Micromanagement and demo

[Sporally]

I have a few questions about EU3 i hope you can help me with:

1) How is the micromanagement compared with Vic? Yes, i love the micromanagement in Vic, so only if the micromanagement is greater or somehow better made than Vic was i would be interested in this game.

2) If this game should have any chance to become a game i will buy i have to try a demo. Has there been any info on that subject and how is it usally with Paradox games when talking about demo?

3) HoI2: Just instead of starting a new thread, how big is the micromanagement in HoI2 and HoI2D?

Thx for your time...

 

[Registered]

#1 Not a clue, we'll have to wait untill we get more info. (but i doubt it will have the same level of micromanagement that Vicy seems to have)
#2 Same as above. HOI2 was the first game they released a Demo for (and so far the last). I hope they keep doing it.
#3 Not too bad IMO. But the HOI2 forum would be a better place for asking this question neh?

 

[PostPaintBoy]

HoI2 has less micro than Victoria, a lot more than Eu2, and more then CK. Its very enjoyable, because you have the option to micro more, but you don't have too.

 

[SirGrotius]

I would say that the Micromanagement in Victoria will likely be more than required for EUIII, as EUII required relatively very little micromanagement.

I find HOI2 to require a ton of micromanagement, you set orders per unit per hour if you want. Moreover, you've got to check sliders on a daily basis, which is more of a pain than micromanagement. I believe slider issues will be "resolved" with the Doomsday expansion.

I want to point out, however, that I'd recommend purchasing EUIII out of hand and not worrying about micromanagement (whether you want it or not), as the franchise is really that good.

 

[Shuriken]

#2 Same as above. HOI2 was the first game they released a Demo for (and so far the last). I hope they keep doing it.

There was also a Diplomacy demo. No idea where to download it though, I saw it packaged with a magazine.

 

[Registered]

There was also a Diplomacy demo. No idea where to download it though, I saw it packaged with a magazine.

Really? Are you sure it wasn't an ingame movie?
You'd think that if Paradox had a demo it would at least be announced here.

 

[Lord Martin]

Really? Are you sure it wasn't an ingame movie?
You'd think that if Paradox had a demo it would at least be announced here.

It was a demo, or atleast a part of the games tutorial.

 

[noddysseus]

I don't honestly think, as a Victoria player, that EUIII will need to be more complexed when it comes to micromanagement to be a better game than Victoria.

EUII is a very enjoyable game for what it is. Yes it is a bit simple and could have a bit more micromanagement, but this does not take away from the amount of hours I have enjoyed playing the game.

I hope there is more micromanagement options available for the player in EUIII which, in my opinion will make EUIII in the long term, even more enjoyable than EUII.

Also the availability of a demo would be a great way to attract a bigger market and fanbase for the game.

 

[Sporally]

Yes, there is a playable demo of Diplomacy available somewhere - i played it too, too little micromanagement IMO, but just to confirm that part of the discussion.

I'm pretty sure i won't play EU3 ever unless i try a demo. Might be money well spent, but i have quite a handful of other games i can utilize my limited free time on. So unless there is a demo i am not going to buy it. Unfortunately i have a contact that says games developing companies are turning away from demos, simply an economical issue. Took time to make = money to make and didn't chance the sale figures enough - and unfortunately he is often right.

Anyone knows what the responce from Paradox was on the poll they had running some time ago - what kind of game they should develop as their next one? I asked for a merger between either Vic and HoI or Vic and EU, can't really remember which of the two it was though.

 

[crusaderknight]

I don't honestly think, as a Victoria player, that EUIII will need to be more complexed when it comes to micromanagement to be a better game than Victoria.

EUII is a very enjoyable game for what it is. Yes it is a bit simple and could have a bit more micromanagement, but this does not take away from the amount of hours I have enjoyed playing the game.

I hope there is more micromanagement options available for the player in EUIII which, in my opinion will make EUIII in the long term, even more enjoyable than EUII.

Also the availability of a demo would be a great way to attract a bigger market and fanbase for the game.

I think thats a bit TOO much micromanagement. Vicy confused me till my brain melted! I STILL can't figure it out. Anyway, EU is not meant to have a whole lot of micromanagement. if it did, It would be "Victoria (only earleir than that)". I think a little more micromanagement than EU II would be good. Somewhere between EU II and CK.

