being an RPG. The new trait system will be a vast improvement over the current vanilla trait system. We're all excited about the new possibilities with the changed game play.

Trait System Overview​

The trait heading will be referred to as the discipline and every trait under it can be learned. For stats and foci that have multiple disciplines, characters can learn up to two disciplines under that stat or can learn two different disciplines under two different stats. Each of the traits is upgradeable to level 4 with the bonus stacking for each level. Tutors will be able to teach up to one level lower or level 1. A child will be able to learn the tutor's non-teaching discipline that takes 6.5 years before they have to find another tutor to learn their second discipline.

The experience system will be based upon 5 experience gained per year in their entire trait discipline. For second level it will take 10 experience, level 3 would be 20 experience, and level 4 would be 30 experience. These experience points are earned for the entire discipline and their traits.

Experience Table
Level 1: 5 experience
Level 2: 10 experience
Level 3: 20 experience
Level 4: 30 Experience

The weapons listed are for a duel engine and will provide bonuses once it has been thought out or modified.

New Trait System​

Basic Stats

Provides 50% benefit of the Focus Trait

Martial
	Athletic: +1 Martial
		Manouvering: +1 Martial and +1 Duel Move
		Combat Arts: +1 Martial
					
	Weapon
		Axe
		Mace
		Arming Sword
		Fast-Draw
		Dagger
		Lance
		Main-Gauche
		Polearm
		Rapier + Main-Gauche *Locked till 14th century*
		Saber *Locked to Middle East, Steppes, and Russia*
		Shield
		Short Sword
		Spear
		Staff
		Battleaxe
		2H Mace
		Longsword
	
		Siege Engines: +5% Seige Speed
		Horse Bow *Locked to Turks and Mongels*
		Long Bow *Locked to Welsh and English*
		Bow
		Crossbow
		Fast Draw
	
Military
		Armoury: +5% Defense
		Ambush: +5% Damage from Flanks
		Military Tactics: +5% Damage from Flanks and Center Attacks
		Leadership: +5% Maximum Troop Level
		Misguided Warrior>Tough Soldier>Skilled Tactician>Brilliant Strategist
	

Diplomacy
	Business: 2.5% tax bonus
		Diplomacy: 1 Diplomacy and +5% cultural shift (+15% for Persian/Chinese) if a tutor also
		Law: +1 Stewardship
		Politics: +2 Diplomacy
		Propaganda: 2.5% levy size
		Naive Appeaser>Underhanded Rogue>Charismatic Negotiator>Grey Eminence
		
	Scholarly
		Public Speaking: +1 Demense

Stewardship
	
	Business: 2.5% tax bonus
		Accounting:	2.5% tax bonus
		Administration: 2.5% tax bonus and 2.5% levy size
		Economics: 2.5% tax bonus
		Finance: +1 Stewardship
		Indulgent Wastrel>Thrifty Clerk>Fortune Builder>Midas Touched
	
	Knowledge: 2.5% Tech Spread
		Connoisseur: 2.5% Tech Points
		Savoir-Faire: 2.5% tech points and tech spread

Intrigue
	Criminal/Street: -2.5% to other's taxes
		Disguise: Event Specific bonus
		Fast Talk: Event Specific bonus
		Forced Entry: Event Specific bonus
		Observation: Event Specific bonus
		Smuggling: -5% siege speed and Event Specific bonus
		Streetwise: Event Specific bonus
		
	Spycraft
		Assassinations: Increases success rate by +2.5%
		Counterfeiting: -2.5% to other's taxes
		Forgery: Time decrease and success rate increase to forging claims by +2.5%
		Poisons: Decreases target's health by .5
		Stealth: Event Specific bonus
		Throwing: Event Specific bonus
		Amateurish Plotter>Flamboyant Schemer>Intricate Webweaver>Elusive Shadow
		
