• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

MagnusStultus

Sergeant
1 Badges
Oct 12, 2015
62
57
  • Hearts of Iron III
Check your priviledges , bro. France is actually stunning and brave and beautiful and an example to us all!
Regarding resistance and whatnot ;-)

What does that have to do with King Leopold of Belgium; who rejected French Government request to go through his land to invade Germany in 39 during the battle of Poland; when invaded requested and received help only to then surrender to the Germans and screw over his "allies" during the first sign of a setback; and who became essentially excommunicated from the government which formed a government in exile and after the war was prevented from returning to Belgium?

The French underperformed because of bad officer decisions and an unwillingness to take risks in 1939, as far as resistance after occupation goes France was nothing exceptional; the Polish Home Army did a lot better by every metric than the French Resistance.
 
  • 1
  • 1
Reactions:

Ibn_Solmyr

Colonel
1 Badges
Mar 13, 2012
822
597
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
What does that have to do with King Leopold of Belgium; who rejected French Government request to go through his land to invade Germany in 39 during the battle of Poland; when invaded requested and received help only to then surrender to the Germans and screw over his "allies" during the first sign of a setback; and who became essentially excommunicated from the government which formed a government in exile and after the war was prevented from returning to Belgium?

The French underperformed because of bad officer decisions and an unwillingness to take risks in 1939, as far as resistance after occupation goes France was nothing exceptional; the Polish Home Army did a lot better by every metric than the French Resistance.

Wow, you seem quite bitter man. I don't want to enter your discussion, but Belgium refused that France pursue the building/improving of the Maginot line in late '30s.

Anway, please, for the second time, I would like we all stick to the topic, thanks.
 

jamesd

Colonel
22 Badges
Aug 23, 2009
1.083
1.247
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Victoria 2
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
well, that have two faults, first againstfrance were depoyed only reserve units, with poor training and not fuly equped, so frogs will have theoreticaly way easier to defeat them than in 44 if they realy wanted to fight. and even if these units will be able to delay them, it will be imposible for them to stop them, if frogs realy meaned to push to rhineland, onlyest way for germans to stop tehm will be to move units from poland, giving poles at least hope of defending, and way more imortantly,m it will show that frogs are honoring thier alliances, and not betraing them as they did.
and more importantly, if frogs realy pressed and theatened ruhr area with poles holding ground, tehre will be very lkikely coup against hitler wich will practicaly end war.

The German divisions deployed in the west were not "only reserve units with poor training and not fully equipped". At the start of the war they had 12 x 1st wave divisions, 10 x 2nd wave divisions, 12 x 3rd & 4th wave divisions plus border troops that were around the equivalent of another 4 divisions. The first wave divisions were composed of the current conscripts engaged in full time service while the 2nd wave divisions were composed of those troops that had completed their 2 years conscription and had been back in civilian life for no more than 2 years. These troops were the equivalent of the better French Divisions and were equipped with more modern weapons, as Germany had to rebuild almost their entire armament inventory between the wars while the French relied on large stocks of WW1 equipment. The men in the other divisions had still had some military training prior to war breaking out, and were generally younger and fitter than those in the French B Reserve Divisions, while still on the whole enjoying a qualitative edge in equipment over those divisions. All the divisions were fully equipped as Germany had not mobilised all their manpower reserves prior to war breaking out. It was only with the raising of the 7th Wave Divisions in late 1939 that significant equipment shortages become apparent, with only 24 x 105mm howitzers & 36 x 37mm AT guns assigned to each of those divisions, compared to the 36 x 105mm, 12 x 150mm & 75 x 37mm of the 1st wave divisions.

The French may have been able to launch a 1939 offensive into Germany, but it would have come at the cost of high casualties, made slow progress and would have been vulnerable to counter attack by the German forces redeploying from Poland after the successful campaign there. The western strategy was to weaken Germany through blockade while raising, training and equipping more troops, especially British, so that a successful offensive could be launched later.
 
