[MOD] SWMH 2.0 Map, de jure and general history mod. For a superior CK2 experience

[sir Eyeball]

niiice is Holstein back on Danish hands? or am I seeing things? And suddenly Sillende is twice the size of Slesvig really nice. And holstein back as a duchy always wondered why it didn't have one. that's a proper surprise I didn't know you were still working on that area.

 

[Aasmul]

niiice is Holstein back on Danish hands? or am I seeing things? And suddenly Sillende is twice the size of Slesvig really nice. And holstein back as a duchy always wondered why it didn't have one. that's a proper surprise I didn't know you were still working on that area.

I always wondered why there were no space for Sillende but looking close enough on the maps revealed why they put Slesvig right in the middle of the vanilla holstein province:wacko:, and everything above it was moved higher acordingly. As for the size of the two the differnce is more like 1 1/2 to 1, Sillende now matches the borders of Barvid and Ellum syssel, and Slesvig Isted syssel.


Holstein is back as a duchy(HRE de jure, and im not proud of it) the division of the whole area of Mecklemburg, Vorpommern, Holstein, Brandenbrug, Brunswick-Lüneburg is now pretty much as it were as of 1250. Before it was the part of the HRE with most entietes from different periods.
Holstein is split into Rendsburg(Reynoldsburgh)that DK starts with in 1066, Dithmarschen, Itzehoe(Eselsfleth), Stormarn and Lauenburg. All now drawn after the HRE divisions of the same period(give and take 50 years)(Mecklemburg is of course still not HRE de jure).

Holstein as a duchy will be restricted to one not being wassal of the saxon duke(it will also bar the duke from forming it)

Slesvig got a northfrisian(Utlande) province instead of angel(sorting the map out meant that there wasn't really space for it, and the Angel of today overlaps quite heavily with medival Slesvig)

If one comparse the new coastline to a map you can actually see where things is for a change

 

[sir Eyeball]

ahh I could not read the name of the new province in DK it sort of replaces Angel though so nothing more than A name change there I suppose? The coastline is really good. Unfortunately the 2 coastal areas by North Jutland links in the top so the usual ship route in Limfjordskanalen at the time (it was not until late 1300 the opening to Northsea was stopped by sand ) is not really simulated but that is not something you can do anything about. I hope DK (and Wales) will someday be able to get the Island county that is too small now.

Edit It is hard to tell from the picture but is Lubeck a duchy in its own now with no dejure on mecklenburg?

Edit 2 is Slesvig still a 3 province duchy with a county to the left of the Slesvig county that is hard to tell from the pictures? if so then DK got one more province right? How many tiers in each of the changed counties?

 

[Aasmul]

ahh I could not read the name of the new province in DK it sort of replaces Angel though so nothing more than A name change there I suppose? The coastline is really good. Unfortunately the 2 coastal areas by North Jutland links in the top so the usual ship route in Limfjordskanalen at the time (it was not until late 1300 the opening to Northsea was stopped by sand ) is not really simulated but that is not something you can do anything about. I hope DK (and Wales) will someday be able to get the Island county that is too small now.

of course its more than a name change !! everything is reworked down to the last holding as to refelct RL. Angel did have very similar holdings to what rendsburg now has ( its where they are located in RL).
I had a big trouble finding castles for Utlandene but I evetnually found two. Lækhuus is the starting castle and capitol, Rungholt the city and Husum the temple.

where should that second opening be?

Samsø?

 

[sir Eyeball]

of course its more than a name change !! everything is reworked down to the last holding as to refelct RL. Angel did have very similar holdings to what rendsburg now has ( its where they are located in RL).
I had a big trouble finding castles for Utlandene but I evetnually found two. Lækhuus is the starting castle and capitol, Rungholt the city and Husum the temple.

where should that second opening be?


Samsø?

I did see all the changes eventually sorry I wrote them in the Edits. The Limfjord was open at both ends untill late 1300 early 1400 when it sanded shut. + the ships at the time was lower in the water so they could not traverse the Limfjord then but in the game time the Limfjord was heavily trafficked with ship traffic. if you look at your new map the opening sort of screams out but the 2 sea zones already lap so going through the Limfjord saves no time as is.
Edit yes Samsø (and Anglesey) of course:laugh:

 

[Aasmul]

I did see all the changes eventually sorry I wrote them in the Edits. The Limfjord was open at both ends untill late 1300 early 1400 when it sanded shut. + the ships at the time was lower in the water so they could not traverse the Limfjord then but in the game time the Limfjord was heavily trafficked with ship traffic. if you look at your new map the opening sort of screams out but the 2 sea zones already lap so going through the Limfjord saves no time as is.
Edit yes Samsø (and Anglesey) of course:laugh:

I was making my mind up as I wrote

what about the current opening how small should the fjord there be? and how big should the opening at wust be?

edit- seems i wasn't the only one making my mind up:laugh:, Lubeck is still its own duchy with the province of Wargien and Luebeck. Schwerin(as a county) moved around a lot so now i painted it from the same period as the other provinces and is part of meclenburg(as it should be if follwing HRE divisions)


Im still adjusting the barrony level but Sillende and Slesvig will be equal(currently 5 each) and Utlandene got 4(rungholt was a big city)

 

[sir Eyeball]

I was making my mind up as I wrote

what about the current opening how small should the fjord there be? and how big should the opening at wust be?

