Norway? Surely you jest. Have you looked at my manpower lately? Poland can crush me like a grape. And I'm pretty far behind Spain in income.
-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
what about the rule that an alliance cant consists of more than 3 nations?
core rule: yes
on the other side we shouldnt change the rules all the time...cores in the colonies will encourage warfare...not that bad i think, especialy for hungary
morocco: certainly yes
core rule: yes
on the other side we shouldnt change the rules all the time...cores in the colonies will encourage warfare...not that bad i think, especialy for hungary
morocco: certainly yes
Last edited:
Formula51 said:I vote no on the core rule, yes on giving ego back toubkal.
Tell that to the 5 merchants in shanghai, or the italian colonists in Java.
EDIT: 1000 posts for this thread.
Or the British Enclave in India and Tasmania
Ok, my vote count is now :
No cores in America : Yes 4 (KoM, Sid, Ear, Abs) No 2 (Formula, Ego)
Edit Morocco : Yes 4 (Ego, Sid, Formula, Ear) No 1 (Abs) Abstain 1 (KoM)
I would be happy with Abs as GM, with perhaps Dr Bob as his deputy for when he isn't here; both strike me as experienced and even-handed players.
No cores in America : Yes 4 (KoM, Sid, Ear, Abs) No 2 (Formula, Ego)
Edit Morocco : Yes 4 (Ego, Sid, Formula, Ear) No 1 (Abs) Abstain 1 (KoM)
I would be happy with Abs as GM, with perhaps Dr Bob as his deputy for when he isn't here; both strike me as experienced and even-handed players.
King of Men said:
According to me, you are one of the strongest nations. Sure, income and MP plays a big role in seeing who is strongest. Poland does not have much money, and had some loans to pay back, he also had an army which was waaay over his support limit, thus even if he minted, he couldnt make any money. Spain is waaay over the BB limit, thus he risks CWs all the time, and will do so for many years, that will set him back some, with very high stability costs and different provinces braking free.
King of Men said:
Didnt Ear vote for cores in America? Or did I just misenterprate his post?
If you want me as a GM, I could of course take on that duty, although note that I have never tried it before and you would have to be my "försökskaniner", perhaps KoM gets it, couldnt think of any fitting word in english.
"Guinea pigs", I think is the phrase you want.
As for Ear, I understood that he meant 'yes to the rule change', but I could be wrong. Ear, clarify please?
As for Ear, I understood that he meant 'yes to the rule change', but I could be wrong. Ear, clarify please?
yes! no cores in colonies...only in provinces with land conn or on the same continent as the capital!
just wanted to point out that we can see it in another way too
just wanted to point out that we can see it in another way too
Sure, then, next time i ask for help, just say you will not help. Indeed, i didnt say any "thank you". Sorry for that, i was just to pissed at this. But instead of making critics to me, you could look yourself at the mirror: When i shared maps of the whole atlantic, you didnt say thanks either, when i gave your 5 european provs back due to constant AI dows, you didnt say "thank you" either (ok this was part of a deal, but for christ sake, the canaries + tripolitania for piemonte, bourgogne, provence, lyonais, caux and dauphine? I was being more then generous and so was Dominus). About the plotting part, right when i said i was going to dow Norway, you said "I dont want to take part in that war". Next thing i hear, is KoM saying, "which war?" Not to say the 50k constant troops in the border. Quite suspect i would say. But we are already getting too far from the current problem, so lets get back to the topic.
Forgot someone CTDed? How could someone forget someone CTDed right in the middle of a war with 5 AI countries? Thats why i think this game needs a GM to impose order and respect. People in this game "forget" too frequently about people who ctded. Indeed, i had to remind everyone that Sterk had ctded (in this last session), so you guys could rehost for him. Else, Poland would get even more screwed.
If i was not facing a CW, then how was it almost over? How can a thing be almost over, if it has ended already (or didnt even start), like you say? Either i am in a civil war, or i am not, there is no middle term for that.
Wait a second, a player that is at peace, deserves a rehost, a player that is in war or cw, doesnt? Good that i edited my other post, saying that you should be a GM. And yes, you did rehost for more people. We were playing a couple of years since the start, without any problems. Dano (Jerusalem) who was at war with AI byzantium, drops. Sid requests an imediate rehost. Everyone agreed with that (and who didnt, should). We rehost. Right at the start, i CTD, and i was still in the middle of a civil war, and i repeat again, in the middle of a civil war. You guys keep playing till next January, and totaly neglect me (who CTDed right at the start, and it would be a lot easier to rehost then, since everyone had the save). When i re-enter, i make heavy complains about not imediately rehost for me. Then, in March (April) of the same year, Morroco breaks free. This was the straw. I request an imediate edit, because i was, and am, fed up of paying for other people's irresponsability.