  • 1
Reactions:

Czert

Lt. General
3 Badges
Mar 20, 2006
1.628
227
  • Europa Universalis III
  • 500k Club
  • Stellaris Sign-up
The German divisions deployed in the west were not "only reserve units with poor training and not fully equipped". At the start of the war they had 12 x 1st wave divisions, 10 x 2nd wave divisions, 12 x 3rd & 4th wave divisions plus border troops that were around the equivalent of another 4 divisions. The first wave divisions were composed of the current conscripts engaged in full time service while the 2nd wave divisions were composed of those troops that had completed their 2 years conscription and had been back in civilian life for no more than 2 years. These troops were the equivalent of the better French Divisions and were equipped with more modern weapons, as Germany had to rebuild almost their entire armament inventory between the wars while the French relied on large stocks of WW1 equipment. The men in the other divisions had still had some military training prior to war breaking out, and were generally younger and fitter than those in the French B Reserve Divisions, while still on the whole enjoying a qualitative edge in equipment over those divisions. All the divisions were fully equipped as Germany had not mobilised all their manpower reserves prior to war breaking out. It was only with the raising of the 7th Wave Divisions in late 1939 that significant equipment shortages become apparent, with only 24 x 105mm howitzers & 36 x 37mm AT guns assigned to each of those divisions, compared to the 36 x 105mm, 12 x 150mm & 75 x 37mm of the 1st wave divisions.

The French may have been able to launch a 1939 offensive into Germany, but it would have come at the cost of high casualties, made slow progress and would have been vulnerable to counter attack by the German forces redeploying from Poland after the successful campaign there. The western strategy was to weaken Germany through blockade while raising, training and equipping more troops, especially British, so that a successful offensive could be launched later.

for german vs frogs infantry equpment - booth nations main infantry weapon was pre wwii rifle, for germans 98k meaned karabine model 1898, similiar for frogs, submachine guns were more or less equal for booth nations (booth modern designs, while geman one was little more reliable), artilery was again more or less equal (german ones were true modern build, but they were just modernized versions of older ones with no significian performance gain, just more user friendly), onlyest advantage that germans have were in machineguns , thier mg34 was way better that frogs have. yeah, some german tanks were better than frogs ones (well, only pz4, pz 1+2 was crap and somua was better than pz3) , but no tank division against frogs at that time, and main advantage of german tanks division was in tactic and comman, not tanks designs.
why you think that frogs will have problems to advance in 39 to germany if they REALY wanted ? based on thier real performance ? well, that was because 99% of all thier officers from colonel up should be shoted for defetism or incopetence. frogs realy have manpower and strengt to do it, if they have competent leadership, but they didnt.
problem was that brits or frogs didt realy wanted to fight germans, ever, not in 38,39 or other time. for brits greater and more powerfull germany meaned counterweight to france power and frogs were terrified by figting again against germans. stategy to weaken gemany thought blokade was idiotic and doomed to fail from begining, how can you blockade land locked nation which dont import anything important via sea which can be interecpet ? even for roal navy it was imposilbe to block imports from scandinavia to germany during whole war, and as bonus how can you block germany which can import resorces via neutral italy or purely by land via balkan states, turkey or soviet union ?
and now why frogs should crush germans in west fast if they realy wanted :
1. frogs should deploy against germany practicaly whole thier army, as they didnt needed to guard much boarders agains spain or italy (in 1940 they comited against germany 94 from 114 divions), and now compare using of these 94 divions to numbefrs actualy used in 39 "offensive"
yes, they should suffer great causalties, but in end, they will be far lower than suffered during whole war as it happened , instead of ending it in 39.
and that blockade thing was just excuse for ruling politicans to justify thier stupid pre-war policy of apasment to germany when they called any oposition which warned about hitlers theat as warmongers and alarmists. after all, you will need time to build army when in war, if you builded it in peace time to be ready right ?
 
  • 2
Reactions:

