[MOD] The Prince and the Thane - 1.092 Only

[Jaol]

nope just try it your self play as matilda of italy and right at the start move all your troops to lucca save the play as the count of lucca declare war save then play as matilda again and see

Ok, I tried it and I didn't get anything like what you are seeing. The castle fell in about a year, and I lost about 100 out of 5500 troops. I also tried it once staying as the Count of Lucca, just to see how the AI would deal with it--it assaulted the castle, taking the castle in less than a month and losing a 200-300 men in the assault. I also tried it with Parma and let the Count raise his levies first, to see how it would go against a non-coastal castle with just the garrison--the siege lasted about 6 months and I took minimal loses.

yes and there are things that will make the defenders give up faster as well but thats beyond the scope of this game it only has 2 options siege and assault

Huh? The mod's siege system is precisely designed to make things more complex.

 

[Jaol]

not really im still wondering were your getting your info that says current seiges are historicly acurate as when i searched for the fortresses that could survive long they ended up lasting less than 2 months so were are these 2 year surviving castles/fortresses as i can't find them

Off the top of my head, the siege of Acre, Palermo, Tripoli

 

[jordanjay29]

not really im still wondering were your getting your info that says current seiges are historicly acurate as when i searched for the fortresses that could survive long they ended up lasting less than 2 months so were are these 2 year surviving castles/fortresses as i can't find them

I haven't had sieges that last years, I was speaking about the losses of men on the attacking armies. Perhaps you should be a bit more tactful in the future and ask questions before you assume.

 

[unmerged(462625)]

Off the top of my head, the siege of Acre, Palermo, Tripoli

Siege of Acre 4 April – 18 May 1291 less than a month but the other 2 are correct so it would seem were both correct/wrong as they don't all fall after 2 month but they also don't all survive for years

 

[unmerged(462625)]

Ok, I tried it and I didn't get anything like what you are seeing. The castle fell in about a year, and I lost about 100 out of 5500 troops. I also tried it once staying as the Count of Lucca, just to see how the AI would deal with it--it assaulted the castle, taking the castle in less than a month and losing a 200-300 men in the assault. I also tried it with Parma and let the Count raise his levies first, to see how it would go against a non-coastal castle with just the garrison--the siege lasted about 6 months and I took minimal loses.

ive tested it you played as the count then it only takes a short time to fall you have to be matilda and have control of the siegeing army


edit: it also seems to be affected heavly affected by moral events as last 2 games lost 1k then 2k being the count the seige takes only a few seconds

 

[Jaol]

ive tested it you played as the count then it only takes a short time to fall you have to be matilda and have control of the siegeing army

As I said, I tested it 3 ways: once as Matilda vs. Lucca, once as Lucca vs. Matila, and once as Matilda vs. Parma. In no cases did I get the massive loses you are reporting.

I have had the sort of massive (~50%) loses you reported before, but there's always been a disease in the province when that's happened.

 

[unmerged(208745)]

Thanks everyone for the feedback of sieges, I will adjust things accordingly. Please be nice to one another, I would hate to see a moderator bothered for such a stupid reason.

 

[unmerged(462625)]

As I said, I tested it 3 ways: once as Matilda vs. Lucca, once as Lucca vs. Matila, and once as Matilda vs. Parma. In no cases did I get the massive loses you are reporting.

I have had the sort of massive (~50%) loses you reported before, but there's always been a disease in the province when that's happened.

it would seem that the 50% losses is due to moral event like the one that makes you loos almost half your moral one attempt i lost hardly any men started with 6.4k ended up with 6.4k


edit. just lost half my men again it is a bloody neg moral event

edit2. also assaulting a castle with 100% more doesn't cost that much

Thanks everyone for the feedback of sieges, I will adjust things accordingly. Please be nice to one another, I would hate to see a moderator bothered for such a stupid reason.

its history all i wanted was were he got his sources from argument sare expected expecally when were both wrong

 

[sir Eyeball]

As I said, I tested it 3 ways: once as Matilda vs. Lucca, once as Lucca vs. Matila, and once as Matilda vs. Parma. In no cases did I get the massive loses you are reporting.

I have had the sort of massive (~50%) loses you reported before, but there's always been a disease in the province when that's happened.

