Majesty 3 -- with new game engine

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On a similar note, the heroes in Majesty almost never run away. They would almost always fight to their inevitable death. The heroes in Majesty 2 do run away when it's sensible to but usually end up dead anyway if they're facing a ranged opponent. Ultimately the ideal Majesty 3 for me would be a combination of the best elements of both games and a massive expansion on the sim element.

That is of course false and wrong. Heroes in Majesty run away a lot (Not only that, but they turn down missions when they assess it to be too dangerous)
It is based on their class and within their class on their intelligence. Usually their surname reflects their tendencies Sir Pants something would run away when a the brave something will not run away.
As a counterpart, heroes with high intelligence are apter at equipping themselves etc...

And so on and on as the same keeps being repeated and people even when shown wrong keep coming back with the same drivel.
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On a larger note, I truly wonder if a Majesty 3 with Majesty like heroes could be a success.

Most players tend to like to exert total control and Majesty was a game of influence. You have to adapt your gameplay to what it is coming on the game board and influence the process.

I check this with Victoria 2: many players are uncomfortable with having entities acting on their own, growing like an organic thing just by them and finally putting the players into a secondary position. In the end, these entities are living like hurtles to the player's desire of despotic hegemony, critters that delay the master plan or act against it in their stupidity.

My personal tastes would prefer this type of game where you channel more than direct a process. Yet, I cant remember of one game of this type that was a success. Save FM which is far from what it should be.

Save this one, all games providing influence over control gameplay experience seem to rebuke players.

A Majesty 3 expanding on Majesty would be awesome but with what audience? There is simply no audience for it (large enough to justify a developpment project)
 

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Wrong. The AI in Majesty 2 is not functional enough because it is limited to several commands that have a cycle that they follow. Walk around-go explore-go home. Walk around-bump into enemy-go buy new potion x-go home.

The priorities are tied by the engine to exact variables, instead of making those customizable. For example, "beast" attracts heroes strongly, while "hero" hardly ever triggers hostility. This is clearly seen from heroes of the opposite fractions walking near each other like people in the city park. The only way to cause them attack each other is to attack their lair (causes hostility) or walk directly into them (also causes hostility). While "beast" for example, attracts heroes practically from another map end.

Now, when we talk about enemy AI, there is no AI at all. there are linear commands that are executed by the program. Go-there. Attack-that-target. Wander. You may see how heroes run towards an attack flag, and ignore everything on their path, even monsters who run at your base (who by the way, have the same invisible attack flag, simply triggered by the attack command). It is so funny to watch lines of monsters and heroes passing through each other, sometimes bumping directly into each other, and keeping to roll on their own business.


This
 

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for me majesty 2 is a definite step backwards, the game is simplified so much that it destroys whole charm of the game. Do you remember that swinging a sword or aiming a bow didn't result as automatic hit? that made battles so much more intersting. and another thing the graphics - I really hate that cheesy, "fantasy cliche" graphic which is just so unimaginative and boring, it's like they made it for 5-year olds. I liked this dirty, raw graphics of majesty 1 much better.
 

cr4y88

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I own all and played all Majesty series. For me all of those series are awesome.
Well I don't like the opening map part in majesty 1, it doesn't make sense, imagine if you are a ranger, you sure don't want to travel alone the world. but you are in group, you will surely want, but too bad in Majesty 2, ranger don't do that so often.

Here is the list I think downside of Majesty :
1. We can't perform party. This is the best part of Majesty 2. Attacking a boss monster with party is so damn nice fight.
2. Like I mention, the ranger ability to travel without flag. In Majesty 2, I found it's more sense then the Majesty 1. Ranger like to travel but not always like to explore the flag.
3. Too many marketplace.
4. Trading post doesn't act like a trading post. Trading post needed to be built in a certain place. If you think of it, not all place is a good place to build a trading post. Same goes to temples.
5. In Majesty, we don't have the feature of increasing and decreasing speed. This new feature is awesome. I like it very much. Sometimes is just boring to wait into a certain days to complete the mission.
6. Lack of ad visor speech in a mission. In Majesty 2, the ad visor speak more often which I found that really cool. It feels like you are really a Majesty
7. This is the biggest downside. They don't have a proper Storyline compare to Majesty 2. For example : Majesty 2 is about the king regaining the position in Ardania fighting a Demon, Majesty 2 Kingmaker is about the return of the goblin. Majesty 2 Battle For Ardania is about the king defending the position again a mad man. Majesty 2 Monster Kingdom is about the king regaining the position fighting again the conclave.
I do know that they have secret mission that can be opened with every mission finished, but it doesn't like Majesty 2 who have a main storyline because some mission doesn't related to each other.
8. Fear Flag. Sometimes there is a part of map that they should stay away for a while.

