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Aussiehawker

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The Middle East has been promised as the next update. A set of ideas.


Idea military update

Region-wide

Ghilman - Slave soldiers/Foreign Soldiers.

The Muslim world, particularly the Middle East was known for the recruitment of 'slave' soldiers from particular regions, primarily non-Islamic regions. In-game, this is represented by the Ottomans, who have the Jannisaries and Devshirme System, and somewhat by the Mamluks, who have a special ruler system. But for most Muslim states, it seems like they just recruit their own native population. Which really wasn't the case. It was a widespread system, and the Persian Empires, for example, made use of the Gholams units, which were made up of Georgians, Circassians, and Armenians. There is evidence that they made large use of Georgians, from the start of their rise. If other empires arose, they would likely recruit in a similar way.

I propose that most of the Middle East will get a mechanic, which allows the recruitment of these units, similar to the Janissaries. It's more effective if the empire owns the lands in question, but it's not required. The Mamluks for example established recruitment of Circassians who were pretty far from their main lands.

The nation in question can establish a relationship with one culture group, as a duchy, two as a Kingdom, and unlimited as an Empire/The Ottomans.

This would be governed by a Dhimmi estate privilege. It can be further enhanced by a special modifier, which if those provinces are owned, they can establish their own formal Devshirme system, where manpower is enhanced.

Some nations would have pre-existing relationships. The Mamluks for example would already be drawing from the Circassians. Ardabil who became the Safavids would have the Georgians. The Aq Qoyunlu and Qara Qoyunlu, as well as the Turkish Beyliks, would instead draw from the Turks of central Asia, or not have any relationship.

Like with the Ottomans, reliance on these troops can cause political troubles.


The Aq Qoyunlu and Qara Qoyunlu.

In game, Qara Qoyunlu is the big dog, but historically it was the Aq Qoyunlu who became the big power overrunning them. Even if Aq Qoyunlu is successful, Qara Qoyunlu is so big that it takes multiple wars to carve through them.

I propose that Qara Qoyunlu has the Iraq region as a vassal, split between a few tags in that region, like Bagdad (with Iraq's cores being removed and made formable) as a vassal. Both these powers were tribal confederations, with loose control over what they owned, so reducing them to a smaller core, with a vassal swarm makes more sense. And it gives Aq Qoyunlu a help up, if it can make these vassals disloyal (perhaps a mission like the Burgundy messing with the French mission) and means that Qara Qoyunlu has fewer diplomatic slots for foreign alliances.

Both Aq Qoyunlu and Qara Qoyunlu would have in their missions, an unlockable CB targeting the other, for full annexation. Which if achieved, would transfer the vassals from one to the other. The Aq Qoyunlu, if they win as historically they did, would only be annexing Azerbaijan and the bit of Armenia that Qara Qoyunlu directly owns, while getting the rest as vassals.

Both would then have missions about combating the powers in the region and expanding their rule into Persia (they were Persinate dynasties) and through the Middle East. As well as centralising their tribal confederacy, OR returning to the ways of the hordes.

Timurids

Having all the vassals, of the Timurids, who were princes and major players declare independence, is honestly silly. Instead, I think that upon the death of Shah Rukh that an event fires. Allowing the Timurids tag to choose the heir. Doing so divides the Timurid Empire, with the chosen heir, obtaining the Herat Area AND their cores. While everybody else gets their cores, and also gains cores on Herat.

The Timurids thus no longer exist. But they can then be reformed by the winner of the civil war.

However, making it more difficult is the fact that all of the Timurid nations, have their legitimacy reset down to 20. Events and missions can raise them. But there will also be events, introducing new claimants, and the splintering of the empire effects. While nations outside the Timurids will get encouragement to invade and take pieces for themselves. Like the Uzbeks in the north, The Qoyunlu in the West and the strange Shia Militants gathering strength in northwestern Persia, and in the marshes of southern Mesopotamia. In addition, the more war exhaustion and devastation, the more likely it is that Persian tags will revolt, against the destruction of the feckless Timurids. Which could lead to an alternative formation of Persia.

However, if you make it through all that, the Timurids can now sally forth to carry out their founder's ambitions. Return to the west to put down the sons of Osman for good. Turn into India as the Mughals. Or do what Timur was planning before his death, and attack China.

Safavids and Mushasha

The Safaviyya and Musha'sha' were two developing Shia militant orders, arising within the chaos of the Timurid vacuum. The Safavids went on to found Safavid Persia and subjugated the Mushasha. But at the game start in 1444, it is Mushasha not Ardabil that is the more powerful of two, albeit still relatively puny relative to the neighbourhood.

Firstly, both have a -0.1% Piety in their ideas, both in their first idea. But even then it's sometimes hard to not trend towards Legalism, as the events tend to tilt heavily towards it. I think that these nations, and some others, should have a special -Piety Estate interaction, as the opposite of the normal Clerical ministers. The installation of Sufi Order into the state.

Now for both these states, I think they should have a solid mission tree, and events about their Shia orders, attracting talented, fanatical troops.

We have also seen with the latest Dev Diaries, with Sweden that Paradox has the grandfather and father of Gustav Vasa, who can in his place, carry out the casting off of Denmark so that players don't have to wait for the 1520s. So I think that a mission should enable the enthroning of the head of the Safavid Order in Ardabil, replacing the starting leader.