Not to stir up a hornets nest but I agree with the heavy losses being a bit overboard I n one example attacked England with 8000 men within 2 months of summer I had 3500 men left just lost through siege there was no attrition or sickness just events and sometimes just loss of men with no explanation I.E no events.
This is just one example of many so I always attack as soon as I can in sieges where this is doable I.E not with 700 against 300 but you get the drift.
Sieges were meant to be so as to not loose men but taking longer to achieve. The length of a siege is just about right but not the attrition where there should be next to none.
I am glad that you have taken this in to account Idlib and it is not game breaking for me it would just be nice if some balance for sieges where restored.

 

[Mr. Capiatlist]

Thanks everyone for the feedback of sieges, I will adjust things accordingly. Please be nice to one another, I would hate to see a moderator bothered for such a stupid reason.

Especially since a moderator is a huge fan of the mod and checks on it frequently.

 

[unmerged(462625)]

question: has anyone noticed this mod suffering from stupid ai problems e.g im the player's heir or wife of the player's heir im a count with only one county and my liege is the ERE i have 0% chance of wining a war for Independence so lets declare Independence

 

[Lamartine]

Apologies if this has been mentioned before.

I was playing as Croatia, I enacted the Sabor (thanks for the flavour event btw) and the event text read

"The Sabor was the legislature of Croatia. The Sabor, in its various forms, has represented the identity and opinions of Croats from the diets of the 9th century nobility to the modern parliament. The oldest Sabor whose records are preserved was held in Zagreb on 19 April 1273 as the Congregatio Regni tocius Sclavonie generalis (General diet of the entire kingdom of Slavonia). Its"

The text reached the end of the event screen before it could finish the rest of the paragraph (which in the localisation is "... decisions had legislative power.")

Is there some way to scroll through event display pane text that I don't know, or is this description too long?

 

[Mr. Capiatlist]

question: has anyone noticed this mod suffering from stupid ai problems e.g im the player's heir or wife of the player's heir im a count with only one county and my liege is the ERE i have 0% chance of wining a war for Independence so lets declare Independence

That is a vanilla thing. Sometimes I feel being the heir gives them -100 IQ points. The AI loves nothing more than to ruin my carefully laid plans.

 

[grody311]

For those who seem to be very passionate about the sieges, you can adjust all values yourself in:

C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\crusader kings ii\mod\The Prince and the Thane\common\defines.lua

You can edit the lua file with notepad. Most of the values you are looking for are under the NMilitary section.

The ones I have tweaked are:

BATTLE_WARSCORE_WORTH
PERCENT_OF_GARRISON_DETACHED
SIEGE_WEALTH_MULTIPLIER
DAYS_UNTIL_HOLDER_GETS_WARSCORE
CONTESTED_TITLE_OCCUPIED_WARSCORE_BONUS
CONTESTED_TITLE_OCCUPIED_WARSCORE_BONUS_INDEP
TOTAL_OCCUPATION_SCALE

That's probably too many to tweak at one time, but I'm not a patient person, so I don't care if I mess my game up with wacky values. Ideally, you want to adjust just one or two at a time, incrementally, and keep a note of what values you tried and the results. Once you are satisfied with the results, perhaps you could post the values you tried and everyone can benefit. Idib is running this solo, but playtesting I'm sure is always welcome. Name calling and fact-free opinions are probably less welcome.

 

[unmerged(462625)]

That is a vanilla thing. Sometimes I feel being the heir gives them -100 IQ points. The AI loves nothing more than to ruin my carefully laid plans.

paradox needs to add a warning (if you marry this woman your heir will probably die or end up in prison for ages or his wife will end up in prison and you will have 0 grandchildren) also when they want you to join there war and you decline it should give prestige instead of taking it away edit (you have gained xx prestige for not being a complete dumbass congratulations)

 

[jordanjay29]

paradox needs to add a warning (if you marry this woman your heir will probably die or end up in prison for ages or his wife will end up in prison and you will have 0 grandchildren) also when they want you to join there war and you decline it should give prestige instead of taking it away edit (you have gained xx prestige for not being a complete dumbass congratulations)

An anti-stupidity reward? A 'cheers, you avoid suicide' reward? I guess the game is just as dumb as giving you tyranny for executing the murderer of a family member, too.