Now the downside of Majesty 2:
1. The biggest downside for Majesty 2 is the easy way to create a mod sometimes ruin the game. You can easily put the xml file in the right folder and change the value, this sometimes make the game so easy.
2. Like I said at top, ranger as a leader of the group, should explore more often. If you are in a group, so you sure like to explore and have some good journey with a group.
3. Cleric is sometimes consider to heal the sick people, which is good but sometimes when the group already fighting, the cleric still healing. This I don't really like. They should reduce this.
4. Paladin with low health crying for help "You can help me", but still attacking the enemy instead of running, this I don't like
5. Range attack will still hit even though the target already run for a long distance. Doesn't make any sense at all.
6. In the latest expansion "Monster Kingdom", the speargoblin became shaman. this is wtf. he is a tank, he should become something else not shaman.
7. The AI Party need to be more sense. Need 1 Tank, 1 Healer, not all just ranger and rogues (I'm talking about the 2nd Mission about returning Lich King in Monster Kingdom Expansion)
8. More mission would be nice. Compare to the original game Majesty 2, the expansion is lack of mission.

That's the downside for both game based on my opinion.
I hope they make Majesty 3 or maybe(even though they already said the last) add an extra expansion with more interesting story and game features. I don't really care what they will look like, I'm buying and playing it for sure.

Ray
 
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cr4y88

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I want more Majesty be it similar to majesty 1 or Majesty 2 I don't care, I played both and had great time doing it and hope it will keep going. Still waiting for steam to release Battle of Ardania :(

Hey you should buy from gamersgate or other. I bought battle for ardania and monster kingdom from there, and it still works

for me majesty 2 is a definite step backwards, the game is simplified so much that it destroys whole charm of the game. Do you remember that swinging a sword or aiming a bow didn't result as automatic hit? that made battles so much more intersting. and another thing the graphics - I really hate that cheesy, "fantasy cliche" graphic which is just so unimaginative and boring, it's like they made it for 5-year olds. I liked this dirty, raw graphics of majesty 1 much better.

Well I like Majesty 2 graphic better than Majesty, because the graphic I found more smooth. The swinging a sword I found that majesty 2 smooth also.
Well I like more modern graphic then raw graphic. It's all about people taste.

For developer is a pain in the ass to work like player want, because we all got different taste. For me I will buy and play whatever the sequel of Majesty come out. Don't care what it's gonna be on Majesty 3.
 
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Spiderman

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3. Too many marketplace.

Not sure I understand this. You have as many as you want to build. I've only needed one.

4. Trading post doesn't act like a trading post. Trading post needed to be built in a certain place. If you think of it, not all place is a good place to build a trading post. Same goes to temples.

Don't get this either. If you think about it, you're clearing the land to build whatever. The only time when it might make sense that you can't build stuff is that scenario where you need that "Ground Strengthening Potion" before you can build whatever the scenario objective is.

5. In Majesty, we don't have the feature of increasing and decreasing speed.

I can do this under Options.

6. Lack of ad visor speech in a mission.

Advisor speaks plenty of times for me.
 

Nerdfish

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Majesty III needs to decide what sort of game it wish to be before the development begins, not half way through it.
btw, Sims medieval is going to be out in a month, I think it's a good idea to see if that game works (or doesn't) and learn something from it.
 

cr4y88

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Not sure I understand this. You have as many as you want to build. I've only needed one.
I know that only needed one, but to be able to make it, it makes the game sometimes, become really boring. In my opinion

Don't get this either. If you think about it, you're clearing the land to build whatever. The only time when it might make sense that you can't build stuff is that scenario where you need that "Ground Strengthening Potion" before you can build whatever the scenario objective is.
What I mean, that the trading post can be built as long as it's far enough from the marketplace, I found that it's not that good. Because not all "place" is the best place to built in. Meanwhile in Majesty 2, they have specific location, that I found it's more sense for me. By sense I'm talking about a real life. I know it's fantasy, but if you really have a kingdom you won't make a trading post unless it's a good position to make. just like the temples, I won't make them unless it's a good place (or the place is holy)

I can do this under Options.
Ah yes, I forgot about it. Then I take back this downside.

