Mess in Technology

[AndrejK]

Come on people if we look at the continents we see that some are over- and some underrperesented.

• Europe has 3 Tech groups (Western, Eastern, Anatolian)
• Asia has 3.5 Tech groups (Indian, Chinese, Nomad and half of Muslim)
• Africa has ONLY 1.5 Tech groups (Sub-Saharan and half of Muslim)
• North America has 2 (Mesoamrican and North Am.)
• South America has also 2 (South American and Andean)
• OCEANIA HAS 0.

What I dont like is Ethiopia having Muslim tech.... since when do they field Muslim Archers? Also who should field Abyssinian Light Cavalry if not Ethiopia?

What I suggest is making absolutelly new tech groups:

• Horn of Africa Tech group (Penalty similar to Indian Tech group)- for Ethiopia, Somalia and Swahili also Coptic nations of Nile valley and Socotra.
• Japanese (with a slightly less penalty than Chinese) for Japan possibly Korea
• Oceanian Tech (for Oceanian nations with a peanlty comparable to Mesoamerica slightly less but very few or no penalties in diplo tech-enabling to focus on the navy)
• The remnat of Subsaharan might be renamed as Bantu tech
• Maybe South east Asia gets a new tech group... Indochinese?

Since tech groups should be based on the civilization unity and compactness of the area .. also I would suggest the nomads should get 2 more Infantry and Cavalry unit types as the game moves on...
and any country which was previously in Muslim Tech group would automatically get either Eastern or Indian tech once religion is other than Sunni Shia or Ibadi (for logical reasons)


Post what you think of this..

 

[Basileios Makedon]

I've been playing Ethiopia and they get African units ( including abysinian cavalry ). They got muslim tech just because of the penalty.

 

[Grand Historian]

Oceania doesn't need a tech group because it doesn't have any nations. Japanese would be pointless as well; maybe give a few more units to help distinguish them, but Japan remained technologically on par with China throughout the period and any noticeable changes between the two are simulated well enough with their events giving them mil tech discounts upon meeting Europe. Essentially, it would be like making a Byzantine group out of Eastern.

There should be three new techgroups; East African, Iranian and Indochinese. Possibly a Russian, but that's highly debatable. Muslim should be renamed Arabic, Sub-Saharan is fine.

 

[AndrejK]

I ve been playing Spain conquered half of Maghreb converted it to Catholic released Fes and guess what? They filed Muslim archers , have Muslim tech and their ruler is named Muhammed haha
- I suggested Oceanian because of the https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...eania-and-inland-africa.880970/#post-19910051 thread.
As with iranian it would be nice I agree. Indochina same.
Sub-Saharan could be split into Bantu (West and Central Africa) and Ethiopian/Horn of Afrcan for the Eastern half of Africa

Eastern divided into Russian and Balkanic/Greek/Byzantine

Proposal: How about allowing nations not only to Westernize but also grab the tech of their superior neighbour. Like imagine the natives of Siberia, why shouldnt they be able after contacting the Russians to grab their technology? Or the Tatar hordes like Siberia or kazan?

 

[Grand Historian]

I ve been playing Spain conquered half of Maghreb converted it to Catholic released Fes and guess what? They filed Muslim archers , have Muslim tech and their ruler is named Muhammed haha
- I suggested Oceanian because of the https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...eania-and-inland-africa.880970/#post-19910051 thread.
As with iranian it would be nice I agree. Indochina same.
Sub-Saharan could be split into Bantu (West and Central Africa) and Ethiopian/Horn of Afrcan for the Eastern half of Africa

Eastern divided into Russian and Balkanic/Greek/Byzantine

Proposal: How about allowing nations not only to Westernize but also grab the tech of their superior neighbour. Like imagine the natives of Siberia, why shouldnt they be able after contacting the Russians to grab their technology? Or the Tatar hordes like Siberia or kazan?

Mil or a fixed amount, at least. Most of the Westernizations that occurred in the period were 'Westernization-lites' for lack of a better word, in that most nations just adopted western weapons and tactics (such as the Ottomans, Japan, China, Ethiopia, Kongo, many North American Tribes and Indian States), but never really adopted western customs. And, if (or when) they expelled the westerns, their tech growth would usually crawl to snail's pace (as seen in Japan and China). The only real westernization I can think of that happened in this period was Russia.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

The only real westernization I can think of that happened in this period was Russia.

No. Russia does *not* resemble in-game westernization.

The closest in-game example was the NA tribes, which after so much struggle in previous generations did adopt numerous western customs they'd never touched before and made negotiations with president Washington (which the states promptly ignored). In every possible interpretation of the scope of EU IV westernizations, some of the tribes did exactly that, while what Russia did doesn't resemble it whatsoever (Russia did *not* have stagnant tech progression during the process, at all). The tribes didn't have the population or economic base to make use of their adjustments in time before getting soundly abused/relocated by the USA, but they stand as easily the closest depiction of the game's abstraction of westernization despite the large number of inaccurate references to Russia and Japan.

If the USA didn't shove them off the land and kill so many, they'd have been modern pretty fast, just like you see in the game when the AI doesn't mercilessly slaughter nations that are stagnating sitting ducks during westernization.