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HandicapdHippo

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Is there a point in keeping dueling skill trait? New vanilla mechanic is already supposed to reflect this with it's own "duel experience" counter.
You mean the four tiered fighting traits? I would say they are still pretty useful, especially as children can learn them. Maybe it could do with a bit more distinction between the dueling experience which is from actual real fights while the fighting traits could represent more skill honed in the training yards.
 

Milten

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You mean the four tiered fighting traits?
Yep
especially as children can learn them.
And that's the problem I see with them, they are pretty simplistic and once you get it on one character it stays with your dynasty forever. It's just free dueling buff.
distinction between the dueling experience which is from actual real fights while the fighting traits could represent more skill honed in the training yards
That's already kinda covered by martial education tho.
 

JasperClay

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Yep

And that's the problem I see with them, they are pretty simplistic and once you get it on one character it stays with your dynasty forever. It's just free dueling buff.

That's already kinda covered by martial education tho.

Learning how to command and army and learning how to fight are pretty different. One doesn’t learn only through experience, but also from being taught.

I think, insofar as there is a problem, it’s pretty limited. Generated Martial courtiers should normally have at least trained fighter; wealthy count+ AI should be able to spend to essentially buy trained fighter for their sons.

I would actually encourage making the fighter traits slightly bigger dueling bonuses, (say, 10, 25, 55, 80) but making skilled somewhat harder to get, and formidable even more difficult. Basically, make that less reliant on the skill of the tutor, so not getting it hurts future generations less, but rarer and more powerful overall. (Also, tie the fighter skill ambition to war focus, and make a longer more event driven road. Simultaneously, don’t have fighter traits decline with age, but make the age penalty both more graduated and harsher.)

The net effect would be to have duel skill start from a more similar baseline for young heirs, but allow the player to advance that skill peacefully, without just fighting battlefield duels. The fighter traits should purely reflect skill in martial arts, and this would allow the player to make sacrifices to advance them, which would have a more limited but still useful effect on future generations.

All that said, simply keeping them as they are reflects the martial arts better than adopting a more vanilla approach. That should not be jettisoned just because the AI is bad at stuff. If it bothers you that much, please steal the “BCT_epigenetics” dueling events from the Winter King, and rework that cludge to be even more AI friendly.
 

Agnstar

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Why do certain game rules in EMF (e.g. "EMF: Gender Equality - Full", "EMF: No Extra CB Cooldown - On") state that they disable achievements...when achievements are per se disabled because of the game modification?
 

Spenadam

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Unsure if EMF is the best place to ask this, but didn't there used to be an event that created the Sultanate of Rum with its appropriate territories if the Byzantines lost to the Seljuk invasion of Armenia/Anatolia (unsure exactly which CB it was). If so why was it removed and can I get it back? I find that the AI Turks lose too much momentum after beating the Byzantines once and never get the opportunity to push them towards the sea as was done historically.
 

JasperClay

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Unsure if EMF is the best place to ask this, but didn't there used to be an event that created the Sultanate of Rum with its appropriate territories if the Byzantines lost to the Seljuk invasion of Armenia/Anatolia (unsure exactly which CB it was). If so why was it removed and can I get it back? I find that the AI Turks lose too much momentum after beating the Byzantines once and never get the opportunity to push them towards the sea as was done historically.

AI Byzantium needs help, but I'd hate to help out Player Byzantium. Might be best to differentiate between them.
 

Spenadam

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AI Byzantium needs help, but I'd hate to help out Player Byzantium. Might be best to differentiate between them.
I agree, but I feel that not having Rum actually makes things easier for player Byzantium whereas AI byzantium isn't smart enough to realize that the Seljuks are actually in decline or otherwise occupied with revolts.

This is why I liked the event that created a consolidated kingdom made out of the territory that the Seljuks carve out from Byzantium and then making it independent. As it is right now, that territory becomes a mishmash of converted greeks and armenian dukes and a handful of turkic counts, but no single state emerges that is strong enough to continue the conquest in lieu of the Seljuk Emperor who is too strong for AI byzantium to deal with anyways. An independent Sultanate of Rum could in theory be on equal footing with a weakened Byzantine state without the event troops and conquest AI that make the Seljuks formidable.

