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Looks like the CSA is not long for this world. Much like Garibaldi, it would seem: he came, he saw... he ran away? Not exactly a sterling start to the reunification of Italy, but at least you didn't have to actually invest anything into his little magical Sicilian disappearing trick. And you have a back-up option, so in the long run it'll still all belong to you. Warts and all: I wonder if the backwardness of the rest of the country is going to drag your economy down, when that happy day of reunification comes?
 
I was wondering what levels have you set your taxes to and do you tweak them? I am interested particularly in your tariff tax level as that directly affects your domestic demand. Just being nosy what volume of goods are you buying and selling each turn?
 
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The new Garibaldi product will be 'evaporated' milk. :)

At this point is there any reason to still want a war with Austria? Or should you try to mend relations and wait for the other events to fire?
 
The new Garibaldi product will be 'evaporated' milk. :)

At this point is there any reason to still want a war with Austria? Or should you try to mend relations and wait for the other events to fire?

Ba-dum tish. :)

<Takes on a tone of authority to hide an absolute lack of knowledge>

Here, let me put down my pipe and adjust my slippers before I answer your question. I believe that, without the delicious war with Austria, the unified Italy will still sadly lack its rightful territories in Lombardia and Venice. Therefore, war remains of the utmost import for the proper fulfillment of Sardegna-Piemonte's manifest destiny.
 
... and 'vanishing' cream!

Thanks for the clarification, Stuyvesant. I'm still struggling with Vic II (though after four tries as different nations I have finally survived to 1900 as Japan) and not sure how the event chains work.

If loki declares war on Austria, will France support him?
 
Looks like the CSA is not long for this world. Much like Garibaldi, it would seem: he came, he saw... he ran away? Not exactly a sterling start to the reunification of Italy, but at least you didn't have to actually invest anything into his little magical Sicilian disappearing trick. And you have a back-up option, so in the long run it'll still all belong to you. Warts and all: I wonder if the backwardness of the rest of the country is going to drag your economy down, when that happy day of reunification comes?

As to the last point, as it did historically yes. Looking over the map there is one, maybe 2, industrial structures in Italy outside S-P. I'm slowly building a rail line in preparation for the glorious day but its going to be a real shock of shifting from a relatively well organised industrial economy back to one largely dominated by agriculture (all very realistic). Historically this was made worse by giving up on the South almost immediately and allowing the tax-farmers and latifundi to continue as if the Bourbons had never left. That in turn seriously undermined any identification with the new state (that many saw as an S-P conquest in any case) and led to major peasant revolts in 1860-70 and then regular unrest up to the outbreak of WW1.

I was wondering what levels have you set your taxes to and do you tweak them? I am interested particularly in your tariff tax level as that directly affects your domestic demand. Just being nosy what volume of goods are you buying and selling each turn?



I'm not changing them much. That is bringing in enough to fund one line of research investment. In cash terms I'm buying around £200 per turn and selling about £400, as essentially I'm buying in primary products and selling manufactures. I could optimise that quite a lot more but I'm taking the role of helping the world economy along seriously. Not least of course, you get the shipping tax in addition, so volume matters as much as raw profit.

The new Garibaldi product will be 'evaporated' milk. :)

At this point is there any reason to still want a war with Austria? Or should you try to mend relations and wait for the other events to fire?
Ba-dum tish. :)

<Takes on a tone of authority to hide an absolute lack of knowledge>

Here, let me put down my pipe and adjust my slippers before I answer your question. I believe that, without the delicious war with Austria, the unified Italy will still sadly lack its rightful territories in Lombardia and Venice. Therefore, war remains of the utmost import for the proper fulfillment of Sardegna-Piemonte's manifest destiny.
... and 'vanishing' cream!

If loki declares war on Austria, will France support him?

Stuyvesant is spot on. The chain, whether the 'proper' one or the imposed 1865+ version gives me all Italy apart from Lombardia-Veneto-Friule-Trieste. Now in reality, especially Lombardy was an economic power house, in this game its an agricultural wasteland, so one motivation is lost.