Advisor speaks plenty of times for me.
Yes, it's true. He speaks if you got low money and so on. This is not what I mean, if you finish a part of mission in Majesty, the advisor didn't speak but instead there is a quest scroll that you can read. In Majesty 2, Advisor speak directly.
 

Hassat Hunter

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@ cr4y88; I pretty much disagree with everything you said about MFKS.

Also, the speed and "advisor does not speak at end" are just plain wrong. Sure the scrolls are not spoken, but there is no end-speech in MFKS2 while there was in MFKS1, so overall you hear more of the advisor in the first Majesty. And his text is, sadly enough, a lot better :(.
 

Spiderman

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Nerdfish: I'd be interested in hearing your opinion about Sims Medieval.

I know that only needed one, but to be able to make it, it makes the game sometimes, become really boring. In my opinion

So being able to build as many as you want is a downside? Or just being able to survive with one Marketplace is a downside? I don't get it.

What I mean, that the trading post can be built as long as it's far enough from the marketplace, I found that it's not that good. Because not all "place" is the best place to built in. Meanwhile in Majesty 2, they have specific location, that I found it's more sense for me. By sense I'm talking about a real life. I know it's fantasy, but if you really have a kingdom you won't make a trading post unless it's a good position to make. just like the temples, I won't make them unless it's a good place (or the place is holy)

Pretty much the only place you should be building a Trading Post is in one of the corners of the map, to get the full benefit from it. Unless you just want quick gold so you build it as close as you are able. But I like the freedom of deciding where to build, rather than the map dictating it for me; to me, that's just an artificial way of making it so the rest of the map like lairs and stuff can be designed (and I think it was noted that it's one of the "features" that makes random maps difficult for Maj2).
 

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One can notice that Majesty is assessed outside its context, that is an eleven years old game.

This leads people to list improvements that are generic improvements made over the years. Knowledge is a cumulative process and through ten years, the game video industry has accumulated more how to do.

For example, the number of market places.
Majesty's period of time, modding was not well spread. Today, modding is part of the landscape. Quite a lot of genres must include modding opportunities.

So Majesty put no fixed limitations on markets building. You can build as 'much' as you are able to and you enforce your limitations through acts of will.
Today, the similar issue is to be tackled through modding. Leading to an ingame limitation. Modding will let you set the number of allowed market places. Shifting the burdern of enforcement from will to ingame mechanics.

It is a generic improvement that is not specific to Majesty 2. You can bring a wide variety of games made during the last two years and starts sentences like "What I prefer in X over Majesty is that you do not have an unlimited access to X as you have to markets in Majesty"

Half serious comparisons between the two games should abstract features that are not dependent on the context they were implemented.

In ten years, the video game industry will have accumulated even more how to do. A Majesty game, no matter how good it is, will benefit from generic improvements made during the next ten years.

Making the listing of them against Majesty or Majesty 2 irrelevant.
 

Hassat Hunter

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Actually, you can put a limit on Marketplaces (and pretty much EVERYTHING else) already in MFKS with the "building limitations" section in Freestyle and Multiplayer.
As such, not an improvement in MFKS2, since possible in MFKS already.

Next...
 

cr4y88

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Being able to make the more marketplace is a downside. Coz it's gonna be too easy money.
Trading post with specific place is better in my opinion.

Ray
 

cr4y88

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@ cr4y88; I pretty much disagree with everything you said about MFKS.

Also, the speed and "advisor does not speak at end" are just plain wrong. Sure the scrolls are not spoken, but there is no end-speech in MFKS2 while there was in MFKS1, so overall you hear more of the advisor in the first Majesty. And his text is, sadly enough, a lot better :(.
Hahaha that's depends. I like hearing the advisor speaking, rather that reading. It makes you feel like a real Majesty =)
For me I like MFKS 2 better because of the storyline and the graphic.