 

[unmerged(462625)]

An anti-stupidity reward? A 'cheers, you avoid suicide' reward? I guess the game is just as dumb as giving you tyranny for executing the murderer of a family member, too.

i think letting them die slowly in prison is way more fun

 

[Jaol]

question: has anyone noticed this mod suffering from stupid ai problems e.g im the player's heir or wife of the player's heir im a count with only one county and my liege is the ERE i have 0% chance of wining a war for Independence so lets declare Independence

Oh yes. I'm playing a game in the ERE right now, and it's a constant stream of rebellions that have absolutely no chance of winning. I'm not sure what could be done to fix this other than removing all the anti-liege CBs and replacing them with plots or something similarly drastic. And I have serious doubts about how well the AI would understand those.

 

[Romanul]

When can we expect a new version, please?

 

[unmerged(208745)]

This mod is so good, I am even playing it although I can't find the reason for by character looking like he is imprisoned. Still trying to find out what's different in the portrait files.

Idib: Since I am assuming a new version wouldn't work with savegames from the old one, is there any chance you could point me towards how to fix this one if you know where the problem is? I realize it's probably a lot to ask, but I figured asking wouldn't hurt and I would really appreciate your help. Likewise, if I should find a fix for this before a new version is released, I'll of course post it just in case

I think I might have found a solution, but I have to test it yet. I'll keep you updated.

question: has anyone noticed this mod suffering from stupid ai problems e.g im the player's heir or wife of the player's heir im a count with only one county and my liege is the ERE i have 0% chance of wining a war for Independence so lets declare Independence

It should really be called the AS sometimes.

Apologies if this has been mentioned before.

I was playing as Croatia, I enacted the Sabor (thanks for the flavour event btw) and the event text read

"The Sabor was the legislature of Croatia. The Sabor, in its various forms, has represented the identity and opinions of Croats from the diets of the 9th century nobility to the modern parliament. The oldest Sabor whose records are preserved was held in Zagreb on 19 April 1273 as the Congregatio Regni tocius Sclavonie generalis (General diet of the entire kingdom of Slavonia). Its"

The text reached the end of the event screen before it could finish the rest of the paragraph (which in the localisation is "... decisions had legislative power.")

Is there some way to scroll through event display pane text that I don't know, or is this description too long?

The description is too long, thanks for reporting it. I'll fix it for next version.

For those who seem to be very passionate about the sieges, you can adjust all values yourself in:

C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\crusader kings ii\mod\The Prince and the Thane\common\defines.lua

You can edit the lua file with notepad. Most of the values you are looking for are under the NMilitary section.

The ones I have tweaked are:

BATTLE_WARSCORE_WORTH
PERCENT_OF_GARRISON_DETACHED
SIEGE_WEALTH_MULTIPLIER
DAYS_UNTIL_HOLDER_GETS_WARSCORE
CONTESTED_TITLE_OCCUPIED_WARSCORE_BONUS
CONTESTED_TITLE_OCCUPIED_WARSCORE_BONUS_INDEP
TOTAL_OCCUPATION_SCALE

That's probably too many to tweak at one time, but I'm not a patient person, so I don't care if I mess my game up with wacky values. Ideally, you want to adjust just one or two at a time, incrementally, and keep a note of what values you tried and the results. Once you are satisfied with the results, perhaps you could post the values you tried and everyone can benefit. Idib is running this solo, but playtesting I'm sure is always welcome. Name calling and fact-free opinions are probably less welcome.

You're on the spot, those are the defines you need to change. You can PM me with your feedback, or just post it here, that's obviously super appreciated.

Oh yes. I'm playing a game in the ERE right now, and it's a constant stream of rebellions that have absolutely no chance of winning. I'm not sure what could be done to fix this other than removing all the anti-liege CBs and replacing them with plots or something similarly drastic. And I have serious doubts about how well the AI would understand those.

I might set a relative power to liege clause to start an independence war, but I'm not so sure how well would that work, and also how the factor itself is scaled.

When can we expect a new version, please?

I'm not sure, I just got done working on the Saxon portraits, which are the hardest ones since there are hardly more than 2-3 sources to find adequate headgear. Now I'll get working on all the other graphical cultures, it shouldn't take as long as some of the work is done already. After that I'll get to some balancing and coding, which isn't as time consuming and shouldn't take me more than a day. It all depends on how much of an hassle the other portraits will reveal themselves to be.