After 1500, that would be Ismail I
Before that would be Shaykh Haydar, his father.
And before that, would be Shaykj Junayd

They would all be above-average leaders, and as generals would be very good. Ismail because of his importance, could pop up as an event-generated heir for the Safavids, with the Conqueror Personality if you through events, got his grandfather, or father.

If Ardabil is conquered then I think that Ismail should pop up anyway, as a revolting tag, like the Netherlands, but smaller and only the one rising instead of a constant uprising. The Safavid order wasn't tied down to one city, so could seek refuge elsewhere and then come back at the head of the Qizilbash. As historically Ismail did after the death of his father, hiding in Gilan. A mission could also get Gilan to be a vassal, after growing Ardabil by a certain amount.

Ardabil, after enthroning them would get missions, allowing the raising of the Qizilbash, which would help the OPM to expand against its more powerful neighbours.

Shirvan should also start off as Sunni, maybe with Shia provinces. Their rivalry with the Safavids was pretty important and they were known to be Sunni yet in-game, they often end up as allies because they are both Shia.

As for Mushasha, while historically they ended up subject to the Safavids, they had a lot of similarities that meant that they could have ended up taking their Shia Militant order to new heights. I think that they should also have a similar mechanic, and mission tree, and could form either Persia or Arabia if victorious.

Arabia

Forming Arabia sucks. You need to have most of it anyway, due to the requirements all over the place, you need admin tech 10, it has no ideas of its own, and it has no missions of its own. The Arab world is pretty important, and so a united Arab state should be as well. They could easily have a mission tree extending as far as the Umayyad Caliphate's borders.

Ottoman Missions Tree

The Ottomans have a lot of mechanics, but their mission tree is very boring, Perma claims here, Perma claims there. The creep of features has also made it pretty underwhelmingly.

Other people have suggested Ottoman trees, so I wouldn't sketch it out, since that could take a post twice as long as this.


Then to polish off the above, add mission trees for the other minor powers of the region.
 
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Aramenian

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Shirvan should also start off as Sunni, maybe with Shia provinces. Their rivalry with the Safavids was pretty important and they were known to be Sunni yet in-game, they often end up as allies because they are both Shia.
The country should be Sunni and all its provinces should also be Sunni. It was only after the conquest of the Safavids that religion in the Shirvan region should change to Shi'ite.
They should also change the main culture of Shirvan to Tat.
I propose that Qara Qoyunlu has the Iraq region as a vassal, split between a few tags in that region, like Bagdad (with Iraq's cores being removed and made formable) as a vassal. Both these powers were tribal confederations, with loose control over what they owned, so reducing them to a smaller core, with a vassal swarm makes more sense. And it gives Aq Qoyunlu a help up, if it can make these vassals disloyal (perhaps a mission like the Burgundy messing with the French mission) and means that Qara Qoyunlu has fewer diplomatic slots for foreign alliances.
As for Iraq, it should be an independent country ruled by Ispend bin Yusuf.
There should also be an event related to the rise of the Mamluk dynasty in Iraq, the Ottomans almost always occupy Iraq so such an event could weaken them.
 
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YellowPress

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The country should be Sunni and all its provinces should also be Sunni. It was only after the conquest of the Safavids that religion in the Shirvan region should change to Shi'ite.
They should also change the main culture of Shirvan to Tat.

As for Iraq, it should be an independent country ruled by Ispend bin Yusuf.
So have it independent for a year then inherited by QQ?
There should also be an event related to the rise of the Mamluk dynasty in Iraq, the Ottomans almost always occupy Iraq so such an event could weaken them.
So an event like habshi and kalmyk? Its quite late in the game so would it be that noticeable? I also rarely if ever see ottos go for iraq with how slow they are these days
 

Aramenian

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JKiller96

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Good ideas, I made a post here about the greater Middle East that expands upon a bit of a buff to AQ and splitting up QQ. Though I disagree with some of it now, it might be interesting since I put some flags and ruler info in that thread.
 

greywulfos

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I really feel like the formation of the Caliphate should result in bonuses at least as strong as when forming something like the Mongol Empire. It's bizarre to me that, when becoming the Caliphate as the Ottomans, you just straight-up get weakened.
 
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Yhekal

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Please, don't forget about Byzantium and it's deprecated mission tree (same case as Ottomans), and some expansion for Trebizond, Georgia & Armenia.

Byzantium - I overdid it with the perma buffs, I know. Ignore most of them. ;)
However I would love to see some special tier-1 gov type, Exarchates of Africa and Ravenna as a very loyal vassals/marches of Byzantium (similar to Deccan vassal of Mughals). Also, gold in Thessaloniki and coal in Bolu province (from missions). And Cappadocian greek culture in Anatolia. Plus, a brand new mission tree ofc.


Trebizond

Karaman, Candar - mission tree that aims at forming Rum. Prerequisites for forming this tag for them should be changed (without owning Constantinople and without BYZ and TUR not exist).


And since we have a hidden Norse easter egg, why not make a second - Zoroastrian Persia. :cool: From Yazd or Mazandaran..? I am not sure, but I would love it.
 
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