Manpower issues:Germany

[uarus_strabo]

I'm playing asGermany 1936 GC 1.1 with the Unofficial 1.1b fix supplied by madtomic. The Difficulty is Hard/normal.
It is July 17th 1940. My Army consists of 207 divisions, airforce 53 units and fleet 25. I've invaded and conquered Spain, France, South France, Belgium, Netherlands, Luxembourg, Poland. Denmark, Norway and Sweden have been annexed and Scandinavia released.
I've researched Agriculture Production and have Early Hospital.

The manpower losses I've incurred to achieve this have reduced my available Manpower to just 474 and that figure is red. The allied bombing campaign over the French coast seems to be what's hurting me, although looking at the units there, no one unit seems to be below 80% strength and are well dug in aswell. Most the the coastline has 5 AA and some provinces have Radar. My air defences on the French coast are shot up to some degree. I'm not active in any other theatre.
Has anyone experienced such crippling Manpower shortages? In HOI2 1.3b I'd expect to be around the 800-1000 mark (although I've built an extra 20-25 INF than usual, I should still be around the 600-800 Manpower mark). Has the Manpower attrition been changed in Doomsday? The USSR, I'm sure, will drain what Manpower I've got left pretty quickly. I don't mind if this is WAD but I'd like to know if anyone else has any ideas.

 

[Acheron]

Did you neglect doctrines, ground or airwise? I believe that these not only help winning battles but also curb your looses indirectly to win faster.

I hope you have researched current fighters/interceptors to challenge allied bombers over Europe.

If the bombing campign really is the problem, consider launching a massive submarine camapign against the British convoys. Also have naval bobmers hunt convoys in the sea between Ireland and Britain (worked wonder for me there). Eventually, you can get the Brits to produce nothing but convoys...

 

[uarus_strabo]

I'm not aware of ignoring any doctrines. Air doctrines researched are First Strike and Dispersed Fighting. As always I could do with more but the slots are currently taken by other pressing issues. I've got FTR and INT cover over the areas that seem to be of interest to the Allied bomber fleets. About 6 flights in all. I know that's not much but the bombers targeting French IC don't hurt that much. My concern is the Manpower losses. I've tried bigger swarms (up to 4 units) but they get trashed by mega stacks coming over the channel. It just seems that if my losses are due to air battle then it might make some sense to ground the airforce in France and see what happens. The only IC I'm interested in seriously protecting is that in Germany proper.

 

[Acheron]

You built a heck lot of divisions, that sure is a big drain on your Germany.
I think air units are rather small manpower wise, so they shouldn't affect your manpower too much.
Where have you parked your army? Áre they back in germany, or in some backwater province that might inflict casaulties?

 

[uarus_strabo]

You built a heck lot of divisions, that sure is a big drain on your Germany.
I think air units are rather small manpower wise, so they shouldn't affect your manpower too much.
Where have you parked your army? Áre they back in germany, or in some backwater province that might inflict casaulties?

The army is located in three main theatres: Spain, Scandinaiva and the border of the USSR. No fighting is taking place. The only area of action is the French coast and the Atlantic where my U-boats are currently bagging transports at the rate of 1 per day on average.
As I mentioned previously I changed my usual strategy and built 25 divisions of INF earlier rather than later. Usually I build them post BP, but I thought they'd come in handy earlier. The breakdown is 129 INF, 1 CAV, 20 MOT, 3 L ARM, 10 ARM, 4 MTN, 36 GAR, 5 HQ. Not excessive IMO.

 

[Communazi]

You need to get that minister called Buch, he gives you manpower bonuses.

I think he's available in 38 or 39, then later in the war i think there's a +25% manpower minister too.

I never seem to have manpower problems that way, you don't really need a prince of terror minister all that much if you've industrialized germany for a year or two to begin with.

 

[De_Genius]

You need to get that minister called Buch, he gives you manpower bonuses.

I think he's available in 38 or 39, then later in the war i think there's a +25% manpower minister too.

I never seem to have manpower problems that way, you don't really need a prince of terror minister all that much if you've industrialized germany for a year or two to begin with.

Buch is first available in 37 where you arent in war with anyone. So replacing Frick early gives some good MP during peace time, and even in early war Buch is better. You shouldnt replace him before Barbarossa.

