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apg

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Congrats, apg and grallonsphere!
This is looking very good.

Sorry that I got so caught up with other RL things and couldn't return with pics to help out but I've got to say - loved the events pictures that you have so far :)

thankyou, thanks for your offer of help with the pics, its a good job grallonsphere is good with graphics lol as i am useless.

I assume you already have most of Iran covered in grain and cotton production, right?

currently there are a few cotton fields around syria but no grain, were are going to further refine things , of course, before release, but we also have to keep balance in mind. The provinces which display the resource modifiers are classed as having either a very large quantity of it at there location and/or being historical producers of it. Obvsiouly in the medieval times most provinces grew wheat and vegetables, but we cant give them to every province for the sake of balance and interface clutter.

also no province will start with cotton, the process is: cotton fields -> cotton weavers -> cotton cloth.
 

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Given that, you could have complex trade patterns like Castilian wool -> English woolens -> Flemish finished cloth, with anything breaking down in the chain causing problems for all involved.
 

apg

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Given that, you could have complex trade patterns like Castilian wool -> English woolens -> Flemish finished cloth, with anything breaking down in the chain causing problems for all involved.

yes we have thought about potential trade like that such as the flemish cloth made from english wool, its just finding a system that will work and can be translated to the games engine. grallonsphere and i are going to have a brainstorm on ideas which we could apply to the mod after we have fully tested the resource progressions from initial resources to advanced producs.

Constantinople Silk!!

silk is actually the one issue we havent addressed yet, whether it should be made in a few places i.e. venice and constantinople or brought into the game another way.
 

Joel M Bridge

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yes we have thought about potential trade like that such as the flemish cloth made from english wool, its just finding a system that will work and can be translated to the games engine. grallonsphere and i are going to have a brainstorm on ideas which we could apply to the mod after we have fully tested the resource progressions from initial resources to advanced producs.


silk is actually the one issue we havent addressed yet, whether it should be made in a few places i.e. venice and constantinople or brought into the game another way.

Constantinople historically make silk to stole the secrets from china.
 

toluas

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Constantinople historically make silk to stole the secrets from china.

They indeed stole those secrets from the east - namely Serinda, which might be China, but mostly probably is rather located in the Caucasus region, not too far from the Caspian Sea - but the Byzantines never managed to really produce enough silk to satisfy their consumption. So they still depended on importing silk from the east - that is as long as nobody there decided to block the silk trade lanes.
 

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Your work has a promised feature. :)
 

apg

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They indeed stole those secrets from the east - namely Serinda, which might be China, but mostly probably is rather located in the Caucasus region, not too far from the Caspian Sea - but the Byzantines never managed to really produce enough silk to satisfy their consumption. So they still depended on importing silk from the east - that is as long as nobody there decided to block the silk trade lanes.

yes ive been thinking whether constantinople etc, actually produced enough for it to warrant the application of a province modifier specifically stating they they are producers of it.....
 

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currently there are a few cotton fields around syria but no grain, were are going to further refine things , of course, before release, but we also have to keep balance in mind. The provinces which display the resource modifiers are classed as having either a very large quantity of it at there location and/or being historical producers of it. Obvsiouly in the medieval times most provinces grew wheat and vegetables, but we cant give them to every province for the sake of balance and interface clutter.

also no province will start with cotton, the process is: cotton fields -> cotton weavers -> cotton cloth.
Well, considering a great deal of cotton was grown and probably weaved in Iran ended up being sold in Iraq and other areas for a decent amount of money (Hadith even states that one could only wear so much silk, thus other fabrics were used). There is documents found that shows that there is many cotton merchants outside Iran.

I'm using Richard Bulliett in his History of Iran to the Safavid Period lecture as a source (It's on iTunes and it's fantastic).

Edit: And how rude of me, good luck with the project!
 
Last edited:

RedRooster81

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Well, considering a great deal of cotton was grown and probably weaved in Iran ended up being sold in Iraq and other areas for a decent amount of money (Hadith even states that one could only wear so much silk, thus other fabrics were used). There is documents found that shows that there is many cotton merchants outside Iran.

I'm using Richard Bulliett in his History of Iran to the Safavid Period lecture as a source (It's on iTunes and it's fantastic).

Good point. For that reason the Russian fur trade was important for upper-class Muslims. Fox pelt was especially prized IIRC.
 

apg

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Well, considering a great deal of cotton was grown and probably weaved in Iran ended up being sold in Iraq and other areas for a decent amount of money (Hadith even states that one could only wear so much silk, thus other fabrics were used). There is documents found that shows that there is many cotton merchants outside Iran.

