Military HQs and wtf. . .

[unmerged(194717)]

I am really confused in how my troops are organized. I mean, I really have no idea how I should organize my troops? It doesn't hurt that it is all in other languages, but I never know how to assign my troops effectively. Same with aerial forces and naval forces. WTF should I do with them all? should i put everyone under 1 HQ or what? I think I basically have every thing in the game down but organization of units. lol. it is really hard to fight wars when you have no idea how to effectively assign your troops.

 

[Kernest]

Well to get maximum bonuses you should use the entire command chain from corps to theater, but if you don't want/need the bonuses you can just attach everything to theater HQ.
What you need to do is to first figure out how big corps you want/need. If you have lots of leaders you could create even 1 division corps (stupid, but possible) but you need to put as many as you need. The bigger the provinces are in the territory you're attacking, the longer the distance from furthest divisions to corps HQ would be, so less than 5 divs/corps would be preferred.
I think most important HQ is Army Group HQ due to huge supply consumption reductions and you can't get rid of theater HQs so it would be pointless to leave them out.
It's very complicated to create chain of command, but considering what bonuses you're missing if you don't, I think it's worth it.

 

[unmerged(12303)]

yea Paradox went over the top with the HQs..... just wait untill you play russia and are at war and have units being ready to deploy...

There is
1) no way you can easily find the lvl XXX HQ you want to assign unless you renamed them all or have a uber brain and know where all units are.... (not to mention the lvl III Hqs block the whole view unless you keep them 1 province back which really doesnt help much)
2) no way to quickly assign 3-4 units into 1 corp = you have to manually click a lot (a simple create hq for selected units would help a lot)
3) no way to quickly set up a new chain if the current one is full - ie the XXXX has 5 formations under it and so do the lvl XXX (major pain)4
4) no way to see on the map under which General the lvl III is as you can only see DOWN the chain on the map (try finding anything in barbarossa)
5) no way to see which corp is where under the HQ as when you select the Hq and its stack they all lite up and you have to read the province where the unit is, find it on the map and see if its that one you want (and then cant easily multiselect if you want 2 out of the 4) - a LOT of clicking involved whilst bullets fly.

I have no idea how this looked in early beta but it couldnt have been much worse...
great concept - terrible implementation...

 

[Modo]

Apart from combat bonuses, I find the HQ structure very helpful for organizing units so that I know what sits where, and what for.

It's also useful to fill all HQs below the theatre level to capacity. This allows you to:
1) Deploy/attach units using the menus without having to sift through screen-long lists. (Filled HQs are not available.)
2) Maximize your best leaders by giving them as many units to command as possible.
3) Have your standard corps/armies/army groups always at similar strength for easier high-level planning.

Two things from Captain Obvious: Give your operating HQs descriptive names (i.e. an Armored Army, Infantry Army, and so on). This will allow you to quick-select specific forces using the righ hand menu. Setting keyboard shortcuts on the most important HQs also helps a lot.

 

[Tormodius]

yea Paradox went over the top with the HQs..... just wait untill you play russia and are at war and have units being ready to deploy...

There is
1) no way you can easily find the lvl XXX HQ you want to assign unless you renamed them all or have a uber brain and know where all units are.... (not to mention the lvl III Hqs block the whole view unless you keep them 1 province back which really doesnt help much)
2) no way to quickly assign 3-4 units into 1 corp = you have to manually click a lot (a simple create hq for selected units would help a lot)
3) no way to quickly set up a new chain if the current one is full - ie the XXXX has 5 formations under it and so do the lvl XXX (major pain)4
4) no way to see on the map under which General the lvl III is as you can only see DOWN the chain on the map (try finding anything in barbarossa)
5) no way to see which corp is where under the HQ as when you select the Hq and its stack they all lite up and you have to read the province where the unit is, find it on the map and see if its that one you want (and then cant easily multiselect if you want 2 out of the 4) - a LOT of clicking involved whilst bullets fly.

I have no idea how this looked in early beta but it couldnt have been much worse...
great concept - terrible implementation...

Haha, yes i noticed this when i play Soviet just now. Its such a pain organizing it, and then i put 1 unit on the wrong end of the continent and it have to sit on a train through siberia for weeks to reach its HQ. I have all these different theaters, but on the STAVKA there is a humongous hierarcy. And also the officers are in prison or i shot them, so its a mess. Seems like im getting some new ones every year tho.

Also assigning new ones i found it useful to assign any new mobile units like tanks, motorized etc. to the so called "mechaniziyaijaiavaniya" (?) corpses, because there is a lot of default corps with only 1 motorised division in them.

 

[WildStar]

One simple thing I noticed is that they put the leader name on the counter but the deployment screen has unit names so you cannot match them without clicking around. Please fix this!

 

[Rankorian]

Though I think the idea of having the correct language if very cool, I tend to systematically rename my units.

"Transport 1" for....transport navy.

TacBomber 1

Sweden Army Group

1st Sub

etc

 

[jasonxfri13th]

Why couldn't they just let you group your units like in HOI2 as an option... would be soooo much easier and sooooooo much more fun.