If making things too easy for the player is a concern you could have a version of the event for when the Byzantine Emperor is a player that generates an alliance between Rum and the wider Turkic Empire (as the rulers share a dynasty), or you could alternatively leave the king level Rum as a vassal of the Seljuks which makes it strong enough to continue the war offensively against the Byzantines but still grants it the protection of the wider Turkic Empire for defensive wars.
 

zijistark

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Unsure if EMF is the best place to ask this, but didn't there used to be an event that created the Sultanate of Rum with its appropriate territories if the Byzantines lost to the Seljuk invasion of Armenia/Anatolia (unsure exactly which CB it was). If so why was it removed and can I get it back? I find that the AI Turks lose too much momentum after beating the Byzantines once and never get the opportunity to push them towards the sea as was done historically.
The event chain was removed due to a little thing I like to call code rot. It was not working very well anymore, and the last major patch presented further difficulties for it. At a certain point, you just delete it. It's not that complex to recreate -- it's just a question of how much more of an upgrade we want it to be and our available time & effort re: our priorities for the rest of the mod.
 

Spenadam

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Would you happen to know approximately when it was removed so I can dig up the event in a previous release and take a look?

Edit: Nevermind found it.
 
Last edited:

King Evbof

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I am new to the game. I downloaded HIP and it has the EMF module dated April 15 2019. When I compile with EMF and use a start date of 867, a whole ton of rulers in the north of Europe don't have wives and don't have any children. Obotrites, Pomeranians, Sorbians, and I also think Danes. East Francia ruler has a wife - but the pagans a messed up. If I compile HIP without EMF, everybody has some sort of allotment of wives and maybe even a child or two.
I uploaded a save file under the description "evbof save game problem emf" with a filename of Ljutici867_01_01.ck2 but I have no idea how to link it here.
 

Julexus Quandem

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I'm having issues with the "court anarchy" mechanic starting in the Old Gods bookmark with the Abbasids. Because it gives the "incapable" trait it has then triggered the event that turns my ruler into a lunatic. When my heir took over he also had "court anarchy", though one of the patch notes suggests he it shouldn't be inherited. He then also consequently gained the lunatic trait before I managed to restore order. Additionally both characters had the option to commit suicide, I assume because they were flagged as incapable. I can see an argument that this is working as intended (court taking over sends ruler mad) but if that is the case it could do with a bit more flavour text.

I don't have the Conclave DLC, could that be part of my issue?
 

VineFynn

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Lollards currently are capable of declaring holy wars and crusades- this should probably change since the 10th conclusion of the lollards is that religious wars are blasphemous

It be neat if titled lollard priests were unable to serve as anything other than court chaplain, since thats an explicit proscription of the lollards in the conclusions too

Lollards also probably shouldn't be able to gain the pilgrim trait either, since the bonuses for that trait dont fit lollard attitudes towards pilgrimages

Unrelated to lollards, since being strong prevents one from being brawny, should the health bonus on brawny still be twice as much as that for strong? If anything I wouldve thought a strong constitution would be inherited/inheritable, not the other way around
 

G.Strategos

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Probably just the base game has the generate families game rule on by default and EMF has it off by default.

I can't anything like that, on the rule's screen o_O
 
Last edited:

Ispil

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The Generate Families rule is disabled by EMF, for it breaks succession more often than not and prevents game-start alliances. That, and it's completely unmoddable.

We already have a similar idea in place, History's Forgotten Daughters, that gives several rulers non-inheriting daughters that they can marry off and form alliances with on game-start. This, we feel, is far more coherent and balanced than simply giving them all pre-generated families and sucking all the potential politicking out of the game start.
 

G.Strategos

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The Generate Families rule is disabled by EMF, for it breaks succession more often than not and prevents game-start alliances. That, and it's completely unmoddable.

We already have a similar idea in place, History's Forgotten Daughters, that gives several rulers non-inheriting daughters that they can marry off and form alliances with on game-start. This, we feel, is far more coherent and balanced than simply giving them all pre-generated families and sucking all the potential politicking out of the game start.

Sounds good to me ;)
 

zijistark

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Lollards currently are capable of declaring holy wars and crusades- this should probably change since the 10th conclusion of the lollards is that religious wars are blasphemous

I suppose we could set them up to only allow holy wars / crusades if a holy war or crusade is first used on them, as we do with Cathar.

Lollards also probably shouldn't be able to gain the pilgrim trait either, since the bonuses for that trait dont fit lollard attitudes towards pilgrimages

Don't think I'm going to remove pilgrimages for Lollards.

Unrelated to lollards, since being strong prevents one from being brawny, should the health bonus on brawny still be twice as much as that for strong? If anything I wouldve thought a strong constitution would be inherited/inheritable, not the other way around

Being strong doesn't prevent one from being brawny (trait tag is actually 'robust') in EMF. You can be both at once, actually. One is nature & one is nurture. Do you think purely genetic predisposition to strength would incur more of a health bonus on its own than a character that actively lifts weights (in whatever form) and/or generally trains their body and eats correctly/well (for that to have any impact) on a regular basis?