But to get the Po valley and upper Adriatic I need to beat Austria somehow. Diplomatically we are in a stand off. If I DoW, I have no support and they have Prussia (at the moment there is a defensive alliance), if they DoW they have no support and I have France. I think the Austrian AI is being frustratingly logical (& its better than it being hard coded to suicide) in that it is riding out the storm of low key revolt in N Italy as representing no real threat.

So there are two ways - one is a crisis. That can fire at any time with any nation where you have less than favourable (+25) relations. If so, I'd escalate, and hope they stumble into war, if not then I clean up a huge prestige stash (akin to the US-French one a few posts back). To get relations to +25 would be an immense task, so I have to keep in mind this could happen at any time.

The other is Austria in a war, there is a potentially scripted chain with Prussia around 1866 and they keep on having crises with Russia. In the case of a war, I'm in on my own, but if they take a battering I might be able to grab N Italy (I have to gamble). If the Prussian fires after the rest of the unification, I'll have a larger army and a bit of space to manouver if it goes a bit wrong.

I'm not sure that Garibaldi's ego would have coped with the events in this game. No fame, no glory, just a damp squib of an event in Sicily.

Thanks for the clarification, Stuyvesant. I'm still struggling with Vic II (though after four tries as different nations I have finally survived to 1900 as Japan) and not sure how the event chains work.

Oddly I find PoN a bit easier than V2 in some respects. I think its that the turn ending/processing structure creates points where you need to sit down and review things while in V2 it sort of trundles on. I'm turning the slow turn processing of PoN to my advantage. I'm running it a lot while working on a different computer, so I then check the turn outcome, make changes etc, and then run another turn.

What I do find is that with V2 I sometimes wish for more hard wired constraints and with PoN I wish for a bit more flexibility to create my own world - I guess that just makes me inconsistent.

I think that once partial unification has happened I am going to remove the constraint in PoN and see if I can develop an a-historic empire in the Eastern Med and Eastern Africa.
 
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July-December 1860, All at sea

Well with Garibaldi dunked, I guess we really are in for a long haul. So my goal is to be prepared, resist all temptations, hope for a crisis and see if there is any other way I can gain prestige.

So off we go with the usual stuff, but first a confession, I forgot to take the base line data (ie July) but if you want you can see late June in the previous post. Promise not to do this again.

Manufactures and Big Events

Here I am producing high end factories that produce stuff I can sell, plus stimulate demand for raw inputs. Increasingly I am trading for these and saving my own capital. The goal with the merchants is to try and cover the globe if I can.



As you can see there is a very nautical flavour to my industrial strategy at this stage



Essentially the economy is stable, I am opening and shutting some of the marginal stuff with an eye to stockpiles and sales.

Non Manufactured



Not much to note there, my fish stocks are falling (but that is easy to either buy in or re-open my own production), same with wood, roughly I'm holding things steady which is my basic idea.

Replacements



Starting to get this under control. May even be able to afford a new infantry division at some stage.

Happy Persons



Diplomacy



Not much to say there. I'm building relations with a number of smaller powers for trade reasons. Greece as I'd like an alliance with them (and thus the potential for conflict with the Ottomans) and my relationship with Austria has hit rock bottom (& not by accident).

Prestige



Again not much to say. I need one form or other of the unification chain before that will start to improve.


And the ongoing events

So lets start, and end, with insulting an Austrian



A rather useful invention fires.



So that makes my units stronger on the defense, and confirms my bias to fighting defensive battles if I can.

Another useful invention is that of military decorations. Now I know my army has fought no battles but that is no reason for it not to be well decorated



Anyway, that increases the cohesion of my forces which will also improve their combat performance.

And then the medal option appears on the military screen



Note this has the effect on population morale not on military competence, but does yield some more officers. Well I'll take it in any case. Note that National Morale is only really important in case of war, but anything over 100 (the base line) has a few small advantages.