The opening you have is quite good if you leave out the small line connecting the 2 parts of Jutland in the west. Maybe the time to travel between the to sea zones could be smaller for the ruler of the the counties if one rules all 3? or a separate sea zone between the 2 above Jutland? the latter would portray the sailing lanes best as it was only to get to Kaupang and Norway people would sail North of Jutland if you had no business up there you would simply go through the Limfjord. An extra income could be given to the counties surrounding it to simulate taxes and extra trade?

Edit I am sorry if my first post came of all wrong I genuinely like the changes you have made and even more now that I understand all of them.

 

[Aasmul]

The opening you have is quite good if you leave out the small line connecting the 2 parts of Jutland in the west. Maybe the time to travel between the to sea zones could be smaller for the ruler of the the counties if one rules all 3? or a separate sea zone between the 2 above Jutland? the latter would portray the sailing lanes best as it was only to get to Kaupang and Norway people would sail North of Jutland if you had no business up there you would simply go through the Limfjord. An extra income could be given to the counties surrounding it to simulate taxes and extra trade?

its a good idea ewith the sea provinces, I will make a quick testrun and see if the revised limfjord works and add them right after.

Edit I am sorry if my first post came of all wrong I genuinely like the changes you have made and even more now that I understand all of them

don't worry about it, its all the topoelgy modding that has made me grumpy(its moving differnt shades of grey around with one RGB in differnce so one get a bit short sighted when spending hours and hours moving similar looking pixels about)

 

[sir Eyeball]

Cool I have made another difference:laugh: (well counting the one with Skåne as I doo). Most of my info on this subject is the same article as the one with the horse trade from Illustreret historie. www.historienet.dk I am not sure if the article is here but it is a nice font of info for us Danes I have a subscription for the magazine so I do not use the webpage as often.

 

[sir Eyeball]

Actually toll booths should do a bit better in Arsyssel, Harsyssel and Wendel than other counties. or maybe even a one tier building called ship toll booth just for these counties and other with similar features. I know sound toll is doable from 1300 on but the toll on the Limfjord was more like paying for passage more than a tax at points where an obstacle could be managed from both sides it could be a bridge or just a chain .

 

[Aasmul]

hmm tested it and the opening at wust looks fine, but the joining of the two provines where the previous opening was dosn't look good(Agger tange is so small that it causes a glitch in the topoelgy), could we keep both openings ? just for sake of the looks...

 

[sir Eyeball]

As I read the map there are only 2 openings one at the east coast and one on the west coast. Where would you have another opening? it should just be open passage I am not sure if we speak of the same thing?

 

[Aasmul]

As I read the map there are only 2 openings one at the east coast and one on the west coast. Where would you have another opening? it should just be open passage I am not sure if we speak of the same thing?

I thought you wanted Agger tange to close the gap in the west and then open the passage in the northwest(where Wust is located)?

 

[sir Eyeball]

BTW the round Fjord Ringkjøbing fjord is man made in 1880 so it shouldn't be on the map. It was not water at the time of the game

 

[sir Eyeball]

Sorry as I read the map and it is a bit small then the west coast has an opening but with a very small line running between Harsyssel and Wendel. If it is allready open then no need to change anything and the East is already open right?

 

[Aasmul]

Sorry as I read the map and it is a bit small then the west coast has an opening but with a very small line running between Harsyssel and Wendel. If it is allready open then no need to change anything and the East is already open right?

haha:laugh: yes its open the whole way through, but you were right(even if it wasn't what you ere aiming at) the hole in the west actually didn't exsit in the middleages(acording to the wiki) the hole to the northsea was in the northwest(search on wust in googlemaps, thats where the hole was)

its the sea province border(of Limfjorden) that you can see

 

[Aasmul]

BTW the round Fjord Ringkjøbing fjord is man made in 1880 so it shouldn't be on the map. It was not water at the time of the game

acording to this it was sea http://da.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ringk%C3%B8bing_Fjord :unsure:


maybe make it a vig instead of fjord? its complicated to tdo the west coast given how much its changed.

 

[Naoki]

I definitely prefer localisation. Guys suck it up, not everything must be so anglo-centered

 

[Aasmul]

The opening you have is quite good if you leave out the small line connecting the 2 parts of Jutland in the west. Maybe the time to travel between the to sea zones could be smaller for the ruler of the the counties if one rules all 3? or a separate sea zone between the 2 above Jutland? the latter would portray the sailing lanes best as it was only to get to Kaupang and Norway people would sail North of Jutland if you had no business up there you would simply go through the Limfjord. An extra income could be given to the counties surrounding it to simulate taxes and extra trade?

Edit I am sorry if my first post came of all wrong I genuinely like the changes you have made and even more now that I understand all of them.

I added a bit of sea. Vesterhavet, Jammerbugten, Skagerak, Storebælt og Smålandshavet. This ought a make both Øresund and Limfjorden water highways

I definitely prefer localisation. Guys suck it up, not everything must be so anglo-centered

 

[Il Moro]

I definitely prefer localisation. Guys suck it up, not everything must be so anglo-centered

1 Up for localisation

And about localisation, can I suggest to change the title of Sindaco to that of Podestà for italian cities? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Podestà