In 42 Adolf Heusinger becomes available giving +25% MP, which throws your MP during the roof.

 

[unmerged(56550)]

In my '36 game as germany, having an army of 202 div and 61 air, my manpower in Oct. 1941 is 1481 (conquered all of europe including GB, but no Barbarossa yet), so no problems there

 

[uarus_strabo]

In my '36 game as germany, having an army of 202 div and 61 air, my manpower in Oct. 1941 is 1481 (conquered all of europe including GB, but no Barbarossa yet), so no problems there

This is what I'm asking about. I seem to have lost an awful lot of manpower without actually doing a lot of fighting.

 

[Acheron]

Could urarus somehow have seriously drained his manpower in the previous wars? His situation confuses me.

 

[unmerged(50037)]

urarus

What what? :wacko:

 

[blue emu]

How much AA did you build... Hundreds? They are 1 MP each.

 

[uarus_strabo]

Could urarus somehow have seriously drained his manpower in the previous wars? His situation confuses me.

Possibly......
Start of Polish campaign Aug 30 1939 Manpower 1257
Poland annexed 00:00 Sept 7 1939 Manpower 1254
Western Campaign begins 07:00 October 8 1939 Manpower 1257
Vichy France created 00:00 November 1 1939 Manpower 1139
Netherlands Campaign begins 08:00 November 30 1939 Manpower 1084
Netherlands Campaign ends 008:00 December 8 1939 Manpower 1012
Vichy France Campaign begins 08:00 January 3 1940 Manpower 975
Southern France captured by 01:00 February 10 1940 Manpower 894
Republican Spain Campaign begins 08:00 April 3 1940 Manpower 766
Republican Spain annexed 20:00 June 4 1940 Manpower 574
Fall Weserubung begins 00:00 April 26 1940
Fall Weserubung ends 00:00 May 11 1940
Swedish Campaign begins 07:00 June 6 1940 Manpower 576
Swedish Campaign ends 22:00 June 17 1940 Manpower 521

I checked the weather before each campaign and I wasn't fighting in adverse conditions.

It seems very rare for me to have had to put less than 20-25 IC (and often more) towards reinforcements during the whole of this period.

Any suggestions welcome.

Yes I build lots of AA. 5 parallel runss of 99. Plus 5 AA in each of the French provinces along the English Channel.

 

[blue emu]

Looks like a combination of building lots of units, fighting in the winter (attrition) and suffering Ground Attacks from the Allies... units on French beaches at 80% strength, you said?

 

[uarus_strabo]

How much AA did you build... Hundreds? They are 1 MP each.

I've just checked my savegame about the AA. Yes this could be it. Currently I've got runs at 34/99 done which means I've spent 170 MP on static AA+ about another 60 MP on the French coast. About 230 MP. Hmmmmmmmm. This may be it. Doesn't explain the heavy reinforcement costs though for virtually no fighting. Current reinforcements needed is 35.21 and I'm only fighting over the French channel provinces with FTR and INT and have been doing so since they were taken.

 

[uarus_strabo]

Looks like a combination of building lots of units, fighting in the winter (attrition) and suffering Ground Attacks from the Allies... units on French beaches at 80% strength, you said?

Isn't the winter attrition rate only applicable when the province is frozen or in snow?
The garrison units are taking heavy poundings from CAS and TAC but they're dug in and haven't moved for months.

 

[blue emu]

Isn't the winter attrition rate only applicable when the province is frozen or in snow?

Correct.

The garrison units are taking heavy poundings from CAS and TAC but they're dug in and haven't moved for months.

That won't save them from AI-uber-Air-stacks... only from 'normal' Air stacks.

Remember that it's possible to earn nearly 100 Experience (+50% combat modifier) in only a few months... fully dug-in is only -60%.

 

[von_Ysselstein]

The manpower losses I've incurred to achieve this have reduced my available Manpower to just 474 and that figure is red.

Dont see where this number is too little? 474 is really much manpower imo.

 

[uarus_strabo]

Correct.



That won't save them from AI-uber-Air-stacks... only from 'normal' Air stacks.

Remember that it's possible to earn nearly 100 Experience (+50% combat modifier) in only a few months... fully dug-in is only -60%.

Damn those deep penetration bombs...

 

[unmerged(56268)]

53 air units and not controling the sky??