Like i said, the deal here isnt if it is just one Stricken Poor province, I would have made the same complains if it was a silly country with a lvl 6 colony as capital. The deal is, this is happening too frequently, and like i said before, i will simply leave if this happens to someone else, be it me, you, KoM, Ear or even Sid. As a last note, i am not blackmailing (like some people said right in my back).
Apart from this last session, i always left the game with about 1500 gold coins in the treasury, the reason i called you for my aid, would be to not waste gold mustering troops, as i am always loosing them in new civil wars. But my dear friend, i would have used that gold to get an army, if i didnt have you as my ally. I would have never have dropped the game because of this. The only game i dropped so far, you know more then anyone else, and you also know why i left it. Joining an already going game as a country with little more then 40 manpower, with only 150 income by 1700, with overseas provinces everywhere, with all DP sliders screwed, with only 30 warships and being dowed in the 4th year i joined the game (by 2 big majors), was just a bit too much, no? You wanted me to be reduced to one prov, and then be annexed? The only reason i joined that game was because i had nothing to do, and i could always waste my time having fun, but can you tell me what is the fun of suffering a major gang bang as such a weak country? Now dont say that i didnt try to work my relationships with my neibours: everyone was busy with their own affairs. What would they win by helping me? Actually, everyone took a bit of my colonial empire. I just looked at that game and my little realm was divided by, uhm, NL, England, France, Austria, Spain. Wow, you think i could do something? Sorry for not being so Pro as you Absolut. My humblest sorries for that. I am not the kind of military genious that can beat everyone with such a shity country, if i may say. For that, speak to Bob
BurningEGO said:
As you have said yourself, taking provinces from a human played country should not happen, and you did exactly that. You took souther France from Burgundy when they were AI. You should have just fended them off and WPd them, maybe take some money as compensation. I dont need to say thank you for that. If I had been GM, I would have given all those provinces back to Burgundy. So, why did you break the "rule" that you support?
About the plotting part, lets leave that to ICQ or PMs, as I dont want to discuss that here. As I said before, you dont have to trust me, I have explained this to you, and it is up to you to draw your own conclusions.
I had my own troubles, such as vassals breaking off and so on, why would I keep track of you at the same time? If I was minding my own business, and noone else reminds me of that you CTD, how would I remember?
If i was not facing a CW, then how was it almost over? How can a thing be almost over, if it has ended already (or didnt even start), like you say? Either i am in a civil war, or i am not, there is no middle term for that.
I guess thats good that you edited it, because I would only do things that would harm your country, such as not rehosting when you CTDed.
We rehosted for Dano because he had already dropped and his ghosted country was attacked, that is slightly different from your case. We were planning on finishing the session, it was only 5 months left with Jerusalem as ghost, as he dropped some 10 mins before the end. I am not going to argue for or against the CW thing, you know my opinion and I do not know in what other way I could make it more clear to you.
IIRC, on ICQ last night, you said "shit happens", when we talked, I will just say the same thing here, shit happens, if Toukbal would have decleared independence while you were ghosted, I would have advocated an edit. About the blackmailing, I certainly see why people would say that you are blackmailing, the province decleares independence, you leave, you say that you will only come back if it is edited back. I have never accused you of blackmailing, but I can see how people find a reason to do so.
Good, because you will have to do that from now on.
Arent you gonna say that you were invaded by aliens as well? You were invaded by Austria, I helped you, Sweden seized the moment and attacked you, just as anyone with a moderately strong country would have done. You could just have accepted peace with Austria and Sweden, then work on your relationships and rebuilding your empire, but you drop in the middle of the war, so Austria cant even peace you out. Spain, England, NL and I (France) partitioned your empire after you had left, I wouldnt have attacked you if you would have kept playing, but Venice was decleared on-limits so everyone took what they could. Lets leave other games out of this discussion as they are irrelevant to the matter at hand.
Sorry for not being so Pro as you Absolut. My humblest sorries for that. I am not the kind of military genious that can beat everyone with such a shity country, if i may say. For that, speak to Bob
I dont know wether I should laugh or cry... Have I ever stated that I was better than you? Have I ever stated that you arent any good? Have I ever stated that I was a pro? No, I am just expressing my view of this matter.
What a nice help you lent to me... The only time Austria offered me peace, i was about to accept, then you just cried "No, dont, or i will get smashed". As i always keep my word, i didn't peace with him. In the next month, you just peace for Alsace, tossing me to the lions. After that i sent like 5 WPs proposals to Austria, none was accepted. But fine, this is irrelevant to the current discussion.