Learning
	Animal Traits
		Animal Handling *random animal chance as pet* +.5 Health
		Falconry +1 Diplomacy
		Warhorse: +1 Martial
		
	Arts: 2.5% tech spread
		Artist: 2.5% tech points
		Dancing: 2.5% tech points
		Fire Eating: 2.5% tech points
		Musician: 2.5% tech points
		Poetry: 2.5% tech points
		Singing: 2.5% tech points
		Writing: 2.5% tech points
	
	
	Weapons
		Siege Engineering (Provides half benefit without the War version) 2.5%/5% siege speed
	
	Design: 2.5% time decrease on building
		Architecture: 2.5% cost reduction on building
		Engineering: 2.5% time decrease on building
	
	Medical: 2.5% decrease to Assassination success rate
		Herbalism: 2.5% decrease to Assassination success rate
		Physician: +.5 Health and Cures Diseases
	
	Natural Sciences
		Alchemy: 2.5% increase or decrease to Assassination success rate
		Astronomy: 2.5% tech spread
		Geology: 2.5% tech points
		Mathematics: 2.5% tech points
		Metallurgy: 2.5% weapon damage
		Physics: 2.5% siege damage
	
	Scholarly
		Literature: 2.5% tech spread
		Teaching: Enables tutoring of children, level bases earning of the character, and +5% cultural shift (+10% for Persian/Chinese)
	
	Social Sciences
		Anthropology: Event specific bonus
		Archaeology: Event specific bonus
		Geography: 2.5% tech spread
		Philosophy: 2.5% tech points
		Theology: 2.5% county conversion chance
		Detached Priest>Dutiful Cleric>Scholarly Theologian>Mastermind Theologian

Foci

Provides full benefit

Rulership
	
	Business: 5% tax bonus
		Accounting:	5% tax bonus
		Administration: 5% tax bonus and 5% levy size
		Economics: 5% tax bonus
		Finance: +2 Stewardship
		Law: +2 Stewardship
		Politics: +5 Diplomacy
		Propaganda: 5% levy size
	
	Knowledge: 5% Tech Spread
		Connoisseur: 5% Tech Points
		Savoir-Faire: 5% tech points and tech spread
		Naive Appeaser>Underhanded Rogue>Charismatic Negotiator>Grey Eminence
		
	Scholarly
		Public Speaking: +1 Demense
	

Business
	Business: 5% tax bonus
		Accounting:	5% tax bonus
		Administration: 5% tax bonus and 5% levy size
		Economics: 5% tax bonus
		Finance: +2 Stewardship
		Indulgent Wastrel>Thrifty Clerk>Fortune Builder>Midas Touched
		
Hunting
	Animal Traits
		Animal Handling *random animal chance as pet* +1 Health
		Falconry +2 Diplomacy
		Warhorse: +2 Martial

War
	Athletic: +2 Martial
		Manouvering: +2 Martial and +2 Duel Move
		Combat Arts: +4 Martial
				
	Weapon
		Axe
		Mace
		Arming Sword
		Fast-Draw
		Dagger
		Lance
		Polearm
		Rapier + Main-Gauche *Locked till 14th century*
		Saber *Locked to Middle East, Steppes, and Russia*
		Shield
		Short Sword
		Spear
		Staff
		Battleaxe
		2H Mace
		Longsword
	
		Siege Engines: +10% Seige Speed
		Horse Bow *Locked to Turks and Mongels*
		Long Bow *Locked to Welsh and English*
		Bow
		Crossbow
		Fast Draw
	
	Military
		Armoury: +10% Defense
		Ambush: +10% Damage from Flanks
		Military Tactics: +10% Damage from Flanks and Center Attacks
		Leadership: +10% Maximum Troop Level
		Misguided Warrior>Tough Soldier>Skilled Tactician>Brilliant Strategist