Finally, my latest merchant fleet goes off to SE Asia

 
Looks good, albeit a bit of a holding pattern. Economically, you seem to be doing well - do you even want those backwards bits that dangle south of you on the Italian Peninsula? I guess you need the prestige, the expanded colonial options and you could of course always opt to run the south better than historically happened. :)

Very much the case that Garry Baldy was an utter failure, but I'm not sure you can now claim you're 'in for [the] long haul' - I believe Thandros might want to have a word with you about that description. ;)
 
Looks good, albeit a bit of a holding pattern. Economically, you seem to be doing well - do you even want those backwards bits that dangle south of you on the Italian Peninsula? I guess you need the prestige, the expanded colonial options and you could of course always opt to run the south better than historically happened. :)

Very much the case that Garry Baldy was an utter failure, but I'm not sure you can now claim you're 'in for [the] long haul' - I believe Thandros might want to have a word with you about that description. ;)

I think the main reason for acquiring the 'dangley' bits of the Italian peninsula would be to acquire manpower. S-P biggest constraint in my opinion has got to be their paltry conscript replacement rate. Whilst I am not 100% sure I guess when you unify italy the conscripts rate should increase accordingly.
 
Looks good, albeit a bit of a holding pattern. Economically, you seem to be doing well - do you even want those backwards bits that dangle south of you on the Italian Peninsula? I guess you need the prestige, the expanded colonial options and you could of course always opt to run the south better than historically happened. :)

Very much the case that Garry Baldy was an utter failure, but I'm not sure you can now claim you're 'in for [the] long haul' - I believe Thandros might want to have a word with you about that description. ;)

yep poor Baldy. I do actually think if you take one of the second (or third?) tier powers in PoN, then you need to accept you are constrained by the game engine. Anyway, I came near to recycling my RoP AAR title for the new CK one.

I think the main reason for acquiring the 'dangley' bits of the Italian peninsula would be to acquire manpower. S-P biggest constraint in my opinion has got to be their paltry conscript replacement rate. Whilst I am not 100% sure I guess when you unify italy the conscripts rate should increase accordingly.

that is what I am hoping, I should be able to build a large enough army that I can then risk having a substantial element deployed outside Italy liberating provinces from Ottoman rule and so on. At the moment, conscripts are so few that it is near impossible to build up the main bulk of the army, and feel rather constrained to adding specialist and support units instead.
 
January-June 1861, back to the colonies

So we are now really waiting for the secondary unification chain. Fortunately a few new inventions give me new things to do (and I can play PoN while cooking/doing other work, so its surprising how much progress you can make).

In the meantime, I can only hope for Austria to stumble into a war that at best brings in France as my defender and at worst means their alliance with Prussia is broken.

I think I am starting to see why for Single Player, PoN only has a few playable nations. In truth you are very locked into the nineteenth century norms and that means few wars between the major powers. Equally its worth remembering how unexpected were the events of 1859. Napoleon + Cavour could only get respective agreements to a defensive alliance and that meant hoping Austria would take the bait. Even as tensions rose in February, the British seemed to have mediated a settlement, making Austrian aggression unlikely. Some Italian history textbooks used to refer to this as the 'miracle of 1859' (guess they still do).

Anyway, first the regular reports and then the main events:

Manufactured Goods & other economic events



Non-Manufactured Goods



Again, my basic goal here is to keep the stocks under control and to meet the growing demand from China for my fish, cows, wine and cereals.

Happy People



These increases in population are welcome as they in turn want more goods to satisfy their needs

Replacements



Not much to say here. I am slowly building up an unused reserve which will be handy. Over time that is either a new formation or the means to pay the replacement costs of a major military upgrade.

Diplomacy



This shows the end of June only. There is little that is changing but I am slowly trying to bring more nations onto my 'best mates' list.

Events

I decide to invest cash into speeding up another of the techs that will have the effect of boosting demand for goods (in effect it increases demand by 10% in each of the 3 categories)



In my mind this is good as it creates domestic demand that I can meet either by production or by increased trade.

Another useful tech has fired that allows for more exciting colonial activities. I can send people off to look at the natives and the animals and things.



Note these loop back into improved prestige which I could really do with boosting.



I also set up a new trading post – this time in a coffee producing province (so I get a regular supply of 1 unit about every 2-3 turns)



Other events fire that improve the efficiency of some of my industry. I'll not list these but they tend to increase efficiency (ie more output for less input) or increase volume per factory (more input & more output).