 

[unmerged(36774)]

Personally I like the micromanagement in Victoria. After playing Vicky for two years, I bought EU2. The simplicity of EU2 made it even harder than Vicky for me. I tried to figure what can I do in the beginning of the GC. And basically I couldn't do much. Only setting some sliders and sending some merchants or colonists. Besides doing that tens and tens of times war was the only possible thing I could do. I tried to figure how to make money and set some sliders (was it 'to treasury' or something), but noticed it will increase inflation.

In Victoria making money is much more easier, you only need to set taxes and tarriffs, build factories and assign pops to those. IIRC in EU2 balif office was the only building I could build in the beginning of the GC. No factories at all. Well I know there really wasn't factories in this timeframe, but I wish there was option to build some workshops or something. I am not sure, but maybe building those was possible after reaching some techs. And the trade in EU2? Some CoTs around the world. I can't even decide what goods I want to sell and what to buy.

After understanding that I can't really control my nation, the game seemed to be simply boring. Maybe I didn't have enough patience to try more. In other Paradox games I am used to play GC always, but maybe I should have tried something else in EU2.

I know many people are saying Victoria is too complicated, and that might be the reason it is not so popular as EU2 is. But if they are trying to get any new fans besides those who are playing EU2, there should be some more micromanagement.

I would like to see the population in the game somehow. Maybe not in form of pops like in Victoria, if that is too complicated. Maybe you could have a toltal number of population in a province (like one single pop in terms of Vicky). From that number you could assign as much workers to farm, mine, army or smithy as you want.

 

[Sporally]

That POP system would surely be better. And that POP system doesn't make the game (if it was the system for Vic) any less micromanageable, it is just another system but still micromanageable.

I know Vic has a lot of micromanagement and in many eyes too much. I know that is why the popularity isn't as great as EU2. However, this is how i like to play the game. It took hell of a time to get to know the game enough to be really playable where i could prevent riots and still raise a treasure. But i don't mind taking an education before playing a game if only the game is that much greater. I know not everyone see it the same way though... unfortunately

 

[Hive]

I suggest reading the Gamespot interview with Johan, in which he explains some basic ideas for EU3.

 

[Rythin]

You will see plenty of features and ideas from our other games, such as personalities from Crusader Kings, leadership from Victoria, and intelligence from Hearts of Iron II.

Orgasmic.

 

[TheLand]

of starting a new thread, how big is the micromanagement in HoI2 and HoI2D?

Thx for your time...

Economics: There is an amount of micromanagement involved in setting up trade deals to get the resources you require. And at present you have to manage the economy sliders quite carefully to make sure you aren't accidentally struck with either loads of wasted resources, or no reinforcement occuring, or dissent from consumer goods. There is also 'optional micromanagement' of convoys, but thank Heavens it's automated now.

Military: You are responsible for allocating every division to a corps, and giving orders to every corps. I don't see how that could be streamlined too much more without complicating the interface with "allocate 15 divisions to the Polish front in defensive positions with air support from three reserve fighter wings". With the presence of 'support attack' and 'support defence' orders, and the option to set Offensive Supply, combat can become a bit of a clickfest. Essentially there is a lot of combat micromanagement but it's presented in a very streamlined manner.

For EUIII I'd want to see less micromanagement of the military (I think the CK combat system might be best to adopt?) but more options for macro and micormanagement of the economy.

 

[Sleepyhead]

I know Vic has a lot of micromanagement and in many eyes too much. I know that is why the popularity isn't as great as EU2. However, this is how i like to play the game. It took hell of a time to get to know the game enough to be really playable where i could prevent riots and still raise a treasure. But i don't mind taking an education before playing a game if only the game is that much greater. I know not everyone see it the same way though... unfortunately

The biggest reason AFAIK was that the learning curve was to steep (like a 90° mountain cliff as someone said )
With a good tutorial, better manual, no piracy and an option to let the AI handle some stuff, Vicky could've been alot more popular.
Micromanagement gives you control, and that's the most important feature when you're the ruler of a country.

Hopefully EUIII will be what Vicky is just close to being, the perfect game*

*From my point of view

 

[unmerged(11600)]

It seems to me that many people here are using the term 'micromanagement' to mean 'not directly part of fighting and conquering'. To my mind what makes EU a great game is that it is *not* simply a military game. It tries to combine economics, diplomacy and military into a cohesive whole. I wouldn't mind if Paradox tries to incorporate domestic politics into that mix as well.

-Pat (who will buy EU3 even without a demo)

 

[Sporally]

Will be looking forward to this game, but only if a demo will be announced. If not, only a friend who buys the game, which i doubt any of my friends will, i won't play the game. So plz, here's another example why you, Paradox, should develop a demo version of the game