There are 2 different things: One is getting dowed constantly by the AI, another is dowing the AI. And i took no more then 2 provinces in each peace deal. Check the first post, you kept being away all the sessions, then i took 4 or 5 provs. And since you kept saying you were just subbing, i felt compeled to. You also annexed France, who was going to be Human played. Are you going to give them the provs you stole them, if you elected as GM? I hope so ABS, i hope so.
I am not blaming you because you forgot that. But it is kinda amazingly that in a game with 8 players or more, everyone of them suddently forget that i or someone else dropped. Seems like everyone in this game is suffering from a colective amnesia?
You misunderstood in here. Dano crashed twice, one at start, and one nearly the end. I was speaking the time he crashed right at the start. And that wasnt "slightly different" from my case.
There are 2 different things: One is getting dowed constantly by the AI, another is dowing the AI. And i took no more then 2 provinces in each peace deal. Check the first post, you kept being away all the sessions, then i took 4 or 5 provs. And since you kept saying you were just subbing, i felt compeled to. You also annexed France, who was going to be Human played. Are you going to give them the provs you stole them, if you elected as GM? I hope so ABS, i hope so.
I am not blaming you because you forgot that. But it is kinda amazingly that in a game with 8 players or more, everyone of them suddently forget that i or someone else dropped. Seems like everyone in this game is suffering from a colective amnesia?
You misunderstood in here. Dano crashed twice, one at start, and one nearly the end. I was speaking the time he crashed right at the start. And that wasnt "slightly different" from my case.
BurningEGO said:
I have no intentions of giving France anything back, why dont you ask Norway and Poland to give back what they took from Bohemia?
If they were going to be human played, why werent there anyone playing them the sessions until I annexed them? So, if I was only subbing, is it right to take provinces from a human country? Dont say it is the same as France, becasue it isnt, I had been playing a few sessions and France hadnt been played at all.
We didnt forget you, we wanted to see your country ruined, isnt it obvious?
When did Dano crash right at the start? Only ones I can remember crashing before we had gotten started was Sid.
God, you guys really suffer from amnesia, can you take some kind of treatment please? Either you simply forget everything, which is really strange, or you are just "saying" you forgot it. I cant believe how could someone suddently forget everything about the game. And so i am forced to check the log to prove that dano droped near the start. (We started the game in 1545 if i recall)
Bohemia, afaik, was never intended to be played by a human. As KoM said, only a fantastic player would do something out of it, even so, little could be done. France was a diferrent story. I was going to support them, to keep the power balance there, and so would Dominus, i believe. And if Traveler was here, i doubt he would stand still watching any of us getting stronger in France. He always tried to balance things out, or so i got that impression in the CK thread. Also, France was subbed at the first very session by a vnetter. He dropped. And you took full advantage of it. You just played the first and second sessions, then you dropped the next 2/3. When you got back, i gave back all provinces, and we dowed Traveler. Did you do the same to France? No one is currently playing France because of that. Well, maybe no one would, since we are already missing Bengal and Mughals, but if we didnt have a France, how could we know we wouldnt get a player for it? For example, i would never join the game as Bengal or Mughals, because i simply hate them. But as France perhaps i would.
Bohemia, afaik, was never intended to be played by a human. As KoM said, only a fantastic player would do something out of it, even so, little could be done. France was a diferrent story. I was going to support them, to keep the power balance there, and so would Dominus, i believe. And if Traveler was here, i doubt he would stand still watching any of us getting stronger in France. He always tried to balance things out, or so i got that impression in the CK thread. Also, France was subbed at the first very session by a vnetter. He dropped. And you took full advantage of it. You just played the first and second sessions, then you dropped the next 2/3. When you got back, i gave back all provinces, and we dowed Traveler. Did you do the same to France? No one is currently playing France because of that. Well, maybe no one would, since we are already missing Bengal and Mughals, but if we didnt have a France, how could we know we wouldnt get a player for it? For example, i would never join the game as Bengal or Mughals, because i simply hate them. But as France perhaps i would.
Absolut beat the human played france in the first war. No one else turned up for France, so he then annexed it, seems fair enough. What exactly is your problem with that series of events?
Gentlemen, can I suggest that this discussion is perhaps not entirely productive? If Ego has complaints about how the game is run, that's one thing; he has made some suggestions for how it should be done. That's fine. And if the game is being run so badly, in his opinion, that he can no longer enjoy it, then it is certainly reasonable for him to leave, and no blackmail. (Though leaving in the middle of a session on the grounds that you aren't getting an edit, and stating that you will only come back if you do, is, I think, slightly different.)