Family

Carousing

Seduction

Intrigue
	Criminal/Street: -5% to other's taxes
		Disguise: Event Specific bonus
		Fast Talk: Event Specific bonus
		Forced Entry: Event Specific bonus
		Observation: Event Specific bonus
		Smuggling: -10% siege speed and Event Specific bonus
		Streetwise: Event Specific bonus
		
	Spycraft
		Assassinations: Increases success rate by +5%
		Counterfeiting: -5% to other's taxes
		Forgery: Time decrease and success rate increase to forging claims by +5%
		Poisons: Decreases target's health by 1
		Stealth: Event Specific bonus
		Throwing: Event Specific bonus

Scholarship

	Arts: 5% tech spread
		Artist: 5% tech points
		Dancing: 5% tech points
		Fire Eating: 5% tech points
		Musician: 5% tech points
		Poetry: 5% tech points
		Singing: 5% tech points
		Writing: 5% tech points
	
	Weapons
		Siege Engineering (Provides half benefit without the War version) 5%/10% siege speed
	
	Design: 5% time decrease on building
		Architecture: 5% cost reduction on building
		Engineering: 5% time decrease on building
	
	Medical: 5% decrease to Assassination success rate
		Herbalism: 5% decrease to Assassination success rate
		Physician: +1 Health and Cures Disease
	
	Natural Sciences
		Alchemy: 5% increase or decrease to Assassination success rate
		Astronomy: 5% tech spread
		Geology: 5% tech points
		Mathematics: 5% tech points
		Metallurgy: 5% weapon damage
		Physics: 5% siege damage
	
	Scholarly
		Literature: 5% tech spread
		Teaching: Enables tutoring of children, level bases earning of the character, and +5% cultural shift (+10% for Persian/Chinese)
	
	Social Sciences
		Anthropology: Event specific bonus
		Archaeology: Event specific bonus
		Geography: 5% tech spread
		Philosophy: 5% tech points
		

Theology
	Occult
		Exorcism: Removes possession
		Herb Lore: 5% to Poisons or 5% to Herbalism
		Theology: 5% county conversion chance
		Detached Priest>Dutiful Cleric>Scholarly Theologian>Mastermind Theologian

 

[TomTheKnight]

Is the Schisms and Heresies Mod still combined with this one?

 

[ThePatriot1776]

Is the Schisms and Heresies Mod still combined with this one?

Yup.

 

[TomTheKnight]

Yup.

Like, you mean the one on Steam? Right now? There goes my week.

 

[ThePatriot1776]

Like, you mean the one on Steam? Right now? There goes my week.

Yup, the current version has schisms and heresies.

 

[starwarsfan541]

General question, how to handle alawites, shia heresy, trait or what? I have been leaning toward shia heresy.

 

[EmperorG]

With the trait overhaul, how exactly is it going to work? I didn't understand it fully, but from what I got was that as your kid is tutored they gain xp in a specific branch (diplomacy, martial, intrigue, stewardship, learning) and can get higher level traits if they stick with a tutor for that branch longer versus simply jumping to different branches to try and get several traits?

 

[ThePatriot1776]

With the trait overhaul, how exactly is it going to work? I didn't understand it fully, but from what I got was that as your kid is tutored they gain xp in a specific branch (diplomacy, martial, intrigue, stewardship, learning) and can get higher level traits if they stick with a tutor for that branch longer versus simply jumping to different branches to try and get several traits?

Children are tutored for 6.5 years in one discipline and gain those traits from that discipline. They switch to a new tutor to learn their second discipline or can stay with their current tutor to learn the Scholarly discipline for the next 6.5 years.

Experience only comes into play once a child becomes an adult or for adult characters.

 

[ThePatriot1776]

A small update regarding the new trait system. A change I made was that instead of characters learning the Discipline and all the traits inside that Discipline they just learn the Discipline. This way characters won't be cookie cutter by allowing them the choice to learn what traits they want by spending experience on them. One of the planned features is to have an event that the player can pick what Discipline they want their children to learn, so there isn't any randomness when it comes to education. Now, the random events for the various traits in vanilla that are not education traits will still be there and there is no intention of that changing.

