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3dahs

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By the way, you should stream tonight. ;)

I will be streaming at 6pm pst. 1 hour! I almost lost another story mission last night. Props to whoever is doing the Ai changes. Remember my Glass cannon 45 LRM GLAD? A light mech actually flanked it and blew its left torso out in one hit. I lost all my LRM ammo and the mech became useless except for sensor locking behind a wall. This was on the 2nd turn. I only got to fire once with it.
 

don Zappo

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I FIXED IT. I won't bore you with the details, I'll just say that JK's Core Fix is the gift that keeps on giving. ;)
 

don Zappo

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I will be streaming at 6pm pst. 1 hour! I almost lost another story mission last night. Props to whoever is doing the Ai changes. Remember my Glass cannon 45 LRM GLAD? A light mech actually flanked it and blew its left torso out in one hit. I lost all my LRM ammo and the mech became useless except for sensor locking behind a wall. This was on the 2nd turn. I only got to fire once with it.
Haha. Sweet! I was watching some Heroes of the Storm, then the stream ended. Now I'm watching your stream from last night as I code.
 

Forefall

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I think having your main character not eject is kind of like giving him automatic guts 10 benefit. I'll elect to turn mine off.

And yes, I'd propose going back to a vanilla 10% evasion per pip. You can adjust the distances as you like, but I agree with you that them kicking in earlier is a more enjoyable game experience.
 

don Zappo

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@3dahs just went live on Twitch with this Mod Pack! If you want to check him out and talk about BATTLETECH and the balance for this mod, please come join us!

https://www.twitch.tv/3dahs
 

Ganimal

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Wow lots of new development here lol.

Regarding mechanics right now and future ideas discussed:

1). Don’t like shooting after sensor lock / sprint. Takes too much away from hbs’s tactical mechanic. Feels good right now as is

2). If making lights harder to hit, then either allow only ace pilot to keep perm evasion, or keep current system and make sensor lock remove 3 pips. Current iMplementation feels good though

3). Like this mod’s balance of dmg/heat for ppc and large lasers. Although i usually take ppc over LL, maybe its nostalgia. Feels good over all, but maybe slightly more buff to LL may Make me want to take it over ppcs

4). Would prefer 5/10/20/45 for ac20 —> ac2 ammo count, just consistency w/ cbt, but also, 10 rounds ac10 is maaaaaaybe enough for longer fights, would def give the player more choices, vs 8, aka gotta take 2t no matter what. AC damage feels good over all. would like buff to ac2 heat, makes me wanna go quad ac2 jager more.

5). Lrms —> feels a lot better vs vanilla, i transitioned from mostly lrms to mix weapons. Feels good. If anything drop stability slightly. However, 50% of game before i up pilot skill, lrms = not as as useful due much lower chance to hit, esp indirect.

6). CBT heat, increase 1st 2 stages of shutdown / ammo explosion more. I love the new mechanic, but I routinely abuse it so i can crank out an extra alpha and never have shut down yet from 1st 2 stages. Saw AI shut down on unlucky roll on 2nd stage once. Upping % chance of shutdown/ammo expl will make me abuse this significantly less, but keep the tension high in case i need it.

7). Ok w/ SLas heat nerf to 5, i agree, my SLas boats are just insane. MLas slight nerf maybe good, will make me use other weapons more vs somewhat boating ML’s (a lot less of an issue now ppc/LL are better in this mod)

8). Srm feels significantly weaker, maybe buff clustering a tad bit? Srm boats still useful, but damn do they miss a lot. If clustering buff to srms then slight nerf to their stab would be helpful to make them not op

9). Def make pulse lasers ultra rare, but maybe nerf acc slightly and keep ignore 2 evasion? If they are ultra rare, you’ll have to get super lucky to start boating mplas or lplas, even w/ end of campaign bonuses. This makes them more appealing for extra weight / heat

Disclaimer: i did 0 math on this, just how the game felt to me (mech2 to mwo player, and read most of the books, did not play tabletop). Also this feeling is from mid game, medium lance, 5-7 in most pilot stats. So not accurate perhaps, but my opinion w/ current build
 
Last edited:

Max_Killjoy

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I'm really looking forward to seeing how Master Tactician allowing fire and sensor lock in the same turn is implemented, will actually make sensor lock something I use again.
 

Ganimal

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- Permanent Evasion now is based upon MaxMechMovement instead of weight class. This allows much more nuanced variation for mechs and makes the Cicada and Spider actually resemble viable mechs. New values are as follows:

Hey donZappo, quick Q, those perm evasion is based on walk distance right? or do I gain additional perm evasion if I sprint (thus farther move distance) instead w/ same mech?
 

don Zappo

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It is irrelevant of walking/jumping/sprinting. You get more temporary evasion based upon movement, but the permanent evasion is always the same.
 

me987654

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The pips gain more value as they go up? 5, 10, 10, 15, 15, 15. That's counterintuitive. Pips for evasion offers stacking bonuses. Going from 70 aim to 60 is about a 15% decrease, but the same 10 drop when you have only 20 aim cuts the damage in half. I'd at least revert to the vanilla 10 per pip, as those final pips are very strong when you already have the remaining 4 or 5 behind you.

that's the entire point - only fast mechs with pilots with top end piloting skills can get those most valuable pips.

