Military Traditions for the Regna Minora of the Near East(?)

Military Traditions for the Regna Minora of the Near East(?)

  • Pre order now!

    Paradox Development Studio brings you the sequel to one of the most popular strategy games ever made! Crusader Kings III is soon upon us and you can pre order it today!


    Releasing September 1st 2020

Samitte

Major
119 Badges
Feb 2, 2012
645
371
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Season pass
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Victoria 2
Hello people, I have been thinking about possible new Military Traditions for a group of polities that fit none of the nearby Traditions. These are the so called regna minora of the Near East, those smaller polities sitting roughly inbetween Hellenes/Romans, Persians/Parthians. While no great powers, they were still quite important during the period and often started, were responsible had a strong influence on the conflicts between the great powers in the region.

Armenia, Atropatene, Pontus, Kappadokia, Kommagene, Pontus, Gordyene, Albania, Iberia, Kolkhis, Sophene, Kataonia, and a bunch more such as the many smaller tribes of the mountains.

Adiabene, Palmyra, Charakene, Osrhoene could likely stay under the Levantine Traditions.

They are all Persianised and Hellenised or in the process of doing so, and yet fit neither description entirely. There is some overlap with Hellenic, Persian, and other Military Idea groups, but I believe there is a strong case to be made to separate these polities/cultures off from the other Traditions right now.

I would love to have people with more knowledge of military history chip in, all ideas are welcomed, especially those sourced in scholarship. Comments and criticism is very welcome. I also welcome everyone to look at this topic regarding splitting some of these areas off from the Persian culture group: Caucasian and Anatolian Culture Groups

Strengths:
Offensive bonuses for cavalry and archers, with some defensive bonuses related to cheaper defense and in mountains and forests. Overall going for quantity over quality, with the exception of Heavy Cavalry.

Based on the propensity of the relatively high aggression by many of these states (Especially Armenia and Pontus, though Iberia and Adiabene also threw some punches), the large amounts of cavalry both light and heavy, and their archers.

Weaknesses:
No Bonuses to Camel Cavalry, War Elephants, Navies (except for hired ones), only a minor bonus for Horse Archers, (and perhaps Heavy Infantry?) Lack staying power to fight nearby major powers.

Based on the general lack of camerly and war elephants in this region, and its inland location which did not suit navies very well. Many of the ports of the region were in Hellenic hands, who are served by their own traditions. Their armies also seemed to lack staying power when pitted against most great powers, but were quite successful for short periods of time.

[Tradition and Path names are suggestions]

"Anatolian&Caucasian" Traditions:
Nisaean Stock:
Heavy&Light Cavalry Cost Reduction
Based on the fabled Nisaean horses bred throughout the region.

Based primarily on Pontus, and to a lesser extent Kapapdokia, Kilikia, Bithynia and other polities.
  1. [Title]: Light Infantry Cost Reduction, based on the masses of light infantry employed by many of these states.
  2. ?
  3. United in Diversity: Happyness for Other Cultures, based on the large variety of peoples living in these regions who fought together
  4. Run Them Down: Cavalry Skirmish tactics, based on some of the tactics sources speak about, speaking about aggresive cavalry tactics rolling up entire flanks of the enemy
  5. Inland Kingdoms: Pirate Cost Reduction, based on the lack of naval forces in the region, and their reliance on hiring navies instead, as well as the Cilician Pirates.
  6. We Will Always See Them Coming: Fort Cost Reduction, based on the large amount of fortifications built in short periods of time by Pontus
  7. A Return to the Past: Gives access to Chariots, some armies in the region started using war chariots again, spurred on by Mithradates, these stayed in use in regional armies until near the end of the game
  8. In the Shadow of Persia: Offense Bonus to Chariots, based on the use of scythed chariots, could combine these with the previous one.

Based primarily on the Iberians, Albanians and Kolkhians, and the mountain tribes of the Caucasus.
  1. Our Home: Light Infantry and Archers Combat Bonus in Mountains and Forests, small, light troops used to the local terrain and able to fight well there, based on the Iberians, Armenians, Pontic Tribes, and Karduchoi.
  2. Tribal Horsemen: Light Cavalry Offense and Morale, based on the large amount of horsemen the Albanians were able to call to war.
  3. ?
  4. Irregular Warfare: Hit-and-Run tactics, based on the irregular warfare by Iberians and the many tribes.
  5. ?
  6. A Thousand Venomous Strings: Attrition for Enemies in Mountains and Forests, based on the seeming fondness of the use of poison by many of the peoples of the region, including the Armenians, Iberians, and Mithradates VI, "The Poison King".
  7. Rich Lands: Supply Bonus, native armies better able to supply themselves.
  8. Open the Mountain Passes: Mercenary Cost Reduction, based on the many times the peoples from the South Caucasus negotiated with the tribesmen from the north and then let them loose on their enemies.

Based primarily on Armenia and Atropatene, with some elements of Gordyene and Kommagene in there.

  1. Noble Horselords: Heavy Cavalry Discipline, based on the heavy cavalry of many of these polities being made up by their many noble families with a strong equestrian tradition.
  2. Wild Lands: Archer Recruitment Cost Reduction, based on the important hunting traditions, many wild beasts, and tribes knwn for their archery.
  3. Noble Holdings: Fort Maintenance Reduction, based on the Armenian forts/castles that were the centres of many noble domains, who took care of their upkeep.
  4. Knights in Shining Armour: Heavy Cavalry Defense, based on the description by ancient authors of the beautiful Armenian armoured cavalry.
  5. Control the Flow of Commerce: Commerce Income Bonus, based on how these polities sat right ontop of some major commerce routes between east and west, including the Silk Route.
  6. ?
  7. Come Forth from the Valleys: Raise Levies ability, based on the levy based armies of these regions.
  8. Parthian Connections: Horse Archer Cost Reduction, based on the lesser importance of Horse Archers, who'd still ride the many available horses.

[PS: I do not claim to be good at game balance and design, so all these bonuses are just ideas I have based on what I've read.]

Sources overlap with in my other post here, as well as A. Mayor's, The Poison King, The Life and Legend of Mithradates, Rome's Deadliest Enemy and the Encyclopedia Iranica.
 
Last edited:

Denkt

Left the forums permamently
42 Badges
May 28, 2010
15.763
6.287
The tradition should instead be removed/reworked as it is in its current form just super deterministic and make no sense for the time period, the Romans basically changed their military traditions a few decades Before the start of the game.
 

Samitte

Major
119 Badges
Feb 2, 2012
645
371
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Season pass
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Victoria 2
While I agree that it is deterministic, until Paradox announces a major overhaul, I'm hoping we can get at least some more different traditions.

Would you rather see a system where you can, for example, have the choice to focus on Horse Archers, Chariots, and Camelry as Rome, a-historical as this might be, as opposed to this current deterministic approach?
 

Denkt

Left the forums permamently
42 Badges
May 28, 2010
15.763
6.287
I rather have them not waste time on mechanics they are probably going to rework as early as autumn. Also there are much more critical areas such as the lack of Peace deal options.
 
Jan 4, 2020
724
513
I rather have them not waste time on mechanics they are probably going to rework as early as autumn. Also there are much more critical areas such as the lack of Peace deal options.
Nobody knows what exactly will be reworked.
There are several things that seem more important than reworking military traditions:
Reworking warscore and peace deal limits. Mercenaries need to be changed a lot. There should be some Coordination between allied and puppet armies. Manpower has to be fixed. Tactical improvements (movement speed, more units, Landscape should have more impact on combat width and formations).