Make Ecumenopolis worth again

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ezno

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Actually Ecumenopolis have 3 utilities:
-Forge
-Industrial
-Leisure/unity

Let's compare the difference between An Ecumenopolis and a normal world designed for the 2 first uses.

The planet gives 2 jobs per district (if specialised) and 2 housing for a 2 energy upkeep.
The Ecu gives 6 jobs per district, 10 housing, for a 5 energy upkeep and 1 rare ressource.
You would say, it's a good buff, at the price of an ascension perk and 20000 mineral/200 influence per planet.
You spend then 1 rare ressource to get the 4 more jobs (the energy doesn't change so much per job).

The problem with this is that you will never fill this planet, or it's not profitable. An average Ecu is 20 wide (because you take the biggest planet for project), so you will have 120 jobs to fill ONLY the productive ones, which means 120 pops.

Assuming that you build it midgame, an empire of about 500pops, and pop grow of 15 per month, base settings, it will take 150 years (225*120/15/12) to fill the planet (and the calculation gives very low estimate), so you have the choice waiting pops from other planets to emigrate (but in this case they will not fill other jobs, like science)...
...Or to conquer pops, but is this case why moving them when you have a fresh planet that you can fill with industrial district? it's cheaper, no rare ressource upkeep, influence to spend for ecu ect...

Actually An ecu only gives more jobs, when player absolutely want pops, and it's locked behind a lot of investment (the +50% pop grow is nearly pointless, only 3 grow a month, 1 more pop in 8 years, assuming you still have 500 pops), it's not profitable.



How to fix this:

My idea could be that Ecumenopolis should be able to be more specialised, making pops more productive:

When you build an Ecumenopolis, you would have the choice de specialise in 2 ways, Industry or Forge.

When you specialise in a way, you have a cost to change it (some
minerals and influence)

The specialised
jobs would be fewer (I think for instead of 6), but as productive as the others for fewer pops, It would means that each pop would produce (and consume) 50% more

Now if we remake the comparaison, An Ecu district would produce the same as 3 normal districts, but use less pops, and when pops are very valuable, it would be worth to pay!



To summarise:

1 Ecu are expensive to get, and their districts cost more per job.

2 Pops are very important to get, so more jobs isn't that good -------> Ecu not worth.
3To fix this Ecu should have a specialise option to make jobs more productive that the others so big advantage to Ecu ------> They are worth the investment. Pop Efficiency is the key


Upvote if you like, comment if you have things to add/debate
 
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GOLANX

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Ecumenpolis should be a thing tall empires want to make and wide empires should ignore. Tall empires are so laughably weak in 3.0 because of pop growth scaling and ecus in particular suffer from it. So the problem isn't really the ecu it's that with pop growth scaling it can't get filled without Raiding or going wide which defeats the purpose of a planet you built to be worth more than a normal planet.

Tall empire's really should be able to increased their growth rate to compensate for not stealing them from other empires. I would additionally suggest that for ecus pop growth rate cap is doubbled and you can build a second pop assembly building (of the same type) this way your city planet grows much faster than the rural backwater planets. Cultural districts should also add a significant immigration pull, any pop that can move there should want to.
 
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The Exile

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Ecumenpolis should be a thing tall empires want to make and wide empires should ignore. Tall empires are so laughably weak in 3.0 because of pop growth scaling and ecus in particular suffer from it. So the problem isn't really the ecu it's that with pop growth scaling it can't get filled without Raiding or going wide which defeats the purpose of a planet you built to be worth more than a normal planet.

Tall empire's really should be able to increased their growth rate to compensate for not stealing them from other empires. I would additionally suggest that for ecus pop growth rate cap is doubbled and you can build a second pop assembly building (of the same type) this way your city planet grows much faster than the rural backwater planets. Cultural districts should also add a significant immigration pull, any pop that can move there should want to.
Yep. It would be nice if one could focus influence not on claiming or building systems, but on drawing xeno pops to settle in your far nicer worlds. Give the Pacifists a way to compete with the conquerors.
 

ezno

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Ecumenpolis should be a thing tall empires want to make and wide empires should ignore. Tall empires are so laughably weak in 3.0 because of pop growth scaling and ecus in particular suffer from it. So the problem isn't really the ecu it's that with pop growth scaling it can't get filled without Raiding or going wide which defeats the purpose of a planet you built to be worth more than a normal planet.

Tall empire's really should be able to increased their growth rate to compensate for not stealing them from other empires. I would additionally suggest that for ecus pop growth rate cap is doubbled and you can build a second pop assembly building (of the same type) this way your city planet grows much faster than the rural backwater planets. Cultural districts should also add a significant immigration pull, any pop that can move there should want to.
This could be a good addition, but I think that limiting wide empire to build Ecu with a huge influence cost (for specialisation) could make them only interesting for tall which have a lot of it. Also tall empire can only grow a few pops and usually don't steal them, so pops efficiency with Ecu could make them more competitive
 

GOLANX

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This could be a good addition, but I think that limiting wide empire to build Ecu with a huge influence cost (for specialisation) could make them only interesting for tall which have a lot of it. Also tall empire can only grow a few pops and usually don't steal them, so pops efficiency with Ecu could make them more competitive
Well that's the thing for the wide empires this ascension perk would be a skip, if players will skip ascension perks sometimes but not all of the times then players wont always run the same perks every time and will use perks that are appropriate for the playstyle they are going for.
 
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ezno

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Well that's the thing for the wide empires this ascension perk would be a skip, if players will skip ascension perks sometimes but not all of the times then players wont always run the same perks every time and will use perks that are appropriate for the playstyle they are going for.
Oh yes, and I think that specialisation should be locked behind the perk, to avoid wide empires which could find relics worlds to use them at their full potential (but relics worlds would still be valuable)