Actually will have to stream tomorrow or late tonight.
It's coo, I'll have more time to fudge with BPS
[ModPack] dZ_Consolidated_Company_Commander
- Thread starter don Zappo
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It's coo, I'll have more time to fudge with BPS
I did. In the very early game they seemed good. However, life is changing significantly right now:
The other coder I worked with told me he was working on fixing the Basic Panic System. The code has a bunch of stuff not right in it so the calculations are completely off. So, I dropped everything and we are completely fixing the code. So, we'll have a new version of it.
I got to play with your system Ganimal. It seemed like they were rolling for panic checks more and lights were more prone to get stressed. I liked this, but I noticed that my light mech who had perfect ct and good armor went to stressed because his back armor was blown out. Is that normal? What sorta changes did you make? Overall it felt good, even if we're getting a whole new code for it.
I got to play with your system Ganimal. It seemed like they were rolling for panic checks more and lights were more prone to get stressed. I liked this, but I noticed that my light mech who had perfect ct and good armor went to stressed because his back armor was blown out. Is that normal? What sorta changes did you make? Overall it felt good, even if we're getting a whole new code for it.
Yo yo, lights and early game is one thing i haven’t tested as much, mainly doing 4/5 skull missions, just dropped a few 2 / 3 skull ones. Are you finding your pilots ejecting too soon? Or just entering stressed / pani states earlier?.
Here’s a Summary of changes:
TL-DR version: made it easier to increase in panic state. Made it harder to roll for an ejection, unless ct damage, or next shot can kill you.
Changes to panic state checks:
1). Made lights easier to get to panic. Reason: previously the never have the staying power to even reach stress levels for ejection rolls. By the time they finally passed checks to fatigue, they were dead.
2). Slightly lowered overall max resistance to panic checks. This has lessened “resisted morale check”
3. Allowed panic roll on each attack.
the above changes has allowed more pilots reach stressed and panic states. In my play throughs, the overall “timing” of this works well for the AI 90% of the time. By the time they’ve reached panic state, they are about to be dead anyways. My own pilots have reached stressed and panic states under sustained fire, but none of them has yet to roll for ejections. Example; Behemoth in highlander reached panic state, she got attacked by 3 heavy turrets, then next turn before initiative 1, she got LRM’d by 4 heavies in a row. On her turn, i jumped her out and next turn she went down to fatigue state.
Changes to ejection roll:
1). Removed tactics variable for ejection resistance, lowered gut variable for ejection resistance
2). Lowered some ejection chances due to mech states (e.g. alone, no weapons, side torso internals, leg loss, pilot health).
3). Drasticly increased ejection chance for ct damage, and next shot of the same magnitude can kill me.
These changes made pilots less resistant to ejection roll, but also reduced the chances if them rolling an ejection. UNLESS CT damage, and next time i get shot, i can die. This has allowed what feels like proper timing for ejection s to occur. ~75% of the time, i see an AI rolling for ejection, but either not enough or fails, and then he gets killed by my guys. Other ~25% of the time, they seem to eject “in the nick of time”.
Overall, in my playthroughs (~10+ drops, 2 - 5 star missions of diff types), i noticed by the time enemies roll for ejection, they’re usually almost dead, and usually lost half their mech and or a leg. I’ve had 2 instances (medium and heavy) ejected before loosing any body parts. But they were both cored to hell, aka no armor on torso, less than ~50 on ct structure.
Let me know how the whole thing feels!
PS, i think i did well if you’re worried about your pilots ejecting, esp. if you’re taking massive ct damage or may die ti another hit. ;-). It was my master plan all along, this way “ganimal” will stay alive in your campaign
EDIT: your light w/ back armor blow out: maybe cuz it took ct structure damage. Also, i saw a setting that i did not touch, something to w/ ct armor in the json. Not sure what that ine does, i just left it alone
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Files' description on Nexus shows up as "New version compatible with BATTLETECH version 1.1.2". I was away for a few days but got no steam update for a HBS 1.1.2 patch.
Is the 1.1.3v2 full mod compatible with BattleTech 1.1.1?
And sorry but I'm not fond of pilot fatigue. MechWarriors were professional soldiers and I don't think fatigue can affect them so much as to not being able to go on mission once every day. If you compare with what accomplished pilots during WW2 or later wars (fleeing several missions a day or one mission a day for several hours), you may understand what I mean.
Is it possible to disable this mod and/or tweak it to behave like prior Pilot Injury + No Time to Bleed?
You could turn down the base fatigue level such that only the greenest pilots have to rest between missions.
And to some degree it's modular, but you'll have to check with don Zappo to make sure nothing else is dependent on changes made in Pilot Fatigue.
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This is quite easy, actually. Go into Pilot Fatigue and open up the mod.json file. Set enabled from true to false. Then go into No Time To Bleed and Injuries Hurt and change the same value in their mod.jsins from false to true.
Hey, @Ganimal , here is a spreadsheet with all of the knobs you can play with based upon what BPS does now.
When’s that coming out? Or were ya giving me early access so i can tweak it?
@don Zappo, hey so I been playing w/ pilot fatigue for a bit now. I would have to say, I like the idea, but it doesn’t feel good in game. I do agree w/ @FrUnit7’s comment, feels wierd that my guys gets tired after 1 drop.
Also, it ended up just making me just wait a few days until they recover if i wanted to use specific pilots. I’m torn, really like the idea, but doesn't feel right to me. I may go back to injuries hurt / no time to bleed.
