[MOD] EMF: Extended Mechanics & Flavor

[zijistark]

Omg, you're bringing it back yes. Do we get to see the pilgrimage events return after this too? And maybe not just for Christian religions for that matter.

One thing at a time, but your interest is noted.

 

[Disclaimer]

They are inherited from Project Balance and haven't received any EMF-grade love since then. That said, they are, to most folks, an improvement over vanilla crusades.

• Upon winning the Crusade, the victor is given a choice of whether to keep the land, grant it to an unlanded relative, or grant it to a random character of their culture. The AI almost always chooses the random character (leads to fewer weird inheritance messes between the Crusader territories and the Continent than granting to relatives). This means that Crusades are not simple territory-grabs like in vanilla (though they still can be for the player, which I'd like to hinder altogether whenever I get around to writing EMF Crusades).
• A randomized time-offset timer gates the actual calling of a Crusade after Crusades are unlocked. This has the advantage of preventing simultaneous and immediate three-way Jihad/Crusade in starts after 1097. Downside is that the random nature of the timer makes it even more difficult to use the SoA 'Ask for Crusade' functionality.
• Special handling of cases such as the Pope himself or a holy order winning the Crusade to make sure it's granted to somebody else and that succession laws are properly fixed-up for a feudal realm and such.
• A lot of specialized details regarding creation of crusader states for random AI characters (set the right capital, spawn a small retinue, convert the capital to the victor's religion, etc.)
• Other details such as freeing any holy orders that may have been vassalized by the wrong religion (which would otherwise effectively nullifying them) when usurping the target title (common with Knights Hospitaler and Templar, common vassals of Jerusalem) and automatically refilling all the levies in the target kingdom (to emulate pilgrimage) so that it's not so prone to being immediately reconquered in its early years.
• Unlike vanilla crusades, it doesn't take into account claim strength (e.g., reconquest of Jerusalem or Byzantium or Sicily or one of the Spanish kingdoms) of Crusade participants when determining who will get the land. It only uses the participant with the strictly highest war contribution, as used to be the case for Crusades pre-2.0 and still is the case when there are no participating claimants to the target title.

I have plans for some neat and more polished mechanics & flavor for this in EMF, but it hasn't been a priority. The 'Use Vanilla Crusades' option is there for those that don't like the extra difficulty of using 'Ask for Crusade' or that simply prefer vanilla (it does have the best-crusade-claimant thing going for it, depending upon your perspective upon that).

The crusades take rather long to fire in my game, which is why I decided to help them along. I figured out (with great help on this forum) that this is possible by switching to the pope, declare the crusade, switch back to the original character.

Only thing, this mod's crusade rules make it impossible for me as pope to declare the crusades (the randomized offset timer can't be overruled I guess). I'd prefer to play with the mod's rules, not the vanilla crusades if possible. Any way to do that and still unlock the crusades?

Can I check how long the timer is, i.e. when the crusades would normally called in my game?
Can I shorten or manually set the timer?
Can I switch on the mod crusades rules after having them switched of?
Any other way?

 

[Harald Fairhair]

I didn't say anything about whether they resisted new religions amongst themselves. I said that they never cared about what people elsewhere believed

My thoughts on the matter of whether they should resist more or not and how this translates into game mechanics are broadly similar to what Ziji has expressed on this page and the last page

Is it not possible to have just zealos pagans to try convert provins just in theit own lands. Pagans did some times succede in areas they controlled. Look at the isles around Skottland, they changed both Faith and culture. Btw, is it possible to have a buttom for vassals to demand their liege to change religion?

 

[theKing1988]

Is it not possible to have just zealos pagans to try convert provins just in theit own lands. Pagans did some times succede in areas they controlled. Look at the isles around Skottland, they changed both Faith and culture. Btw, is it possible to have a buttom for vassals to demand their liege to change religion?

Well the change of culture and religion in the Hebrides and on Orkney/Shetland was more due to colonization than it was due to a concerted effort to convert the Islands. The Islands was extremely thinly populated back then (they are still pretty thinly populated today), so when a steady stream of colonists come from across the sea, it didn't take much to shift the cultural and religious balance.

 

[Harald Fairhair]

Well the change of culture and religion in the Hebrides and on Orkney/Shetland was more due to colonization than it was due to a concerted effort to convert the Islands. The Islands was extremely thinly populated back then (they are still pretty thinly populated today), so when a steady stream of colonists come from across the sea, it didn't take much to shift the cultural and religious balance.

correct, but there are other examples, Jarl Håkon The mighty of lade worked With chasing The christans in Norway and He har mostly succes. The Danish kings where also able to keep Christianity suppresed untill The invasion of Otto II. So few pagans did actually cared what People belived

 

[Harald Fairhair]

In Ireland Torgil (first King of Dublin) did work on converting The irish Even tho He had Little succes because of a strong Christian ireland.

 

[mightnight]

Is the new EMF going to contain a decision to convert all holdings to nomad and/or tribe at the beginning of the game by any chance?