But this one opens up a new, and rather useful, decision.



So that can be used to drive down militancy (good to use in Piedmont) and increases the development level (good for industrial and agricultural efficiency).

And my new merchant fleet goes off to the West Coast of America. Not only might this net me some more sales, but I fancy a cut of all that gold that has been discovered



Cavour steps down (ill-health), well he's not achieved much in any case



Prestige continues to be rather unimpressive



By June, the American Civil War looks pretty much resolved:

 
Looking rather solid. And some colonial action, even if it's rather low-key stuff. I like Racosoli's natty 'tache - really seems meant for diabolical twirling.

The American Civil War seems to be winding down, but I do notice there's some grey on the far left of your screenshot: they have taken refuge in the deserts of New Mexico?
 
If you can get supply and a couple of expedition type units (about 35 power each) into those colonial type places, you could build a coffee plantation and a railroad and really start raking in those coffee units. That's what I have done with Prussia (I was able to do it even before I got the full scope of colonial cards). I built a pre-industrial fort and built a depot and upgraded the depot several times. I got my depot to level 4 and put in a railroad and it really started paying off pretty quickly.
 
Looking rather solid. And some colonial action, even if it's rather low-key stuff. I like Racosoli's natty 'tache - really seems meant for diabolical twirling.

The American Civil War seems to be winding down, but I do notice there's some grey on the far left of your screenshot: they have taken refuge in the deserts of New Mexico?

I think they have a couple of provinces around California so taht makes sense.

I agree about Racosoli's face fuzz, all he needs is the top hat and he'd be just the person to empty the poor house on the grounds its all too soft for the working classes ...

If you can get supply and a couple of expedition type units (about 35 power each) into those colonial type places, you could build a coffee plantation and a railroad and really start raking in those coffee units. That's what I have done with Prussia (I was able to do it even before I got the full scope of colonial cards). I built a pre-industrial fort and built a depot and upgraded the depot several times. I got my depot to level 4 and put in a railroad and it really started paying off pretty quickly.

thats great advice. I'm actually a fair way ahead as I've had time for my rather odd approach to playing PoN. I managed 1862 while making Damson jam and 1863 while cleaning and oiling the floorboards ... I think when I finish I should publish the PoN cookery book? But I build one explorer in, I think 1862, and over time it really seems to drive my CP up, so I've just (early 64 - cabbage & meat balls + polenta) built another and its on its way ...

Looks like the ACW is all over but the pouting...

Still no response from the Austrians. King Log is on the throne, it seems.

I think it drags out into 1862 but yes, there can be nothing left to provide a basis for a war. USA losses are just over 37,000 and I'd guess most of those are in the Civil War (no idea what the CSA has lost), so it looks like the default event in PoN is fairly non threatening.

Nope the Austrians are not taking the hint. At this rate Silvio is going to born speaking German - well I guess there is a bright side to every grey cloud?
 
July-December 1861: People Die and things move slowly

This is very much a period of little events. With my new colonial decisions, I am putting my interest into my presence in E Africa and manage to set up another (potentially coffee producing) trading post.

Manufactures and other economic events




Note that in this period my domestic capital was too low to allow me to gain those bonus luxuries. This is a pain as the only one I can gain easily is the luxury furniture and you cannot supply all their needs with just one item.

My industry (second table) fluctuated in part as I juggled stocks and in part at the end I closed a load of stuff down (I know, this gets more Thatcherite by the update) in order to free up capital. I want to get the stock back over 1400 so I gain those bonus goodies and that also helps keep militancy down and contentment up.

Non-Manufactured goods



Replacements



My goal here is to build up enough replacements to cope with a series of military upgrades or even a new Infantry Corps if I can.

Happy people charts



So the population increase is useful but as you can see the militancy has dipped quite a lot mainly as I now have a new, rather useful, decision to play.



Insulting Austria and the 'mates' list



And the main events over these six months

I gain more prestige



This shows the result of my first explorer type activity



So I decide to do some more. It often fails a few times before they set off.



And I have enough leverage to build a second trading post. This time on a coffee producing province.