I think they should add that in a patch or somehow magically make it 100000 times less complicated.

 

[Modo]

Why couldn't they just let you group your units like in HOI2 as an option...

Have you actually tried? Just select the units you want to group, and hit Ctrl+number. There's your group.

 

[larlin]

Organisating is a pain and takes time, but I must say that this system really help to keep troops in mission orientated and organised. In earlier games you really needed a super brain to remember what all troops where meant to do. At least for Sovjet and Germany. So even with this clunkiness the system is really usefull but all improvemts will of course make it even better and Johan has already stated that not having a oob-editor was one of his bigger misstakes ever.

 

[unmerged(183748)]

Here's how I do it, find it works really well.

Find the highest command for a theater, the with 6 x's.
Name this unit "Army A."

Now find a normal combat unit (infantry, etc) and use it to create create 8 3x HQs, then use one of those HQs to create 4 4x HQs, and one of those HQs to create and 2 5x HQs.

Stack the HQs in different proviences, putting all like HQs together (all 3x ones in one area, 4x ones in another next to it,etc) and go though naming them.
Click on the first 3x one and name it "A 3-1. "
This lets you identify it as:
A = Army A
3 = The level of HQ
1 = is the number of that HQ.
Then select the next HQ and name it A 3-2, do this until you done all the level 3 HQs up to A 3-8.

When you done this, go to the 4x HQs and do the same. The first would be named: A 4-1, do this ti'll A 4-4.
5x's would do A 5-1 and A 5-2.

Now you can easily create a chain of command.
A 3-1 and 3-2 would be attached to A 4-1, A 3-3 and 3-4 would be attached to A 4-2.
Then 4-1 and A 4-2 would be attached to A 5-1 and A 5-1 to Army A.

You would repeat this for the remaining ones:
A 3-5 and 3-6 go to A 4-3, A 3-7 and A 3-8 to go A 4-4.
A 4-3 and A 4-4 go to A 5-2, and then finally A 5-2 goes to Army A.

Simply fill all the HQs with troops and select Army A to command all forces at once.

If you have a second theater, do the same thing. Just name the other theater high command "Army B" and start the lower HQs for it with the letter B so you know they are attached to that high command.

 

[Xendance]

Have you actually tried? Just select the units you want to group, and hit Ctrl+number. There's your group.

WHHHAT?! Why aren't we told about this kind of stuff anywhere in the game? :|

Are you serious that I can group them?

 

[larlin]

Some comments on your naming convention.
You are adding the same info that is already available in the interface. The lvl of a HQ is for example showed in the unit icon. Secondly you will have to rename all your HQ:s if you reorganize your troops. Is the "number" of a sub unit really useful?

I try to form my corps to a standard layout (Panzer corp, 2 panzer div and 3 mot inf; Infantry corp, 5 inf div; and so on) so I name them with running numbers panzer corps I infantry corp IV and so on. The biggest hassle with this is to keep the numbering correct a piece of paper is sadly needed for this.

Then I put my armies together according to mission, so a attack army would perhaps be 2 panzer corps, 2 motorized corps and 1 inf corps. Normally smaller of course.

The thing I like about this layout is that I can reassign the corps quite easy and only need to change names and components of armies and above.

But this is only the way I like it to each to his own taste.

 

[Modo]

Are you serious that I can group them?

Yes. I use it for AI controlled HQs, and manually controlled planes and fleets. I checked, and it works just the same for multiple selected divisions.

About a naming convention and HQ structure being helpful:
I like to have my operating (AI controlled) HQs standardized and named according to strengths. I build most armies using a basic stub structure, and then I successively fill the lower numbers to capacity. So "1. Armee" will be the strongest one, but even unpteenth armee will have at least the standard strength, and I won't have to guess what's in there. These armies are put in army groups and theatres, which can have names based on places/missions, as they are not automated (so mostly static compared to their underlings). Planes and ships are assigned to the AI HQs (for automation), or to the army groups (for manual control). I leave the right hand menu expanded just to the army level, so I always know which unit is where, and how strong each front is. For minors, a similar thing can be done using the corps/army HQ levels.

 

[unmerged(3221)]

If you use the OOB hierarchy:

1) Use geographic names and keep them simple. Renaming any HQ is simply a matter of selecting the HQ, clicking on the name, and typing. Ex = 1st Army / AG Center
2) Get used to the OOB hierarchy. Deploy a division, attach it to a Corps or create a Corps, if needed create an Army otherwise attach it to an Army HQ, ... Besides assigning leaders to divisions, it's just something that you do when you deploy a division.
3) Use select all [green bar] when you select an HQ and all units below that HQ [and the HQ] are selected. You can move them around or assign/reassign leaders from that screen without exiting.
4) Keep the OOB outliner [upper right side] on at all times except when at war where you can easily toggle it on and off. With the outliner you can see the shape of your OOB and easily select HQ at any level when you expand the hierarchy. When you scan the OOB hierarchy, you can see the commander and what province that division is in.