 

[Adolphin]

Is it a common issue for this mod to run really really slow? Because it does for me.
Is there anything I can or even should delete/alter to make the game speed more like it is in vanilla ck2?

 

[starwarsfan541]

Is it a common issue for this mod to run really really slow? Because it does for me.
Is there anything I can or even should delete/alter to make the game speed more like it is in vanilla ck2?

Yes, I have noticed the issue and trying to figure it out, took out events and charecters but that didnt seem to help at all, I am hoping when the optimization patch comes out it helps a lot plus if I can figure out which file is causing it.

Have a gut feeling its the landed titles folder.

 

[ThePatriot1776]

The new traits are coded, so all that is left is the gfx and localisation files to finish this stage. The Disciplines are education traits that can be purchased in Ruler Designer which will unlock the traits within it. There are some minor fixes that need to be done to the weapons, armour, and equipment to lock them to specific regions or cultures.

Speaking of equipment, there will be a decision to visit a shop to purchase the equipment for the character as long as they have the traits for that equipment. The equipment traits only increase the character's effectiveness with them. The listing for the weapons, shields, and armours is pretty impressive. We will also be including quest lines for cultural specific equipment that is legendary or mythical.

The new duel system is comprised of the following elements: weapon speed, weapon power (damage), maneuvering/utility, and defense. Combat will start on a 6x6 grid so the characters can maneuver for a better position, while some weapons will extend the reach of the character. Melee will occur when the characters are right next to each other, unless they have a weapon that allows them to attack further away like polearms. Once combat begins, the weapon speed determines who will strike first. Weapon power is the amount of damage that it does against a target. Maneuvering/utility extends the range or how fast a character can move on the grid. Armour and shields will have a defense rating assigned to them while the skill will determine how effective the character is at blocking incoming attacks.

Once a character strikes another character, the armour/shield skills will determine if the character has brought their equipment to bear. There will be two checks to determine this if a character has both armour and a shield. The first check is against the shield and if the attack is blocked. The second check is against the armour. If the shield blocks the attack the defense rating of it is subtracted from the weapon power. The remaining damage will then be applied to the armour if the check is successful for blocking. In either case, if an attack isn't blocked by a shield and armour the entire weapon power is applied to the character's health. If it is blocked then the damage is absorbed by the shield then the armour with the remaining damage applied to a character's health.

The entire duel system will be dynamic with its events, so it will be a treat to see it in action.

 

[IratePirate-]

Snip.

That sounds mind-shatteringly awesome.

 

[starwarsfan541]

That sounds mind-shatteringly awesome.

We've also been discussing how to make india fun....... (how about 33+ Patron Deities? )

 

[DingoWalley]

I'm going to be on vacation in Maryland for a week, so I won't be able to do much while I'm away, but I'll let everyone know when I'm back.

 

[EmperorG]

We've also been discussing how to make india fun....... (how about 33+ Patron Deities? )

Good gods, how do you keep the 33+ all interesting enough that they all feel different from each other?

 

[ThePatriot1776]

Due to some individuals having trouble reading the new trait system in the OP, I have redone it to make it less confusing. Red colored items are the attributes of the character. Violet colored items are the Discipline traits that children can learn along with the associated building that is required for sending the children there. White items are the traits that are grouped under the Discipline. The Roman Numerals are how many levels there are to each discipline and trait.