It works very well (IMO) in practice... I've played very extensively with these settings and the to hit values generally "feel" right.
 

don Zappo

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v1.1.1v5_Patch

- Modifed CBT Movement added.

- Jump to-hit penalty of +2.

- Jump to-hit penalty removed with Tactics 9.

- Melee Mover added - can now move and melee against adjacent AI.

***To install the patch***

1) If you have version 1.1.1v(ANY) of the mod installed, simply copy the folders in this zip file to your BATTLETECH\Mods folder and overwrite all files when prompted.

2) If you have a previous version of the Mod you must do the full installation of 1.1.1 and update it with this patch!

3) This patch will not invalidate your save game files for campaigns played with 1.1.1v(ANY).
 

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don Zappo

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New discussion point! Is there any way to get value out of the Beta Pods and Gamma Pods? Having 8 Mechwarriors is, for the most part, plenty. Having 16 is more than enough, and 24 is just unnecessary. At least that has been my experience - if you find value in the Gamma Pod, please do share. It seems the only reason you would want it is if you are a collector of Ronin, which isn't a gameplay concern.

Anyways, how do we get value out of these? Discussing things with 3dahs it seems a bit tricky. There seems two ways to encourage having more pilots: really long medical times, or finding a way to make you have to carry a lot of pilots for skill specializations. Neither of these seem fun or worth the effort to implement. This Mod Pack has slowed down medical ever so slightly, but bumping it any more I feel is a big negative play experience. So what to do? Any ideas?

  • Reduce the Pod Capacity to 6 warriors from 8. This makes things really crowded and you'd be forced to drop with injured pilots or to fire pilots more frequently. Then the progression of pilots you can hold goes from 6 to 12 to 18 which seem like a reasonable spread of numbers.
  • Completely remove the pilot capacity of the Gamma Pod and replace it with... something. What this something would be is up for discussion. An increase in the XP cap? Morale bonuses?
I hate things that have no value or purpose in a game, and I believe that this has no value. I'd like to keep it related to pilots to some degree, still. Any good ideas for this?
 

RyuKazuha

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Concerning the LRMs:

I'd personally go with the further nerf to clustering, maybe 2.2.1 .

Imo the deciding factor between LRMs and ACs should be wether I need high, concentrated damage to punch through armor and for assassinations, or high spread for crit hunting/sandpapering. The problem right now is LRMs still provide decent concentration (4.2.1 it is? that would mean I expect over half of my total hits in one location) and they are more reliable on a per shot basis.

Stab damage feels fine to me as it is, both with ACs and LRMs.

MLas deserve the heat nerf HBS gave them, they are an atrocious monstrosity basically only held at bay by hard point limits.
 

RyuKazuha

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Decreasing the number of pilots per Pod would add no value to Gamma imo. 12 would still be plenty if you play halfway competently and I don't know any reason not to build Beta.

Also I would not like to see medical times increase. Single injuries are allready taking out your MWs for about 20 days early on and that's plenty shitty.

I think adding value to Gamma pod may lie more in increasing the value of upgrades wich require gamma pod. Like upping the training facility there to cap at 40k exp instead of 30k, increasing the permanent moral bonus of the low-g-pool (was that in gamma? I think so) and so on. Either that or move some of the current Beta-Tech-Upgrades to Gamma.
 

don Zappo

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Decreasing the number of pilots per Pod would add no value to Gamma imo. 12 would still be plenty if you play halfway competently and I don't know any reason not to build Beta.

Also I would not like to see medical times increase. Single injuries are allready taking out your MWs for about 20 days early on and that's plenty shitty.

I think adding value to Gamma pod may lie more in increasing the value of upgrades wich require gamma pod. Like upping the training facility there to cap at 40k exp instead of 30k, increasing the permanent moral bonus of the low-g-pool (was that in gamma? I think so) and so on. Either that or move some of the current Beta-Tech-Upgrades to Gamma.
Interesting ideas. I don't want it to just be a gate, though. I want it to have some sort of value. Also, regarding the medical times, that is basically the only way to make you want to play with more pilots. If you're out 20 days, then you need to fill the slot for 20 days. The trick is to not make this feel oppressive. In No Guts No Galaxy the starting Med Tech was at 3 which led to some extremely long repair times. I set it to 5 when I created this pack to give it a slight nerf from vanilla 6 to see how this felt. I'm actually leaning more towards 4 now and having pods only hold 6 people. Won't implement this without discussion, though, as it is a pretty significant change.
 

RyuKazuha

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Well, you could associate the expanded living space with better morale, also iirc it allready gives a tech-boost indirectly by allowing a third repairslot? Morale-upgrades are not too big of an incentive, but Gamma will probably always be a luxury-upgrade.
 

Ganimal

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I think we should limit to 5 per pod, heck even 4. Right now we can only field 1 lance at a time, 12 = company + 3 backup pilots, sounds reasonable.

I think gamma pod should increase pilot XP, maybe not enough to go 10/10/10/10, but allow you get 1 more high tier skill line on top of 2 we usually go for, and then increasing training module effectiveness (aka, make last one train your pilots up to 40 or 50k xp as suggested earlier).

I agree w/ keeping medical as is, I mean, you take injury, maybe 2, say broke an arm, "15 days to heal"? please, let me know which doctor to go to see for that! lol you'd be "armless" for quite a while before you can lift anything, let alone pilot again.