Suggestion: is there easy way to track consecutive days dropped? If not, maybe after each drop, add a value to “fatigue”, when it reaches certain levels, make the pilot fatigued?
Also, it ended up just making me just wait a few days until they recover if i wanted to use specific pilots. I’m torn, really like the idea, but doesn't feel right to me. I may go back to injuries hurt / no time to bleed.
Suggestion: is there easy way to track consecutive days dropped? If not, maybe after each drop, add a value to “fatigue”, when it reaches certain levels, make the pilot fatigued?
Well, here's the conceptual difference of opinions. It encourages you to use more pilots if you want to do consecutive drops, but the penalties are short enough that you could play it exactly like you are right now. It tries to encourage having more pilots without making it too bad if you want to just play with your base 4. Also, the penalties are not too severe at the beginning if you continue to drop with them. One point of skill lost per three days. So They will typically see 1-2 points of skill loss. This does add up if you continue to drop with them over and over, but that seems fair. Plus, unless you go really crazy with your fatigued pilots the fatigue will reset every time you travel.
I've tried to make it interesting without feeling oppressive. I really love the change and think it works great. If you have suggestion on how to refine it, I'd love to hear them. I am really opposed to allowing 2-3 drops in a row for free, though, as this directly defeats the whole system.
For example, an easy change would be that I could make the skill degradation round down instead of up. So, if you have three days or less they are "fatigued" and suffer no penalty to their skills. Then you could drop with them exactly as normal. After that mission they would have a chance to become "Lightly Wounded" and that would prevent their subsequent drops. If they don't become wounded they start to gain more fatigue and then start to suffer skill loss.
That's the part I like with your design. I like the fact it will force you to use more pilots, and also have to take into account sacrificing immediate drop vs skill penalty. I just feel in implementation, it's making pilots tired after 1 drop, which seems unrealistic. And the way I play, is usually to try to game the system lol, which ends up being I rotate 4 pilots, then let all 8 of them rest a few days.
This maybe a good refining point. Basically after each drop, pilots gain fatigue, you set "x Fatigue" as a threshold where beyond this point, they're getting skill penalties. So if you want to drop with your main squad 10 missions in a row, cool, but by say, 3rd or 4th mission, you start to take progressively larger skill penalties. This makes it a very natural way of making you swap out pilots. The fatigue only resets after you allow them x# of days out of combat.
Two ideas, both which I think may cause you more work
lol.Idea 1:
1). I know under each pilot's stats, you can track # of times deployed. Maybe you can track # of deployments within a certain # of days. If you surpass it, each drop beyond = more and more fatigue.
2). When that triggers, you get an event pop up: "Medtech tells you X pilot has signs of combat fatigue, recommends some time off for R&R"
option 1: "man up and drop", consequence = increasing skill loss on subsequent drops, unless you keep them out of combat for X days (in game, it shows up as the way your fatigue works now)
option 2: "give X pilot some R&R time to recoup", consequence = reset the fatigue threshold (in game, they just show up as out x days, but cannot be used period)
This way, the player is aware, and have to make that choice/
Idea 2:
1). keep your fatigue system now, but implement a "combat day" counter. They only show up fatigued when they deploy X # of times in Y # of days.
2). Have that description in trait tag --> "Fatigue, been in combat too many times within Y period of days, showing signs of combat fatigue, med tech suggestion, rotate them out for some R&R, or they may suffer skill penalties / get injured more often."
This will allow an unfamiliar player to be able to decipher what's happening and also make it more natural. And probably is easier then adding events and such lol.
EDIT: example (with arbitrary #'s here for example purpose) - Billy dropped 20 times within a 60 day period. This is when your fatigue shows up. So, you can avoid this by always rotating out pilots thus reducing total # of drops by Billy in 60 day period, or take the skill penalty and "tell billy to man up (or woman up)".
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Do you want an alpha build of it?
Yea, I'd be glad to test things out. Also, I noticed you deleted the alpha build post, cuz I was gonna quote that one but now it's gone haha. Actually, I already downloaded it while you had that up lol.
EDIT: You'll also have to probably explain that spread sheet to me as in how it works in game
I deleted that post because it hard froze the game when I got into combat.
I deleted that post because it hard froze the game when I got into combat.
Haha. Oh by the way, using my previous iteration (the one I uploaded here). I had the most epic enemy pilot ejection ever, it was awesome!.
I had my Grasshopper (7 MLas + 6 SLas) vs an enemy Enforcer. Enforcer already took heavy fire, but was stressed (CT armor stripped, ~40 structure remaining, LT not stripped, but heavily damaged). I ran up on it's weak LT side, and melee'd. This complete gutted his left side (LT / LA loss), and conferred damage to CT (now ~10 structure remaining). Immediately after melee completion, but before firing my SLas, enemy ejected. Then i dumped 6 SLas into his carcass, coring the mech instantly.
Guess that pilot rolled correctly for an eject, and he lived to tell the tale lol!
Hey FrUnit7, it's still possible to send them on multiple missions though. Each mission you send them on while being fatigue increases their chance for a "light wound". A light wound injures you for much fewer day than a regular wound. The more "accomplished" you are (Guts), the less time you actually stay fatigued.
For the couple of missions I played with it, I really liked it! I agree with removing tactics variable and lowering the ejection resistance. I'll keep playing with it and see if they tend to eject too much or if you got it just right. Funny you mention that it was your master plan to keep Ganimal alive. He was the one that was freaking out because his back armor was stripped off, so I kept him in the back lines to prevent him from ejecting! haha