I'm using Richard Bulliett in his History of Iran to the Safavid Period lecture as a source (It's on iTunes and it's fantastic).

Edit: And how rude of me, good luck with the project!

yes we do currently have a few provinces in syria with the potential for cotton cloth, we may add more.....

Good point. For that reason the Russian fur trade was important for upper-class Muslims. Fox pelt was especially prized IIRC.

currently the only provinces with the potential for the 'production' of fur are the provinces with access to gaming grounds, they recieve a general fur modifier, instead of specific ones such as, deer, fox, bear, otter etc.
 

apg

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are there any provinces anyone would like to see? i.e. so they can see which trade goods are available to said province at game start.

and then maybe make suggestions on helping us improve any additional resource placement (inkeeping with game balance).
 

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are there any provinces anyone would like to see? i.e. so they can see which trade goods are available to said province at game start.
First, it's really hard to type after a full bottle of tequila (don't drink if you don't have celtic blood, seriously, I'm Breton, I know what I'm talkin' about).

Second, I don't think it's possible for somenone to see or not see what variable apply or not to any province . So it's basically if there's a flag on this province, everybody can see it.

Third, Trades routes is a really instructive article about how goods were exchanges during CK2 timeline.
 

apg

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First, it's really hard to type after a full bottle of tequila (don't drink if you don't have celtic blood, seriously, I'm Breton, I know what I'm talkin' about).

Second, I don't think it's possible for somenone to see or not see what variable apply or not to any province . So it's basically if there's a flag on this province, everybody can see it.

Third, Trades routes is a really instructive article about how goods were exchanges during CK2 timeline.

no, as can be seen on the first page, spoletto has access to four resources - in our mod we offer a visual image for each resource and good available to provinces.

thanks for the resource.
 

apg

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I thought i would go through an economical progression to give people an example of the sort of advancement which occurs ingame:

Here is the progression of 'marble' to 'marble statues', a relatively 'short' line of advancement but can still take quite along time if you dont have access to the correct technologies and buildings.

1) in 1066 we discover marble is present throughout our lands in modena.

modena recieves marble.jpg

2) as we can see on the province view, marble is now accessible to all within modena. And the temple and castle holdings can now construct quarries to harvest the marble.

marble deposits view.jpg

3) so as we have access to marble, we can construct mines to harvest said marble, but we first must have a 'serfs hamlet' in our barony. Which represents the workforce required for us to remove stone from the ground. The serfs hamlet is one of the renamed buildings from the castle settlement building line, it is not a brand new and seperate building.

marble quarry erected.jpg

4) with our marble quarry constructed, the barony of modena receives a tax boost. The quarrying of marble from the ground has now opened up more buildings option within the nearby barony of Carpi. And as such we recieve an event informing us that artisans must be encouraged to the province. (the localisation is a little loose atm but will be refined before we release the mod).

artisans settle.jpg

5) the above event is what unlocks the additional sculptor related buildings within the city of Carpi. After a long while of improving the infrastructure of the City (through both the mayor and countess of the province) the construction of a Marble Workshop in the city will see the production of statues increase greatly.

build marble workshop.jpg

6) With the construction of a marble workshop, the province has established itself as a producer of marble statues, increasing the wealth the province receives by a large amount. An event fires informing us of this.

producer of statues.jpg

7) The new province modifier of 'marble statues' replaces that of just 'marble' and is for all to see that the province is a producer of fine statues. Obviosuly the marble still remains in the province and further upgrades to the quarry building line can be made, as to further increase the provinces revenue from marble..

statue modifier.jpg


The above is just one example of many resource related improvements related to provinces with the access to the required resources. i.e. marble leads to statues, iron leads to forged iron, cattle leads to leather and can lead to beef meat etc etc.
 

avee

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Are all these resource-related buildings supposed to be built in castles? It would make more sense to have them in cities. :)
 

apg

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Are all these resource-related buildings supposed to be built in castles? It would make more sense to have them in cities. :)

only the mines and quarries and timber yards 'lines' are constructable in temple and castle holdings, the buildings which refine the products are built in cities. Whereas you cannot build the mines & quarries etc in cities.

As can be seen in Carpi, the sculptor studios building line is only available there (and in other city holdings if there were any). The sculptor studions line only appears in the build view when quarries are constructed in other holdings of the province.
 

chatnoir17

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Is the bonus of these goods only tax income? I just imagine marble products could reduce building cost (and maybe construction time too, since they don't need to buy marble from other provinces).