 

[zijistark]

Is the new EMF going to contain a decision to convert all holdings to nomad and/or tribe at the beginning of the game by any chance?

If it's possible, then that seems likely. But not until after compatching and stuff and dependent upon it being possible.

 

[Teutonic_Thrash]

Did I read Github correctly; EMF is compatible with the beta patch?

 

[Fall_ark]

Did I read Github correctly; EMF is compatible with the beta patch?

That's highly unlikely considering it hasn't been updated since last month and 2.4.x has a new defines.lua that isn't compatible with older versions.

 

[AnaxXiphos]

Did I read Github correctly; EMF is compatible with the beta patch?

That's highly unlikely considering it hasn't been updated since last month and 2.4.x has a new defines.lua that isn't compatible with older versions.

The EMF beta on github is indeed compatible with the 2.4.2 beta.

 

[zijistark]

The EMF beta on github is indeed compatible with the 2.4.2 beta.

Not the beta, but the 2.4-compatch branch. Further, one would also have to update HIP_Common from the HIP repository to be able to play w/ 2.4. In general, it works, but it's not available.

 

[AnaxXiphos]

Not the beta, but the 2.4-compatch branch. Further, one would also have to update HIP_Common from the HIP repository to be able to play w/ 2.4. In general, it works, but it's not available.

Oops. I'm so used to working in the beta branch it's become a habit to think of it as beta.

 

[Teutonic_Thrash]

Not the beta, but the 2.4-compatch branch. Further, one would also have to update HIP_Common from the HIP repository to be able to play w/ 2.4. In general, it works, but it's not available.

I've got it working, so I'll see if the latest version of CPR (which does workfine with vanilla 2.4.2) is compatible. Also, the Feudalise Tribes decision causes a CTD.

 

[Ese Khan]

I've got it working, so I'll see if the latest version of CPR (which does workfine with vanilla 2.4.2) is compatible. Also, the Feudalise Tribes decision causes a CTD.

To make the stand-alone version of CPR that just came out compatible with EMF, you just need to copy & paste norsegaelic and sicilian cultures to CPR's common/cultures/00_cultures.txt from the one in EMF. Just make sure to give appropriate graphical_culture to the two cultures: norsegaelgfx and siciliangfx, respecitvely.

 

[zijistark]

I've got it working, so I'll see if the latest version of CPR (which does workfine with vanilla 2.4.2) is compatible. Also, the Feudalise Tribes decision causes a CTD.

Good to hear that you managed to get the new pieces working together. No surprise regarding Feudalize Tribes or any of the other major scenario customization options (custom merchant republic stuff, new world order, etc.) having issues right now. That's still on our TODO list. We've been focusing on the core compatch for now. The other code will require a lot of review and changes, as it deals extensively with government types in the old, 2.3 style as well as probably rests on certain assumptions that are no longer true (such as every county having a capital holding).

 

[Teutonic_Thrash]

To make the stand-alone version of CPR that just came out compatible with EMF, you just need to copy & paste norsegaelic and sicilian cultures to CPR's common/cultures/00_cultures.txt from the one in EMF. Just make sure to give appropriate graphical_culture to the two cultures: norsegaelgfx and siciliangfx, respecitvely.

Yeah, I did it the awkward way and put the CPR files into HIP. It works fine now. Now just to figure out how to survive as the Tiele Kirghiz.

 

[Repaxan]

In 2.3.6 version (with SWMH), playing as Francia Orientalis I notice there's a EMF decision to create the HRE (requiring K of Italy and Lotharingia). Sometime later the game also gave me the option to just create the HRE title normally, only requiring some % of counties controlled. Should there be both options? Looking in the files, the decision changes to elective succession and does some de-jure stuff that definitely did not happen when I just made the title normally.

 

[zijistark]

In 2.3.6 version (with SWMH), playing as Francia Orientalis I notice there's a EMF decision to create the HRE (requiring K of Italy and Lotharingia). Sometime later the game also gave me the option to just create the HRE title normally, only requiring some % of counties controlled. Should there be both options? Looking in the files, the decision changes to elective succession and does some de-jure stuff that definitely did not happen when I just made the title normally.

That's an SWMH bug. I fixed it, but their latest release doesn't include the fix. You should never create the HRE title the "normal" way (66.7% of de jure counties or more).

A whole lot of stuff is setup by EMF's creation-via-decision route-- stuff that you definitely want. The de jure setup of the HRE is very significantly altered; you get a free, time-limited kingdom-level de jure claim CB; laws are setup properly; otherwise troublesome (for succession, opinion, and imperial crown authority) de jure kingdom titles are destroyed for free; global game state is changed to deactivate certain pre-formation mechanics; etc.

 

[zijistark]

EMF 4.0 Beta has been released, bundled with NBRT+. Any users of the previous, informal EMF beta will now have to use the new installer which has been posted, as it no longer includes PB as a dependency of EMF, and the files in the EMF repository on GitHub no longer contain overrides to prevent certain files from PB from making it into EMF (combining the GitHub EMF beta files with the old installer will now result in a broken mod).

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/emf-4-0-beta-unofficial-release.872255/