Oh yeah for MFKS 2 I forgot 1 downside. It's a feature that allow you play the game after the mission finished. MFKS2 don't have this
 

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That's generic improvements.

Most games are more voiced than they used 10 years ago.

Dragon's age is more voiced than Baldur's gate was. And most RPG games done today are more voiced than Baldur's gate and Majesty.

It is a generic improvement. All you state is that you like Majesty 2 better because it was coded ten years after Majesty.

Story line: well, Majesty leans toward simulation. Majesty 2 towards RTS.
Usually, RTS features a story lined campaign.
Commonly, simulations feature a collection of more or less disjuncted scenarios that give the player various situations to face.
 

Hassat Hunter

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MFKS2 hardly has a storyline either. It's pretty much missions like MFKS1 (several even look like them!) with more linear progression than was the case in MFKS1.

Where did that story went that I miss? Bar the last 2 missions sharing one?
 

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I keep reading through this thread and keep hearing the same arguments over and over.... I agree with a lot of what I read: In giving it more polish, you will loose some fans. You will loose some game play. There are a lot of games on the market today that over does it on the 'polish'. These games take so much effort in making. Take up too much room on the DVD. Take up too many resources on the machine... The longer a game is in development, the less it is worth. 'Polish' kills story. Look at most games made in the last thirty years, and my point will be proved. Who wants to pay $60 on a game they will beat in hours and play for a week before it collects dust.

My suggestions are (assuming a Majesty 3 is developed):
*Add a sandbox option (I enjoyed playing the maps, but was annoyed with beating the level and moving on).
*Choose a kingdom option What if I wanted to rule a kingdom of undead? Run over the humans with zombies and the elves with vampires. Terrorize the lands with a plague of skeletons. Or battle the undead legions with my mythical centaurs. Rape and pillage the humans with my harpies.... We can even get the druids in on the action and have a free for all against elementals and treants and giants!!
*War!! Pit two kingdoms against each other. I have no issues clearing my forest of those pesky elven tree hugger when I can send my vampire heroes out to feed. Keep my skeleton heroes in my kingdom to take care of those pesky sewer rats. But what happens when the blood dries? I move on to another land with more greedy dwarves and the same thing... Why not pit two kingdoms against each other in single player maps? They put a bounty on my high level werewolf! I will put a defend flag on him. Let the best heroes win!

*Better built towns The thing I love the most about games where I can choose to build what is setting up a great kingdom. Not just building randomly. But making it work and better yet, making it beautiful! Why can't I make roads? Plant trees and statues? Build a wall?
*Moral boosters I am the king! For the brave efforts of my fallen heroes, I dedicate this Hall of the Fallen!... Here is a statue! My people will love me!... To the man, a tavern. Drink and be merry!... My elven companions. Here is a forest in your honour!... A library for the wizards! A butcher for the dwarves!... I am your king! Love me! Fight for me!


I can keep coming up with many more, but then I would ask for a job.... Either way, we want more diversity without loosing what we loved. You can't make us all happy. but you can combine the play style of the first and second Majesty in an option called My Kingdom. Where all the brave kings and queens can protect their lands as we have all done before. For those of us who want to hold on to the originals but still crave more. We have the Kingdom Campaign option. Where we fight to claim the bountiful lands from our enemies. And after we beat the game! There is always the option Custom Kingdom. Where we can set the enemy; how often the endless random events occur. Each passing turn and the combined level of the heroes, random events become more and more powerful. Eventually we quite and start a new one or become over run and the King himself enters the Hall of the Fallen. Where our scores are posted on-line to see who is the best liege.
 

Spiderman

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Being able to make the more marketplace is a downside. Coz it's gonna be too easy money.
Trading post with specific place is better in my opinion.

Ray

That's like saying being able to place unlimited Guilds means you get so many heros, you can swamp the map. Or being able to place so many Libraries, you end up with very smart heros.

You end up with easy money with just one Marketplace.
 

cr4y88

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That's like saying being able to place unlimited Guilds means you get so many heros, you can swamp the map. Or being able to place so many Libraries, you end up with very smart heros.

You end up with easy money with just one Marketplace.

Well honestly, that's not the same in my opinion.
Dunno for me it's a downside but some people like it.
point is the majesty 3(if they make it) needed to be more challenging and more interesting in gameplay.

Ray