Premu

Something is rotten in the state of Denmark
63 Badges
Feb 25, 2009
1.891
7.632
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Semper Fi
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Hearts of Iron II: Armageddon
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Knights of Honor
  • Prison Architect
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Victoria 2
  • Warlock: Master of the Arcane
  • 500k Club
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
for german vs frogs infantry equpment - booth nations main infantry weapon was pre wwii rifle, for germans 98k meaned karabine model 1898, similiar for frogs, submachine guns were more or less equal for booth nations (booth modern designs, while geman one was little more reliable), artilery was again more or less equal (german ones were true modern build, but they were just modernized versions of older ones with no significian performance gain, just more user friendly), onlyest advantage that germans have were in machineguns , thier mg34 was way better that frogs have. yeah, some german tanks were better than frogs ones (well, only pz4, pz 1+2 was crap and somua was better than pz3) , but no tank division against frogs at that time, and main advantage of german tanks division was in tactic and comman, not tanks designs.
why you think that frogs will have problems to advance in 39 to germany if they REALY wanted ? based on thier real performance ? well, that was because 99% of all thier officers from colonel up should be shoted for defetism or incopetence. frogs realy have manpower and strengt to do it, if they have competent leadership, but they didnt.
problem was that brits or frogs didt realy wanted to fight germans, ever, not in 38,39 or other time. for brits greater and more powerfull germany meaned counterweight to france power and frogs were terrified by figting again against germans. stategy to weaken gemany thought blokade was idiotic and doomed to fail from begining, how can you blockade land locked nation which dont import anything important via sea which can be interecpet ? even for roal navy it was imposilbe to block imports from scandinavia to germany during whole war, and as bonus how can you block germany which can import resorces via neutral italy or purely by land via balkan states, turkey or soviet union ?
and now why frogs should crush germans in west fast if they realy wanted :
1. frogs should deploy against germany practicaly whole thier army, as they didnt needed to guard much boarders agains spain or italy (in 1940 they comited against germany 94 from 114 divions), and now compare using of these 94 divions to numbefrs actualy used in 39 "offensive"
yes, they should suffer great causalties, but in end, they will be far lower than suffered during whole war as it happened , instead of ending it in 39.
and that blockade thing was just excuse for ruling politicans to justify thier stupid pre-war policy of apasment to germany when they called any oposition which warned about hitlers theat as warmongers and alarmists. after all, you will need time to build army when in war, if you builded it in peace time to be ready right ?

The country is called "France", and the people "French". Is there any reason you only use the insulting term "Frogs" to speak of the French people?
 
  • 8
Reactions:

Lifthrasil

Pizza Annihilator
33 Badges
Jun 12, 2012
573
1.072
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Semper Fi
  • Magicka
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Prison Architect
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Cities: Skylines
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
The country is called "France", and the people "French". Is there any reason you only use the insulting term "Frogs" to speak of the French people?
I found it funny when he used it the first few times, but I'm also getting annoyed by the constant usage of demeaning language against a specific country.
Probably because he
a) thinks it sounds badass or
b) his nationalism got hurt when Germany steamrolled his country (czechoslovakia?) and the french didn't step in to help.

Anyway, insulting nationalities in a manner of good fun and irony is ok (it's a game/forum about WW2 at last), but overdoing it is really a no-no (since we are all adult people, or should be).
 
  • 1
  • 1
Reactions:

Ibn_Solmyr

Colonel
1 Badges
Mar 13, 2012
822
597
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
The country is called "France", and the people "French". Is there any reason you only use the insulting term "Frogs" to speak of the French people?

I found it funny when he used it the first few times, but I'm also getting annoyed by the constant usage of demeaning language against a specific country.
Probably because he
a) thinks it sounds badass or
b) his nationalism got hurt when Germany steamrolled his country (czechoslovakia?) and the french didn't step in to help.

Anyway, insulting nationalities in a manner of good fun and irony is ok (it's a game/forum about WW2 at last), but overdoing it is really a no-no (since we are all adult people, or should be).

Maybe he's just envious of our food useness to actually eat frogs... ;)

Anyway, if some people aren't adults enough to respect other nationalities in this corrupted thread, I will ask for some modders to just close it.
 
  • 2
Reactions:

MagnusStultus

Sergeant
1 Badges
Oct 12, 2015
62
57
  • Hearts of Iron III
Wow, you seem quite bitter man. I don't want to enter your discussion, but Belgium refused that France pursue the building/improving of the Maginot line in late '30s.

Anway, please, for the second time, I would like we all stick to the topic, thanks.

Not entering a conversation is incompatible with insulting people thank you; I would insult you back if it was in compliance with paradox forum rules; but I will say nobody insulted anybody else; Klausewitz pointed out Belgian intransigence towards France and how it undermined the attempt to stop Germany.

Please go back to the last page anyone who thinks that insult has any correspondence to what was said; people who show up to say check your privelege/oh so your saying it is Belgium's fault; DEFEND YOUR POSITION WITH FACTS DAM IT.

The fact is the French under performed; name one historian who doubts that; Belgium actively thwarted French attempts to help Poland (source Strange Victory) which is why the theoretical discussion was about trying to breach the Siegfried Line.