It does take some practice to get used to this system, but after you do it for a while it becomes a second habit just like a lot of other stuff in the game.

 

[unmerged(168056)]

I really wish I could group any arbitrary number of units into other units, including air and navy. It would be absolutely invaluable to be able to have 10 separate flotillas of destroyers in patrol stations and be able to group them into a single squadron in say, the South Pacific.

I would be happy if just the first 5 units or so got the bonus... I just want the organizational help! It sucks I can't put 20 Div into a single National Guard army because I can only fit 5.

 

[Modo]

I don't like only one thing about the HQ structure: The fact that the AI apparently doesn't know how to create/modify it. If you load an advanced game, you'll see a lot of units attached straight to the theatres. This is especially bad for majors, where there are enough leaders to have units benefit from the bonuses.

I really wish I could group any arbitrary number of units into other units, including air and navy. It would be absolutely invaluable to be able to have 10 separate flotillas of destroyers in patrol stations and be able to group them into a single squadron in say, the South Pacific.

Put thos flotillas under an army HQ, and tell the AI to defend the areas you find important.

I would be happy if just the first 5 units or so got the bonus... I just want the organizational help! It sucks I can't put 20 Div into a single National Guard army because I can only fit 5.

Is it so hard to create corps HQs for that army? That's how they usually did that in real life, you know.

 

[MauserM98]

here is an example Germany 36 game: Take all your ground units exept I. Armeekorps in preussia, Berlin Hq in berlin, and Hamburg Hq, and move them to leipzig. Remove them from your Theatres, but keep the Corpses as they are. Now you got 9 corps (i think), and an army group HQ in leipzig. Now click a corps HQ, and push the "create Army" button. Assign 4 more corps to the 1st army. Then you click on one of the corpses that is unassigned and create another army. Assign those corpses left to the 2nd Army. Now you click on the 1st army, and push the "create army group button". Call it something Like Army group North or as you please. (Heeresgruppe Nord). And assign this to Berlin HQ. The 2nd army you attach to the already existing Heeresgruppe A (army group). Heeresgruppe A you attach to Hamburg HQ. (I prefere names Like Heeresgruppe West, or something else that tells me were the units belong.) Now you should have a good platform to build from.
Just fill up those Army groups with Armies, and your Armies with corpses. Now you should assign most of your forces that you are currently training to Heeresgruppe Nord facing northern Poland. Only a few divisions or corpses more are needed to defend against France during the attack on poland. Remember to create another armygroup(Army group South) and deploy som units there, (preferably 2 full Armys) to go for southern Poland.

Short: Have each Corps filled up with atleast 3 divisions, Have each Army filled Up with atleast 3 corps And each Army group should have some Armys attached. And remember to consentrate your Armoured forces, not have one Armoured division here and there like the French did. Make own "Panzerkorps" and "Panzerarmee"`s
wich contains armoured and motorised divisions to use as breakthrough troops.
When it comes to Airforce management i do like this in the beginning:

Take all your fighters to Kassel, and group them in Fliegerkorps of two fighters each. Take all your bombers to Breslau and group them in Luftflottes of 3 or 4 each. I like to give them names so i can easy see what they contain. for example fighters you can call Fliegerkorps and bombers you can call Luftflotte.
Dont ever use more than 4. Air unist together, as you will recieve a very high stacking penalty.

And DONT let the AI Touch your airforce, remove them from any theatre, same goes for your naval forces.

PS: Sorry for bad english.

MauserM98

 

[unmerged(3221)]

I use HQ. When I start a Germany game, day one I create two army groups with 1 army each for each theater. I then assign a skill 5 leader to each Army Group HQ and I then reassign the corps to armies. I put LW in charge of the other HQ. I save about half the supplies costs by doing this.

As the SOV, I gradually move and reassign some Army and Army Group [front] HQ from the east to the west into Stavka. Other theaters are left with 1 Army and 1 Army Group. I never have to build any more Army and AG/front HQ until 1942+, just more Corps HQ for very large corps [large corps in large Armies to save on leaders/officers].

 

[unmerged(12303)]

Have you actually tried? Just select the units you want to group, and hit Ctrl+number. There's your group.

its really not much a question of grouping.

In HOI2 it was easy to see the stack number - you easily could note - "oh an FM - 12 units can attack". Here you grab a couple of units and CANT see their combined width nor can you see the width of units in battle off the map. You have to get into detail with a lot of clicks to and back to see if they will be overstack or not - really not clear and helpfull.

@john - Again if you start in 36 indeed its easier to keep grips on your units (whatever your name system is) but when you start churing out units during full war and find you have no lvl XXX or XXXX free it becomes a HASSLE to deal with this.

Furthermore one really should be forced to spend lots of time in nameing all units - it fine with smaller nations and single player games, but really a pain in the later years when usually you have much more fronts have to rename the stacks otherwise you end up having a Poland FM HQ in Spain with Corps from denmark, yugoslavia etc attached to it........