[COLOR="#FF0000"]Martial[/COLOR]			
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Athletic I-IV (Building: Militia Barracks)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Manouvering I-IV
[*]		Combat Arts I-IV
[*]		Fast-Draw I-IV
[/LIST]

		
		Weapon
		[LIST]
[*]            Axe I-IV
[*]		Mace I-IV
[*]		Arming Sword I-IV
[*]		Dagger I-IV
[*]		Lance I-IV
[*]		Polearm I-IV
[*]		Rapier + Main-Gauche I-IV
[*]		Saber I-IV
[*]		Short Sword I-IV
[*]		Spear I-IV
[*]		Staff I-IV
[*]		Battleaxe I-IV
[*]		2H Mace I-IV
[*]		Longsword I-IV
[/LIST]

		
		Ranged Weapons
		[LIST]
[*]            Horse Bow I-IV
[*]		Long Bow I-IV
[*]		Bow I-IV
[*]		Crossbow I-IV
[/LIST]

		
		Shields		
		[LIST]
[*]            Knight's Shield I-IV
[*]		Round Shield I-IV
[*]		Buckler I-IV
[*]		Targe I-IV
[*]		Scutum I-IV
[*]		Aspis I-IV
[/LIST]

		
		Armour
		[LIST]
[*]            Cloth Armour I-IV
[*]		Leather Armour I-IV
[*]		Mail Armour I-IV
[*]		Halfplate I-IV
[*]		Fullplate I-IV
[/LIST]

		
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Military I-IV (Building: General's Retinue)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Armoury I-IV
[*]		Ambush I-IV
[*]		Military Tactics I-IV
[*]		Leadership I-IV
[*]		Siege Engines I-IV
[*]		Misguided Warrior I
[*]		Tough Soldier II
[*]		Skilled Tactician III
[*]		Brilliant Strategist IV
[*]	
[/LIST]


[COLOR="#FF0000"]Diplomacy [/COLOR]
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Business I-IV (Building: Emissaries)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Diplomacy I-IV
[*]		Law I-IV
[*]		Politics I-IV
[*]		Propaganda I-IV
[*]		Naive Appeaser I
[*]		Underhanded Rogue II
[*]		Charismatic Negotiator III
[*]		Grey Eminence IV
[/LIST]

		
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Scholarly I-IV (Building: Emissariate)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Public Speaking I-IV
[/LIST]


[COLOR="#FF0000"]Stewardship[/COLOR]
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Business I-IV (Building: City University)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Accounting I-IV
[*]		Administration I-IV
[*]		Economics I-IV
[*]		Finance I-IV
[*]		Indulgent Wastrel I
[*]		Thrifty Clerk II 
[*]		Fortune Builder III
[*]		Midas Touched IV
[/LIST]

	
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Knowledge I-IV (Building: City University)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Connoisseur I-IV
[*]		Savoir-Faire I-IV
[*]
[/LIST]

[COLOR="#FF0000"]Intrigue[/COLOR]
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Criminal/Street I-IV (Building: Criminal Underground)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Disguise I-IV
[*]		Fast Talk I-IV
[*]		Forced Entry I-IV
[*]		Observation I-IV
[*]		Smuggling I-IV
[*]		Streetwise I-IV
[/LIST]

		
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Spycraft I-IV (Building: Spy Network)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Assassinations I-IV
[*]		Counterfeiting I-IV
[*]		Forgery I-IV
[*]		Poisons I-IV
[*]		Stealth I-IV
[*]		Throwing I-IV
[*]		Amateurish Plotter I
[*]		Flamboyant Schemer II
[*]		Intricate Webweaver III
[*]		Elusive Shadow IV
[/LIST]

		
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Learning[/COLOR]
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Animal Handling I-IV (Building: City Herdsman)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Falconry I-IV
[*]		Warhorse I-IV
[/LIST]

		
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Arts I-IV (Building: City University)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Artist I-IV
[*]		Dancing I-IV
[*]		Fire Eating I-IV
[*]		Musician I-IV
[*]		Poetry I-IV
[*]		Singing I-IV
[*]		Writing I-IV
[*]	
[/LIST]

	
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Weapons I-IV (Building: City University)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Siege Engineering I-IV
[/LIST]

	
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Design I-IV (Building: City University)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Architecture I-IV
[*]		Engineering I-IV
[/LIST]