You've not seen this for a while. But I have made some progress, back in December 1855 I was at 20 for Abyssinia, 22 for Somalia and 23 for Eritrea. So ... well it is progress ... of a sort ... just very slow.

On the subject of people moving slowly, Cavour has gone and died.



Moving equally slowly is my prestige gains (despite the new found colonial dynamism)



Well I still am nowhere near the top list. Note that China's losses are now over 1 million.
 
You certainly have an interesting approach to playing PON - I have tons of chores around the house myself, maybe I should experiment with your technique. :)

The one thing that really stood out to me was that you showed us some screenshots titled 'insulting Austria', but the screenshots seemed to indicate that your relations improved... Are the Australians that thick, or your diplomats that incompetent? :p
 
You certainly have an interesting approach to playing PON - I have tons of chores around the house myself, maybe I should experiment with your technique. :)

The one thing that really stood out to me was that you showed us some screenshots titled 'insulting Austria', but the screenshots seemed to indicate that your relations improved... Are the Australians that thick, or your diplomats that incompetent? :p

its allowed me to make progress in the less interesting turns, quick check of the message log, quick check there are no new decisions, minor twiddle with the economy, press 'new turn' and come back 10 mins later. Doesn't work when you need to pay attention though ... and you do sometimes forget what you were doing ..

I make no comment about Australians, at least in this AAR. I think there is a built in drift away from an extreme position and you can only insult so often. So I guess it depends on when I last played the option. The only advantage is it mildly increases the chance of a crisis with them.
 
January-June 1862, The economy expands ...

So we carry on alternative road to unification. Now I need to make a confession. Despite playing PoN while carrying out a range of domestic chores, I found it hard to keep on waiting. So I've modded the start date for the alternative road to unification (south of the Po) to Jan 1864 and as compensation reduced the likelihood of it firing in a given turn.

Anyway, I've just started playing 1865, and Italy is united. Equally I have found Mr Baldy, and he is not happy I can tell you now.

My reasons in part was to allow a bit more action, but equally I wanted to see what sorts of economic and social problems the unification event produces – quite a lot – rather than carry on with this rather effective, steady state, economy I have built up.

Anyway, we are still in 1862, so lets carry on as usual.

Manufactured Goods and Main Economic Events





The reason for the leap in output was one of those inventions that increase domestic demand fired, so I could sell more into my domestic market.

Non-Manufactured.



Replacements



My stock of reserve companies is slowly growing. So at some stage I can either add a new formation or use up that stock when I need to equip the army with new weaponry.

Happy People



Well they seem fairly happy. Note the growth specifically in the urban populations in two provinces.

Diplomacy.



I've only shown the end-June position. I'm just sticking to my usual pattern. Build up a number of friendly relations and then try for commercial agreements. Insult the Austrians.

Events

Another of the inventions that boost demand for goods fire



Again this adds 10% to each demand cell. I've written in the numbers before (remember there is some degree of rounding going on with the visible numbers). Below it I have shown how well, at the initial point, I am almost meeting their demands in the food/common and luxury categories. I can sort out the common good problem very easily (hence the increase in industrial production), but the only luxury I produce is furniture. So for that I am now very dependent on those random purchases. Remember you need a range of goods in each category to satisfy demand - so you can't feed them just with fish for example.

Also since I am pretty cash-rich I decide its a good idea to invest in a range of key inventions.



Rattazzi is in charge now



I carry on with my innocent interest in the flora and fauna of Ethiopia.



And we will introduce more of Italy to the alien concept of the telecommunications – it will never catch on



And the American Civil War ends



And I make no noticeable progress with colonial expansion



or really in terms of gaining prestige

 
Rattazzi? Seriously? A man whose name conjures an unholy hybrid of rat and paparazzi? His facial hair isn't quite up to his predecessor's standards, but then he does have a pince-nez or even a monocle, so he gets points for that.

So, you're exploring the flora in Yemen - isn't that a major producer of opium? Coincidence? I don't think so...

Oh, and this:

loki100 said:
I make no comment about Australians, at least in this AAR.

I blame that on trying to comment past my bedtime on an iPad with a 'God-I-hate-this' virtual keyboard. I certainly did not mean any offense to your antipodean cousins. :)