Machiavelli III (beta discussions)

[Damocles]

Damo,

And Peter was given Italian...

A move you supported, if I recall.

The real question is whether Aldo is willing to beat the hell out of Forza, and whether Forza will consider his inheritance "Hungary," as in the spare provinces he picks up automatically, or the Crown of Hungary and all its subjects.

I s'pose I could settle the question and play the Turk myself...

Well, HG. I have said quite loudly that giving Austria italian was the biggest mistake I ever supported in a MP game.

Maybe we should play Austria and OE. lol. Though, I suppose that depends if Forzaa and Mulletboy are happy with France and Venice.

 

[HolisticGod]

Damo,

And I, on the other hand, have often said that the Italian culture grant to Austria ruined Mach I... Perhaps I ought to think it over a bit.

If we played Austria and the OE and could get Slargos in Poland we'd have a good chance of seeing the historical conflicts and then some... But I took France instead of the Ottomans because I'm tired of the east and I've done them twice in the past three months.

Still, Italy, at the very least, should be interesting.

 

[Slargos]

Damo,

And I, on the other hand, have often said that the Italian culture grant to Austria ruined Mach I... Perhaps I ought to think it over a bit.

If we played Austria and the OE and could get Slargos in Poland we'd have a good chance of seeing the historical conflicts and then some... But I took France instead of the Ottomans because I'm tired of the east and I've done them twice in the past three months.

Still, Italy, at the very least, should be interesting.

Bull. We'd see an unhistorical alliance between Austria, Russia and OE. Buggers.

 

[Damocles]

Bull. We'd see an unhistorical alliance between Austria, Russia and OE. Buggers.

lol. Did you get the christmas card, slargy?

 

[Slargos]

lol. Did you get the christmas card, slargy?

Yes, and I am still looking for hidden messages. Maybe if I blow it up 1000%... :rofl:

 

[Damocles]

Yes, and I am still looking for hidden messages. Maybe if I blow it up 1000%... :rofl:

lol. I was considering doing that. But didn't want to ruin the spirit of Christmas. :rofl:

 

[ForzaA]

I s'pose I could settle the question and play the Turk myself...

I think I'd be willing to sacrifice German culture to prevent that :rofl:

The real question is [snip]whether Forza will consider his inheritance "Hungary," as in the spare provinces he picks up automatically, or the Crown of Hungary and all its subjects.

hmm, I guess that depends a tad bit on the situation, but my intent is to reach 1800 borders (ie. drive the Turk back to constantinople, AND BEYOND )
OTOH I might have to be happy with the Festung Wien

 

[Norrefeldt]

I'm with Damocles in the culture setup, no handing out new cultures.
Generally, I think we should try to adhere as much as possible to PE's next setup, it might include most of what has been discussed here anyway and the rest gets solved by someone not included in our game. It's also worth quite a lot to have this scenario tested, the best MP scenario for the full game that we got (?). There are a lot of experienced players in our group, so our testing is indeed worth something.

 

[unmerged(5394)]

Hi there everyone,

I just got back from my well deserved vacation only to find out that I'll have a new neighbour in the north (HG as France) ))),

anyway a few comments on HG's rules and guidelines: generally they seem quiet all right to me, however it did not escape my attention that it is actually Spain that is hurt by the most (rather infavourable) changes. :-(( I think we should reconsider at least some of them (especially concerning the ownership of some of the Carrebian islands)

as for giving the OE and Austria further cultures, well I completly agree with Damo, no need for that, it has absolutely no justification either for game-balencing nor for historical reasons (we Hungarians fought both the Turks and the Austrians constantly after Mohács, thus apart from a small period in the second half of the XVIIIth century we had a "war of independence" each and every 2 decade)

 

[HolisticGod]

Attila,

There were zero changes made that exclusively affect Spain.

The rest are suggestions and I think from an historical perspective there isn't much argument against them. But if there's a reason, as you say, to leave the Spanish in control of nearly the entire Carribean and give them an easy time with the Dutch, speak up.

Still plenty of time before the game starts.

Mnorre,

I agree, in principle.

But there are a few things I think we need to implement whether they end up in PE 1520 or not, particularly RR for the Low Countries (at least after 1530), reduced Spanish presence in the new world and larger forts in Germany.

All,

On a related note, what are general thoughts about culture and religion switching captured colonies under five thousand between sessions?

Or even setting a higher population threshold. It might encourage real colonial hand changing, it isn't too much work if players contribute the IDs themselves and, frankly, anything at all that creates a more realistic scene overseas is worth the trouble.

 

[ForzaA]

On a related note, what are general thoughts about culture and religion switching captured colonies under five thousand between sessions?

Or even setting a higher population threshold.

culture: already happens for <5000
religion: could be argued, but I doubt that stopped anyone in previous Machi's

higher limit: here we might have something that has some use.. mostly when colonies reached 5000 they suddenly became a lot less interesting(except the very rich, that is)

 

[HolisticGod]

Forza,

Culture switching happens at five thousand.

What I'm talking about is changing culture and religion between sessions, so that 1500 brave souls in Barbados don't keep charge of the colonial government until there are 3500 people to oppose them.

 

[devil]

Forza,

Culture switching happens at five thousand.

What I'm talking about is changing culture and religion between sessions, so that 1500 brave souls in Barbados don't keep charge of the colonial government until there are 3500 people to oppose them.

Uhm I don't know, if barbados was captured as soon as nationalism fades it converts, I could go for religion change, but again only after nationalism fades.

 

[HolisticGod]

Devil,

Thirty years.

It's too long. The idea is to encourage colonial wars, as in this period they changed hands without much trouble rather frequently.

 

[Slargos]

Forza,

Culture switching happens at five thousand.

What I'm talking about is changing culture and religion between sessions, so that 1500 brave souls in Barbados don't keep charge of the colonial government until there are 3500 people to oppose them.

No. Culture switching happens UNDER 5k but AFTER nationalism has faded.

If the pop goes above 5k BEFORE nationalism fades, NO culture change.

 

[HolisticGod]

Slargos,

More proof of my rather extensive ignorance of the game and its underworkings.

And more reason to do it by hand.

 

[Damocles]

Personally.

I think culture and religious changes should happen for any colony, regardless of size. After 30 years of nationalism. I.E, if its not retaken by then, its pretty firmly in the hands of the new conquerer.

 

[ForzaA]

"any colony" is every newly founded city? or everything <5000 ? or something else?

after nationalism fades, sounds good, so on average 2 sessions or so.

 

[HolisticGod]

Forza,

I think he means any province colonized by Europeans, regardless of size.

Which is not a bad idea, if it's post-nationalism. If it's immediate, it's too much work.

 

[ForzaA]

Forza,

I think he means any province colonized by Europeans, regardless of size.

Which is not a bad idea, if it's post-nationalism. If it's immediate, it's too much work.

okidoki

I think I can agree on that, and if you're willing to do the work..

what about converted pagans?