Manpower Question

[Viktor_Vertex]

I have a question about a possible exploit with manpower.
Say you are the Soviet Union and you want to keep as much recruitable population as possible from your Western lands, and avoid losing manpower from Germany occupying cities.

Is it possible then, to deploy ALL your untrained, unequipped manpower somewhere safe on the map, lose the population centres, disband the useless divisions and end up with more manpower in the pool than you would have if not doing that?

Calculations
You have 10 million people in country and 5% are recruitable =>500 000 manpower. Deploy all of them, lose half your country, now you have 5 mil people, but still keep 500k mp if you disband units, despite recruitable population now being 250 k ? Does the new manpower count in your population? Because if not, you would lose all your territories and still have 500k manpower.
Asking, because it could be exploitable by Poland, SU or other countries that are basically guaranteed to lose territory at first, as a mp conservation strategy



What happens if you lose half your territory so you end up with half the population, but 200%manpower(10%of total recruited with 5% law, because lost territories), Lose all manpower in battle, but retake your lost territory, will you be able to recruit again from that territory, thereby ending up with more men than legit possible?
Does the game "save" from where the manpower was used up ?

 

[Sun_Killer]

This, is a very good question.But i think you will lose the manpower on disbanding. Since they can now count your losses and your pool correctly, so when you disband your units it will check the fallen soldiers, than the max pool availabe from your current country and when the number is going to be higher than possible it will erase all manpower that isn´t possible. Maybe you can exploit it, with not disbanding the divsion just changing the template to combat template with about the same manpower.

 

[Hikuran]

So you are suggesting that Soviet should be able to "resettle" its population before Operation Barbarossa happens to avoid lack of manpower?
It would greatly challenge the game engine so I doubt it could be implemented (or even supported)

 

[Gort11]

So you are suggesting that Soviet should be able to "resettle" its population before Operation Barbarossa happens to avoid lack of manpower?
It would greatly challenge the game engine so I doubt it could be implemented (or even supported)

He's not suggesting that he should be able to do that.

He's suggesting that that's what the game already allows you to do. Hence the word "exploit" in the thread title.

 

[Hikuran]

He's not suggesting that he should be able to do that.

He's suggesting that that's what the game already allows you to do. Hence the word "exploit" in the thread title.

Oh, my fault.
Well, the same trick in HOI3 might still be used. But I doubt it would be efficient enough to hold off Germans, lots have changed

 

[potski]

Is it possible then, to deploy ALL your untrained, unequipped manpower somewhere safe on the map...

No, you can't deploy Divs which are unequipped:

You are free to deploy any division as long as it has 10% of its equipment and manpower, but at least in peace time it is best to wait until they have all the equipment they need and have trained as much as they can.

Even if you have 10% equipment for all of those troops, what's the benefit of having Divs which are untrained and at 90% of their equipment strength?

And none of your Divs would be able to replace any casualties.

You have 10 million people in country and 5% are recruitable...

Just change the law and make 10% recruitable.

 

[Grunzmatte]

Will be tricky

 

[Zankoas]

I would say this isn't really an exploit as a tactic, I mean, you could do that, but then you would have to supply 10% equipment for those divisions (minimum before you can deploy them), as well as the strain on your supply lines, there would be a huge trade of

 

[Viktor_Vertex]

No, you can't deploy Divs which are unequipped:

Even if you have 10% equipment for all of those troops, what's the benefit of having Divs which are untrained and at 90% of their equipment strength?

You don't keep the divisions, you disband them after you have consolidated behind a river or some such defensible location, makes your equipment and manpower redistributed again

 

[Ownage]

I thought they would return to their homes in western russia. Not resettle. If you are already at war i think they would disappear.

 

[Viktor_Vertex]

I would say this isn't really an exploit as a tactic

It's possibly exploitable, depending on how manpower is 'returned' from reclaiming your lost land. If Paradox did some careless programming(not saying they do that, but bugs are possible), it would actually be possible to 'create' manpower this way, by losing and reclaiming your territories, and 'spending' manpower inbetween.

 

[uishax]

While I imagine this 'exploit' is theoretically possible, you would be wasting equipment, training time (there is a minimal requirement) on a bunch of useless divisions, its an opportunity cost.

 

[Himliano]

You don't keep the divisions, you disband them after you have consolidated behind a river or some such defensible location, makes your equipment and manpower redistributed again

And what about attrition?? How would that affect? Wouldn† you just wasting people like that?

 

[Gort11]

And what about attrition?? How would that affect? Wouldn† you just wasting people like that?

You don't get attrition unless you go over your supply limit.

 

[potski]

You don't keep the divisions, you disband them after you have consolidated behind a river or some such defensible location, makes your equipment and manpower redistributed again

That's very unlikely. The manpower pool is those men you have available to call up. If you disband a unit the men are no longer part of your armed forces and go home, they don't sit around in some off-map place where they can be redeployed to another unit. Your MP pool is negative, and disbanding some units won't make it positive.

 

[potski]

You don't get attrition unless you go over your supply limit.

You get attrition from other things. But he's specifically talking about having front line units which carryout a fighting retreat. They will be suffering casualties which cannot be replaced if your MP pool is negative. The front line units will get weaker and weaker. You will be forced to disband all of the useless units or change your conscription laws.

 

[Viktor_Vertex]

That's very unlikely. The manpower pool is those men you have available to call up. If you disband a unit the men are no longer part of your armed forces and go home, they don't sit around in some off-map place where they can be redeployed to another unit. Your MP pool is negative, and disbanding some units won't make it positive.

Is this your opinion or was it actually mentioned somewhere ?

 

[Gort11]

You get attrition from other things. But he's specifically talking about having front line units which carryout a fighting retreat. They will be suffering casualties which cannot be replaced if your MP pool is negative. The front line units will get weaker and weaker. You will be forced to disband all of the useless units or change your conscription laws.

I don't think anyone suggested these units fight, and fighting losses are not what this game refers to as "attrition". The exploit specifically uses them just to be bags of men for the purpose of disbandment.

 

[Wimpola]

You must have at least 25% of the division equipped before it can be deployed. Also you can't tell where the manpower is coming from. There is an overall pool of them combined from all the states.