If you don't want to discuss history don't enter history related threads and restrict yourself to purely game mechanic ones.
 

Had a dad

V g H
Moderator
213 Badges
Sep 5, 2008
25.572
3.578
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • 500k Club
  • Paradox Order
  • Crusader Kings II: Limited Collectors Edition
  • 200k Club
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Victoria 2 Beta
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Diplomacy
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • PDXCON 2017 Standard Ticket holder
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Prison Architect
  • VtM - Bloodlines 2
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings III Referal
  • PDXCon 2019 "Baron"
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Rome Gold
  • Elven Legacy
  • Elven Legacy Collection
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
any further derogatory "nationalistic" terms while writing will result in an infraction and expulsion from this thread

Either use country names / plurality of the populas (England / English) or HOI3 tags are fine (all caps) GER FRA ENG USA POL JAP etc
 

Lifthrasil

Pizza Annihilator
33 Badges
Jun 12, 2012
573
1.072
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Semper Fi
  • Magicka
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Prison Architect
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Cities: Skylines
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
removed - Had a dad

The fact is the French under performed; name one historian who doubts that; Belgium actively thwarted French attempts to help Poland (source Strange Victory) which is why the theoretical discussion was about trying to breach the Siegfried Line.

If you don't want to discuss history don't enter history related threads and restrict yourself to purely game mechanic ones.

I agree. France could invade Germany either through Belgium or through the Siegfried Line. They were not willing to do either, since the Belgians refused to let them pass. France should have either took the losses the Siegfried Line meant, or ignore Belgian souvereignty. But who knows what reasons people back then had to decide the way they did.

Regarding the Topic: I think everything that could be said about Maginot Line has alread been said.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

MagnusStultus

Sergeant
1 Badges
Oct 12, 2015
62
57
  • Hearts of Iron III
I agree. France could invade Germany either through Belgium or through the Siegfried Line. They were not willing to do either, since the Belgians refused to let them pass. France should have either took the losses the Siegfried Line meant, or ignore Belgian souvereignty. But who knows what reasons people back then had to decide the way they did.

Regarding the Topic: I think everything that could be said about Maginot Line has alread been said.


My mistake then; my terrible and stupid mistake. Tone/intent are sometimes hard to get across on the internet forgive me for misinterpreting then? :p

I agree with you both on French course of action although if Klausewitz returns a contradictory informed opinion on why someone else who researched the same event says you are wrong is always interesting.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Had a dad

V g H
Moderator
213 Badges
Sep 5, 2008
25.572
3.578
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • 500k Club
  • Paradox Order
  • Crusader Kings II: Limited Collectors Edition
  • 200k Club
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Victoria 2 Beta
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Diplomacy
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Field Marshal
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • PDXCON 2017 Standard Ticket holder
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Prison Architect
  • VtM - Bloodlines 2
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings III Referal
  • PDXCon 2019 "Baron"
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Rome Gold
  • Elven Legacy
  • Elven Legacy Collection
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
Since my previous post might have left it open to people thinking they should continue with the OT, No more OT, no more flaming.
 

ccruler

Second Lieutenant
120 Badges
Oct 6, 2002
115
34
Visit site
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Leviathan: Warships
  • March of the Eagles
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Naval War: Arctic Circle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Sengoku
  • Ship Simulator Extremes
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Sword of the Stars II
  • Supreme Ruler: Cold War
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • 500k Club
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Commander: Conquest of the Americas
  • Darkest Hour
  • East India Company
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For the Motherland
  • Gettysburg
I don't know about the state of the french army in Sept. 1939, but
you want to tell us that the whole standing french army (supported by huge reserves, even if they were untrained) was unable to attack a barely fortified position in western Germany, while most of the best German troops were in Poland? And all France had to do was to advance a few hundred km and take the industrialized Rhineland. Take also in consideration, that even if WW1 was already over for 20 years, there were A LOT of men in France who earned combat experience back then. So it wouldn't even have been total Newbz.

The French and British just dicked out of upholding Polish independence. A few thousand dead french soldiers could have prevented millions dieing in WW2.
Something to note is that the French did launch an offensive in 1939, however it was a very half-hearted offensive where they stopped after only a few km inside German territory. They did however suffer a couple thousand casualties in the operation. In the end, they were ordered to withdraw back to the Maginot Line. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saar_Offensive