But to suggest that people are deliberately playing in bad faith; to drag in old conflicts from other games; and to call other players irresponsible; is not exactly contributing positively to the spirit of the game. I would suggest a few days' pause in this discussion, until tempers have cooled.
But to suggest that people are deliberately playing in bad faith; to drag in old conflicts from other games; and to call other players irresponsible; is not exactly contributing positively to the spirit of the game. I would suggest a few days' pause in this discussion, until tempers have cooled.
BurningEGO said:
Thank you for showing my private messages, but you showing my private messages shows that I had other things to worry about, thus I could have forgotten it.
From what Ive heard, Bohemia was just as much of a player nation as France, Bohemia would have been about as hard to play as France, perhaps a bit harder, as it has 4 neighbours, not 3 as France. The reason I attacked France was that he attacked one of my vassals, I couldnt just watch as he annexed them so I attacked, took some provinces from him, then he left. Noone then protested when I later annexed them either. Good for you that you wouldnt mind playing France, but we didnt have a player (perm) for the nation, it would be rather odd to leave it be, as England and I take all the provinces around it. I talked to KoM about that as well, he said I did nothing wrong, so I will not discuss this matter further.
KoM, i am really calm today. But people saying things about me, without looking themselves in a mirror first, is a thing that i cant admit. I just wonder, if i hadn't hastily took most of the rebel provinces, how would iberia look now. And again, i was threatning to leave not for a stupid 22 income province, but rather for player's atitudes.
I was enjoying the game, but this kind of things spoil it. It happened to me, but i would like to see it hapening for you or ABS.
*Gulp*. Bob, where you there? Did you see what absolut beated? It was everything less a human player, for sure. The French vnetter player left kind of early on. Nothing about this series of events, but if Absolut says I broke rules by taking 4-5 provinces from burgundy from 3-4 wars against AI, even while i was defending myself... he did exactly the same thing to France (although, even worse, he wasnt defending himself, he was attacking). So why did he complain about this? I didnt even speak about taking provs from the AI. He just started this non-sense because i edited my post in which i said i gave my vote to him.
From what i remember, You were subbing as well, and i kindly gave all provinces back. Kind of odd isnt it? Why am i such an arse to people? I give them all provinces back, only to earn their eternal enmity? I see that you are really thankful for having all your provinces back. Thanks for teaching me this lession, next time i will be sure to take provs from ai in defensive wars, and not give them back. Specially against subs. Since it is "rather odd to leave" provinces owned by subs around...
I was enjoying the game, but this kind of things spoil it. It happened to me, but i would like to see it hapening for you or ABS.
*Gulp*. Bob, where you there? Did you see what absolut beated? It was everything less a human player, for sure. The French vnetter player left kind of early on. Nothing about this series of events, but if Absolut says I broke rules by taking 4-5 provinces from burgundy from 3-4 wars against AI, even while i was defending myself... he did exactly the same thing to France (although, even worse, he wasnt defending himself, he was attacking). So why did he complain about this? I didnt even speak about taking provs from the AI. He just started this non-sense because i edited my post in which i said i gave my vote to him.
From what i remember, You were subbing as well, and i kindly gave all provinces back. Kind of odd isnt it? Why am i such an arse to people? I give them all provinces back, only to earn their eternal enmity? I see that you are really thankful for having all your provinces back. Thanks for teaching me this lession, next time i will be sure to take provs from ai in defensive wars, and not give them back. Specially against subs. Since it is "rather odd to leave" provinces owned by subs around...
Last edited:
BurningEGO said:
I was indeed there, subbing Hungary for Ear.
The french player attacked a Burgundian vassal, absolut then beat him in a war. The player left, leaving it as an AI country, which can then be treated like any other AI country, as it had no player.
Taking provinces off a human country that is being played by the AI for a session is simply never done.
BurningEGO said:
Really, did you took all the Iberian provinces by yourself?
If my memory doesnt fail me completely, as you are implying, did I not liberate Iberia?
So a vnetter isnt a human?
I attacked a human player, you were attacked by the AI, Im sure people agree with taking provinces from a human played country when the one usually playing them isnt there is wrong. Saying that I did to France what you did to Burgundy made me laugh a little, its two completely different things. Now, that I brought this up because you said you were un-nominating me as a GM made me laugh a little more, because if you check the previous posts you will most probably see that that was not the case. Attacking a sub, even if he is a vnetter, is not the same as attacking/being attacked by an AIed human country, simple as that.