	
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Medical I-IV (Building: City University)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Herbalism I-IV
[*]		Physician I-IV
[/LIST]

	
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Natural Sciences I-IV (Building: City University)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Alchemy I-IV
[*]		Astronomy I-IV
[*]		Geology I-IV
[*]		Mathematics I-IV
[*]		Metallurgy I-IV
[*]		Physics I-IV
[/LIST]

	
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Scholarly I-IV (Building: City University)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Literature I-IV
[*]		Teaching I-IV
[/LIST]

	
	[COLOR="#EE82EE"]Social Sciences I-IV (Building: Temple School)[/COLOR]
		[LIST]
[*]            Anthropology I-IV
[*]		Archaeology I-IV
[*]		Geography I-IV
[*]		Philosophy I-IV
[*]		Theology I-IV
[*]		Detached Priest I
[*]		Dutiful Cleric II
[*]		Scholarly Theologian III
[*]		Mastermind Theologian IV
[/LIST]

For every level in the discipline or trait requires a certain amount of experience to learn. The rate for earning experience is default 5 experience per year of life for the character. Characters will earn bonus experience based upon the actions they do within a year like fighting battles, wars, dueling, diplomacy, etc... at a rate of 1 bonus experience for every action. The table below explains how much experience is required to learn a new trait or upgrade existing disciplines/traits. Spending experience will be done through a decision on what Discipline or Trait to upgrade and will deduct the appropriate amount of experience from the pool.

• Level I: 5 experience
• Level II: 10 experience
• Level III: 20 experience
• Level IV: 30 experience

There will be an event when a child reaches at 5 that will allow the parents to teach their own children if they have the Teaching trait or to send their children away to various buildings to learn a discipline. Another event will fire when the child reaches 10.5 years of age that will offer another choice of where to send the child to learn. The second event will not have the previous discipline option available since the child already learned it. This bypasses the ward system entirely and players will not receive events like the one for Brave etc... as the AI will handle it.

This is the trait overhaul in a nutshell. Players will have a vast array of choices of what to educate the characters they play.

 

[Adolphin]

This whole rpg thing sounds really neat, but why would I want that, when I only want a mod extending the religious aspects of the game? Make that a submod or something because I think it doesn't really add anything to the general idea of the mod while only clogging up the cpu even further.
Speaking of which, have you looked into what I've described in my first post in this thread?

 

[ThePatriot1776]

This whole rpg thing sounds really neat, but why would I want that, when I only want a mod extending the religious aspects of the game? Make that a submod or something because I think it doesn't really add anything to the general idea of the mod while only clogging up the cpu even further.
Speaking of which, have you looked into what I've described in my first post in this thread?

It's a modular system, so you can use it or not.

There is a thread for bug reports, but I guess in your haste you decided not to use the index thread that's stickied to find it. You were told by starwarsfan that he was looking into it and he is. Not all of the developers are working on bug reports, so there was no need to get rude with me.

What are the specs of your system?

 

[Guidrion]

General question, how to handle alawites, shia heresy, trait or what? I have been leaning toward shia heresy.

Why not going down the road of a secret sect gameplay with two main moments?
First, there could be the sect build-up. You could decide to join the sect in secret (or, with a sufficiently high-learning, actually be the in-game equivalent of Ibn Nusayr), effectively staying sunni or shia. You could attempt to bring in other characters within your sect. If they do, they become your friends and contribute to the power of the sect. If they don't, they may blackmail you or expose you. Not unlike the chaos cultist gameplay in the warhammer mod. When exposed, you can leave the sect or attempt an uprising, turning IG into a shia heresy.
With this, you can either go down a mystical road (playing flavour events and sect-related events) or an uprising road where you try to assemble armed cultist (turning into shia-heresy but with the bonus of gaining event troops).

I don't know the first thing about coding so this is only a conceptual suggestion.